In Closing: My Response to Ben’s Response to My Response to Ben’s ‘Rap is Crap’
by Tim SlagleMy friend Jane’s church has two services every week. The Sunday service is called the Seeker Service. It’s light, and the focus is on music and the positive aspects of religion. Sometimes they even have an entertaining play as part of the service. The Wednesday service is when the fundamentalist gospel happens; the hardcore stuff that might chase away new converts still questioning their faith. The concept has been hugely successful and these churches boast millions of members nationwide.
I look at Big Hollywood as a Seeker site. We are here to attract people questioning their politics, and welcome them into the philosophy we call Conservatism. We want to be a political home for those strays: people who are uncomfortable with all the flags and Greek columns that the Left has recently embraced. We want to support the new stars of Hollywood, those who have suddenly found themselves in a tax bracket they never thought they could reach, and are suddenly questioning the injustice of a progressive tax code. We want to comfort those who have grown tired of being called a racist for simply questioning the wisdom of putting a community organizer into the most powerful office on earth.
Let’s assume you are right. Let’s assume rap is awful, and nihilist and destructive to the African American community So for the sake of argument, I agree with you. Rap IS crap. Now what? Exactly what is the role of a political party now that we have such information? Do we work with the FCC to keep it off the air? Do we boycott stores that sell it? Do we file class action lawsuits against the producers of rap, on behalf of the ruined urban communities? Do we prosecute rappers for conspiring to crimes? Do we BAN it?
You see, that is the problem. All these tactics are different levels of censorship; something we, as sworn guardians of the inalienable rights of man, are supposed to abhor. There is no political solution to rap. Taking on popular music, marginalizes ourselves further from the mainstream. There should be a corner of our tent where rappers feel welcome.
If you had to create a list of reasons why people in Hollywood do not like Republicans, I’m fairly certain that right near the top would be a fear that Republicans want to censor art. There’s a rumor on the Left we are intolerant and want to muzzle free speech. The ironic truth, is the Left is far more active towards political censorship, with their speech codes on college campuses and support of the fairness doctrine. But as far as art, the Left is pretty tolerant.
It is that atmosphere of artistic freedom that finds most artists at home under their tent. And as long as we appear hostile to art, that is never going to change.
And don’t try and tell me that rap is not art. The passions that have been wakened on either side of the argument here, are ample evidence that there is something about the form, that stirs quite a bit of emotion-which is nearly a textbook definition of art.
50 Cent had conservative leanings,. He thought Kanye went too hard on President Bush and is an admitted capitalist. Now there is some serious common ground.
[Ed. Note: previous posts on this subject below]:
Ben Shapiro: Rap is Crap
Tim Slagle: Response to Ben Shapiro’s ‘Rap is Crap’
Ben Shapiro: Response To Tim Slagle’s Response To ‘Rap is Crap’
Michael Wilson: My Contribution to the In-Fighting: Rap Isn’t Crap
Email this to a friend | Print |
Share on Facebook
| Tweet this
| 
Follow Us on Twitter
Subscribe via RSS
Got a Tip?
107 Comments
All I want is the freedom to say that Rap is crap without being called a racist reactionary. How's that for starters? Yes, on this site that will not happen, but just about anywhere other than on a conservative site., that is the inevitable result. That goes for Mapplethorpe's pornography, the piss christ, etc., etc., ad infinitum. Let me add in that I don't want to be forced to pay for it as well. If some poor starving artist must create in order to salve the angst of his tortured soul, then let them pay for it, i'm not interested.
So, with regard to you and Ben…He's the DJ, you're the Rapper?
Therein lies the problem.
When a liberal complains about something, they almost ALWAYS follow up their complaint with "…and here's the legislation we've proposed to ban the offensive thing." The difference is that conservatives just want an open dialog about culture. When we see something happening we don't like, we talk about it. We kvetch about it. We whine and moan about it. But we generally DON'T run off demanding that the government ban it. Remember it was Al Gore's wife that was pushing for censorship of music.
The problem with liberals is that for them government is the solution to ALL problems, so when they hear a conservative complain about a problem they assume the conservative is promoting more government action (since that's what THEY would be doing).
What do we do about rap? Simple, we keep pointing out the elements of it that are damaging to the culture, we don't heap phony praise on the "geniuses" that make the crap just for the sake of being PC and we encourage people to get involved with more positive things.
Bollocks. Leftist art IS political. Crucifixes in urine, paintings of the Virgin Mary covered in dung, photographs of men with bullwhips in their bottoms. ALL designed to "subvert the dominant paradigm" to throw out truth, beauty and faith and replace them with repugnance, lies and death. They would have no problem using force of government to ban artwork that celebrates Christ or capitalism or America.
He also said there's no way Obama will last long before whites assassinate him.
See my previous post, to my previous post, referring to my original post. Thanks (obamaspeak)
Ditto. Me too.
Rap is largely cultural junk food in my humble opinion. Holding the opinion that rap is crap is no different to me than saying that food from McDonald's is unhealthy (crap). Sure, you can debate the point by mentioning that a lot of people love it and that they have salads and diet drinks and that it has had a serious cultural impact all you want, but are you really trying to convince me that it isn't garbage, or yourself?
As for whether or not it is art, some poeple can pee on a picture of Jesus and call it art, and that stirs passions as well, so you can literally say that taking a piss is art if you want to argue that point.
If rappers want to be Republicans, hooray for them. It doesn't mean Republicans have to embrace rap.
Carry on.
so did jesse ventura.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/april2008/04...
"Bollocks. Leftist art IS political. Crucifixes in urine, paintings of the Virgin Mary covered in dung, photographs of men with bullwhips in their bottoms. ALL designed to "subvert the dominant paradigm" to throw out truth, beauty and faith and replace them with repugnance, lies and death. They would have no problem using force of government to ban artwork that celebrates Christ or capitalism or America. "
You nailed that to the wall. Nothing — NOTHING — is non-political for the left. They don't even have ordinary human compulsions when it comes to producing art — creating beauty, transcending mortality, making life easier to bear, all that kind of motivation that somehow got Bach and Michelangelo through the day. To them, art is just a tool to tear down structures — religion, family, society — that might stand in the way of their will to power. The goal of power, after all, is more power.
Like all other artistic enterprises, rap music will sink or swim depending on the public's appetite for it. It seemed insatiable for a while, but it's overarching simplicity is both it's greatest strength and weakness.
Not having the melody structure that is necessary to remain classic, it is already metastasizing into techno, or hip hop… culturally it is what it is and one can take it or leave it. Michael Steele (head of RNC) wants to bring conservative messages to rap, one can only wish him luck and Godspeed…
Tim, you're completely right. Rap is crap, but nothing should be done about it beyond pointing it out. Ben has the right to his opinion, and the right to express it as he sees fit. The talent-free (I'm sorry, rhyming is not really a talent) are also free to disagree.
Even expressions of "art" that are considered garbage by most people who don't worship sneakers must be protected. As I've quoted before: "He that would make his liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty, he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."- Thomas Paine
Or as Voltaire said: "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. "
word.
Tim, why is it you always seem to have just one comment that I disagree with?
Now what? Exactly what is the role of a political party now that we have such information? Do we work with the FCC to keep it off the air? Do we boycott stores that sell it? Do we file class action lawsuits against the producers of rap, on behalf of the ruined urban communities? Do we prosecute rappers for conspiring to crimes? Do we BAN it?
,,,All these tactics are different levels of censorship
everything else on the list qualifies as censorship and we should not engage in, nor do I think anyone on BH has suggested, except for the one in bold.
It's "free market" tactics. It's the same thing that many of us do in regards to certain actors and refuse to go to their movies… we're not stopping them from making the product, but we're not going to help move the product off the shelves.
Of course, the left will accuse us of the rest of the items on the list, even if we never do it…
In the spirit of furthering understanding I offer
benandryan . com Freestyle Rap Battle: Translated
and
understandrap . com
enjoy.
Rap is crap.
Crack is whack.
I love rhymes like these!
"of a progressive tax code" I disagree, our present tax code is regressive" So, once again I say Fair Tax. This is the most progressive tax idea yet.
Tim Slagel, you are using straw men arguments in your article. I dont see any conservative saying it should be illegal, banned or boycotted (other than not buying that crap of your own free will). So dont start sounding like a liberal that argues against straw men of your own making. Yes, rap is crap, yes is damages the black community. Yes too is that it is fine to remain legal, as long as what they do is legal. However, it is more wrong to sit back and say nothing about the disease that we know as rap.
This is where I pick a bone. Leftists are always quick to shout at the Right about "legislating morality" when issues like this come up. I understand that you aren't so much defending them as worrying that we have the "legislating morality" camp to worry about, but you have to understand that the Right is not the camp that brings up the Fairness Doctrine or its ideological bill-child whatever it may come to be called. The Right does not actively promulgate PC Speech codes on college campuses, nor do we get hate speech laws passed.
We may complain about something like the moral sewer that the lyrics of many gangsta rap songs have become, but I have not seen any commenter call for the banning of the form. We have debated its merits, and whether or not it should be legitimately considered art. There is a difference, and you should at least stand for that difference rather than apologize for it.
The Republican Party is a Conservative Party. You're welcome to bring whatever you have of Conservatism to the party. Leave the rest at home. After all, you don't wear your tails and spats to a Superbowl Party, why should you expect to bring your liberal opinions to a conservative party?
I confess/you need to be/apropriate-lee/d-dressed/else you would be/a fat mess….
So I welcome rappers to the Party.
And sir, the Left will lie about the Right. It does little good to try to hide from their attacks. One might as well go out on the field of battle and meet them.
Someone's been listening to Neal Boortz
Isn't it interesting that no one did call for banning rap? That says a lot about the people here. I can't see any of the droolers over at Hufpo having a similar debate (on whatever topic) without half of them calling for a ban.
The FCC has no right to do anythiing, but make sure that the stations don't clash due to technical parameters. You both have valid points, but I side with Ben. When the Sugar Hill Gang started this thing, it was amusing and funky. But now all I hear is ranting from a disenfranchised society with no relevence to me.
I have to say, I've enjoyed reading Ben and Tim's articles and the additional piece presented by Michael Wilson as well. There has been some healthy discussion by commenters as a result of the issue raised in Ben's original piece. Bravo for that.
This is *all* good. It is one of the reasons why I believe Big Hollywood is so important. For my money, the quality of work by those who contribute combined with the insightful, passionate discourse from those who comment, make BH the place to be.
As Andrew Breitbart stated from the get go…'pop culture is the big prize'. As long as we can continue to keep our focus and remember how the game is played…We will win.
Hear Hear! Big Neal-Fair Tax-Fair Tax Yeah!
Nah, Neal's on when i'm at work. I have read both Fair Tax books, I check out fairtax.org almost everyday, I've read the legislation and I bring up the issue every time I hear the word 'tax.' It's my cause. Regardless of party all tax payers should stand up and say… FAIR TAX!!!!!! I've been working on converts here in the office and i work with a ton of lefty loonies.
Even though loathe and detest rap I would NEVER call for "banning" it.
I WOULD, however, like to institute a ban on liberals.
Does that make me a bad person?
The only fair tax is a flat tax. No loopholes, deductions, credits, off shore shelters. Every bit of income at say 10% from Bill Gates down to poor people like say, uh ME!
Keep our focus–good point. What, though, to focus on? Rap music, or getting a competent person in the White House? I don't see any accord within the party on either issue.
You fair tax people. Come on. If we simplify the tax code, how will the government run people's lives for them? Besides, if we make the tax system so simple that even Charlie Rangle can understand it, how will the Obama people claim ignorance the next time they underpay their taxes? It's just not practical.
Exactly Andrew, let it die a slow, inevitable death. Is Michael "Jacko" Jackson dominating the charts? No. Does Glenn Miller fill the airwaves and jukeboxes of America? Not anymore. The next big thing is always just around the corner, let's hope it doesn't glorify killing policemen and beating women and hating white people.
I agree completely. I think this has been interesting and it's definitely the kind of debate we should be having — at the intersection of politics and culture.
Also, I can't help but notice that this whole debate seems to have brought in a lot of new faces.
And even if some conservatives do want to ban rap, the rest of us ain't going along with it. My opinion of rap hasn't changed one iota since this whole debate started, and I've listened and read carefully. But "ban" and "censor" are fighting words to me. I think a lot of rap (and yes, mostly I mean gangsta rap) is mind-numbingly dreadful (my opinion, not some sort of scientific "fact'). So what? Unless and until it becomes a clear and present danger by the strictest constitutional standard, I'll defend to the death people's rights to produce it and listen to it. Well, maybe not to the death, but I'll take a few healthy bruises over it.
On the other hand, the concept of banning liberals is a concept I can get my mind around.
I always wonder why this form of entertainment is pushed so hard by the media when they know that they're not making that much money from it. We're being directed there for some reason.
Pushing the envelope for the left is "pricking the colostomy bag" for the right.
Being conservative is like being a Christian. Either you believe or you don't. If you do, you recognise the problem with violent music that degrades women. (While that does't include all RAP, it is the face of it.)
See now… I'd say that identifying a genre, either of entertainment or of food!, as "crap" is short-sighted at the very least if not simply wrong. Granted, you said "largely". Pretty much "largely" everything is crap. No? Gems are found in the oddest places, at McDonald's or in category Romance novels or video games… and defining some entire category as crap suggests that there are entire categories that are not. And how silly is that?
The definition of worthy modern art, music and literature seems to be the degree to which the audience is self-limiting to the correct sort of people. If something appeals to the masses, if it touches some elemental aspect of humanity, then it's crap.
I appreciated the diversity of opinion expressed by the authors of this web-site over this issue. There is a whole lot of diversity in the comments, too.
What better example of inclusiveness? No lock-step, no harsh conformity required.
This is a good thing.
"And even if some conservatives do want to ban rap, the rest of us ain't going along with it."
Here's the thing: "the rest of [you]" are a tiny minority of what passes for the "conservative" movement in America. Most of y'all are engaged, intelligent and thoughtful about politics – the majority of humanity, well, ISN'T. Sturgeon's Law and all that. We live in a world populated mostly by functioning-morons, dragged across the goalposts of evolution by the 5-to-10% of the species that has ideas and takes action.
As such, MOST "conservatives" are not engaged, intelligent and thoughtful about politics – because they're IDIOTS who have a few personal gripes/issues/causes – mostly 'traditionalist' social issues – that they know "conservatives" are supposed to support and so thats what they call themselves when asked. By the same token, MOST "liberals" are ALSO idiots who're only claim the label because they think "liberal" just means being NOT for 'traditionalism.'
(continued)__I can damn near garauntee you that MOST of the bright young things who voted so enthusiastically for Obama couldn't tell you what capitalism-v-socialism is about or which 'side' their adopted philosophy is closer to – they're "liberals" because they're for abortion rights, gay marriage, etc. and those are (to them) the defining characteristics of "liberalism." And before anyone snickers, remember that (most of) your beloved Republican "base" went INSANE this past election not for the War Hero, but for Sara Palin. Why? Her politics? Her grasp of free-market economics? Hardly. But she said "God" a lot, so they lapped it up.
For me, focus means not getting sidetracked/distracted in attacking each other when debate such as the one generated by Ben and Tim's articles occurs. There have been some very good points made on both sides of the issue and for the most part comments have reflected them as such. It can only benefit those of us who would like to see conservatives make in roads as we set about in changing the perception with those who wish to paint us all with the same old brush.
We have a tremendous opportunity @ Big Hollywood to use this forum to attract others, especially those who may have differing points of view.
To me, that's the beauty of Ben and Tim's debate. We're on the same team, we may disagree, but ultimately we can find ways to conduct ourselves with intregrity and passion during the discourse.
One last thing…to Ben and Tim and Michael…thanks guys.
I disagree. It comes to the core of one's ideology regarding taxes. With the present tax code and the flat tax, we still have to deal with the fact that our money, we work for, is taken before we even see it. This means we work for the government. When income taxes are abolished (along with the IRS) it will mean the government will work for us as it should be. BTW, those loop holes, credits, deductions and off shore shelters are completely unnecessary under the Fair Tax. Look it up, you'll see what I mean.
Exactly. In fact I think a really bright spot light should shined on rap. Lets see the nuts and bolts of this multi-billion $ industry. Does it in fact incite violence? I can't say that it does. Does it promote misogyny? Let's find out. If you play it backwards do you start to walk, talk and dress like Steve Urkel from "Family Matters"? These are profound questions that answering
====remember that (most of) your beloved Republican "base" went INSANE this past election not for the War Hero, but for Sara Palin. Why? Her politics? Her grasp of free-market economics? Hardly. But she said "God" a lot, so they lapped it up.====
The level of vacuous drivel in your post was very impressive. Let me see if I can make this clear for you; the war hero you referred to is a quisling sellout. He called those of us that want a wall on the southern border racists, he insulted Americans by saying they wouldn’t pick lettuce for $50 an hour, he authored anti-free speech legislation, he acknowledged that he’s an economic illiterate [just like obama], he soiled his pants over waterboarding, etc. Also remember, Benedict Arnold was a decorated soldier.
Palin on the other hand held true Conservative convictions and is very knowledgeable in energy policy.
Bob.. here's one where we agree it seems in general theory with Sturgeon's law, and the uninformed electorate. Although I think you're wrong on the fact that "we" (the thought-out Conservatives) are the minority of the Conservatives.. we're the (IMO) silent majority.
But again, let's not forget its' the Alphabet Media that pushes out McCain and Spectre and the other "CINOs" as the face of the conservative party… so even when we have a key message or ideal to promote, we get passed over for the 'ratings faces'. (How many times have you seen someone like Jeff Sessions or John Thune get asked about conservative talking points? Compare that to their "guys" (McCain, Spectre, etc.), who get the spotlight front and center.).. {and yes that even goes for Republican-friendly FOX.}
I do disagree with you on the Palin-reason.. it had some to do with the religious aspect, but it's a case where the sum was greater than the parts. (it appears GS covered the Palin argument for me)
Ok here we go, my rap debut; background noise…boom de boom, boom de boom…My name is JimBob, I'm here to say, that being a honky is what I am everyday…I just can't help it if I'm not down with the "One", I think he gonna run the country into oblivion. chchch boom de boom… To be a real rapper you gotta toe the line, ya gotta hate the GOP and Bush and but it's ok if your girl is slanky, white and fine…boom de boom…So i'm a rich rapper I drive a Lambo and a Hummer, I take the money from the pockets of your children and their mother….See, anybody can do that!
How did you know that I walk, talk and dress like Urkel? I don't wear the glasses, though.
How did you know that I walk, talk and dress like Urkel? I don't wear the glasses, though.
Ya that sucked, I know. Give me two months and I'll be "Two Bits" the white equivilent of "Fiftycents" or "half dollar", whatever.
I will check it out on your recommendation. Confiscitory, preditory tax laws are the anathema of thinking people everywhere, or should be. The current fact of the matter is that the govenment at all levels will have it's dirty little paws in our pockets. The question is how to remove that paw. I'll look up that proposal. Thank you.
Well, a modern Urkel would wear contacts or get lazer surgery, perhaps perform it on himself. No medical cure for those suspenders though.
As long as you have the suspenders, law, you're doing okay
As long as you have the suspenders, law, you're doing okay
Nobody has called me "modern" in a long time. But the suspenders stay! Mark agrees with me.
I think that Sarah Palin's opposition said the word "God" so often that she hardly needed to say it herself. What she did say a whole lot was stuff like "this great country" and "America." She had a whole lot of energy.
I agree that most people engage politics at the level of gut-level or "feeling" responses. McCain failed to excite those who respond that way and failed to get those who "think" because of his History of pissing off conservatives. I think he got the nomination mostly on longevity… a whole lot of people who pay attention to politics as a daily thing, but not rabid habit, had liked him for a very long time and voted for him. He was so boring that Obama didn't even run against him for president… he ran against George Bush and Sarah.
From your prior two responses, i'm sure that you will like the Far Tax idea. As I said you can check out http://www.fairtax.org, you can order "The Fair Tax Book" and a run down to really bait ya, no fed income taxes, medicare, ss tax, medicaid taxes taken from your pay check, a prebate check depending on family members sent every month to pay for taxes on accessories, no death tax, not capital gains tax, no gift tax, no property taxes, just a national sales tax on all NEW goods and services. The aformentioned medium will go into further details. I get giddy just thinking of the day that this may come to fruition.
Sorry, Rap is worse than crap, it is the single leading indication of our societies de-evolution.
why is it that Obama's appointees or their spouses, have so many tax problems? I don't remember this having been the case in other administrations.
I don't have an answer, but if we simplified the tax code, or de-criminalized disobeying it, maybe more high quality citizens will come to the service of their nation.
That still doesn't address the first major problem with ANY income tax; Its none of the government's Goddamn business how much money I have!
Am I too white bread because I thought RAP started with Blondie and the Song "Rapture"…..????
I don't have an answer either. I'm more interested in how they keep getting away with it. If I underpaid by one penny, the IRS would be up my rear with a flashlight and a penny sniffing dog. Yet somehow these people get to say, "oops" and just pay up??
boom de boom is my favorite part. And chchch.
Folks y'all want to understand how the liberal thinks and why they believe what they do? THAT is EXACTLY how liberals see the humanity and THAT is how they justify their constant desire to create an oligarchy of the elite.
THE COMMON MAN IS A FOOL. <– THAT RIGHT THERE IS THEIR CENTRAL BIG LIE!
Conservatives trust the common man and believe the common man is capable of greatness.
Remember William F Buckley's words; "I'd rather be ruled by the first 2,000 names in the Boston telephone book than by the faculty of Harvard."
Folks y'all want to understand how the liberal thinks and why they believe what they do? THAT is EXACTLY how liberals see the humanity and THAT is how they justify their constant desire to create an oligarchy of the elite.
THE COMMON MAN IS A FOOL. <– THAT RIGHT THERE IS THEIR CENTRAL BIG LIE!
Conservatives trust the common man and believe the common man is capable of greatness.
Remember William F Buckley's words; "I'd rather be ruled by the first 2,000 names in the Boston telephone book than by the faculty of Harvard."
Opera is crap. : )
Tim Slagle: "Exactly what is the role of a political party now that we have such information?"
A political party has no role in the discussion of rap. It is a cultural issue. You seem to be one of the folks who've been drawn into the kerfuffle on a political basis It is not political, it's cultural.
"I’m fairly certain that right near the top would be a fear that Republicans want to censor art. "
Repubs/Consrvs. don't want to censor art. We just don't want to pay for it. The Left twists this into a cry of censorship vis-a-vis Conservatives. Again, you seem to be letting the Left frame the discussion.
"But as far as art, the Left is pretty tolerant."
Only if the art or artist espouses some liberal POV or deliberately takes a shot at the right.
For example, contrast the reactions on the Left to the Sean Delonas cartoon with the dead monkey versus the non-reaction to the cartoons portrying Sec. State Rice as a big-lipped parrot, or as the Prissy character from Gone With The Wind.
Nah. It makes you smart.
Well, smarter than a liberal at least…; – )
Well said.
Agreed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYmhcnC9WdQ&fe...
This is an example of Old School Rap that I consider to be positive and fun.
In the days before the B-word, the N-word, the H-word, guns, drugs and gangs when the art form was fresh. We can get back to this and still be fresh.
Shave and a Hair Cut should be your first single, Man!
Worse than that it's not Scottish
Another very positive rapper …..
Will Smith
just testing to see if trying to post here gets me the same lame message about "a connection error "
which stops me from posting in response to a different story
"Conservatives trust the common man and believe the common man is capable of greatness."
Conservatives believe (correctly, to an extent) that the "common man" can become a GREAT MAN if allowed the freedom and autonomy to do so. Liberals believe (also correctly, to an extent) that most of the "common man" will FAIL to become a GREAT MAN, and so ought be discouraged from trying and provided an allotment of services to help him remain comfortably common.
The thing about "the elites" being in charge is… no matter what system you provide, that's usually what's going to happen. The capacity to lead, and to survive at a leadership post, is NOT something that the majority of any population of any species is going to possess – otherwise, no one would be "lead-able," and then how would anything get done?
Amen. Leftist art exists in an ideological straightjacket so tight that it permits expression only in the direction of decadence.
As for 50 Cent's statement about Obama being assasinated by whites, it's far more likely that he might be offed by his own king-makers should his numbers drop too low. He'll be of no use to them as a living embarassment, but think of the mileage they'd get from a dead Martyr
A superbly intelligent statement, that, Zundfolge.
I checked it out… seems a little dodgy to me….it's a consumer tax… on EVERYTHING. Mortgages, cars, rent… and, that consumer tax is 23%. But wait, there's more! It's actually 30%! The below taken from:
http://weakonomics.com/2009/03/25/fair-tax-%C2%A0...
"You are familiar with seeing the price of an item ($100) and calculating in your head what the sales tax would be ($5 at 5%). The $100 is known as a tax exclusive price. $105 is the tax inclusive price. There are two ways to state what the taxes are in this case. You could say the sales tax is 5% of the price of the item tacked on, or you could say it’s 4.8% of the total price you pay at the register. That is to say $5 is 4.8% of $105. So your state could advertise that your sales tax is 5% of the tax exclusive price or 4.8% of the tax inclusive price. In the interest of public relations, it would appear the proponents of the fair tax quote the equivalent of the 4.8%, which is the 23% number discussed already. When you convert the 23% tax inclusive number into the exclusive number (like 5%, a number we can actually relate to) the actual Fair Tax rate is 30%."
The current system is messed up, I'll agree… but I'd pay more money with the so-called 'fair tax.'
And, yes, I did look at the fairtax.org website.
The rich would pay even more because they spend more… sound familiar?
To some extent, what you say is very true. A friend of mine tells a story about her father-in-law, who is a flaming Liberal, and a respected artist who paints portraits in a Classical Realist style. He is derided in the Arts community as a CONSERVATIVE, because his paintings look like real pictures.
However, I believe that we need to one up the Left, by supporting all Art. Let's make ourselves the party where real tolerance exists.
Ya, I am now a retired rapper. They say the average person has like 10 jobs in their lives. I just wasted one!
Thank you, you're to kind. Really, WAY TO KIND!
My apologies, you are correct.
I was just thinking about all the ways the Left normally operates when there is a message they want silenced. A boycott is a constitutionally acceptable method of protest, and not every tactic in the Democrat arsenal is wrong.
The broken clock adage applies here.
If we have no intention of doing anything about Rap, why are we even bringing it up? Why are we concerned that it might be destroying neighborhoods that we don't even live in?
There is no sense in identifying a disease, that you have no intention of curing.
And I believe, in the case of Rap Music, the cure is far worse than the disease.
First off your link doesn't work, so if you were citing a source, you'll have to do better than that. The 30% argument is wrong for this reason. When you no longer have corp taxes, payroll taxes and the like you can then take out all embedded taxes. This is why the Fair Tax would work. businesses do not pay taxes. They just pass them along to the end user. Here's an example of how the 23% national sales tax would work and keep goods at the same cost they are now. If you have a widget for $100. If you take out the 22% embedded taxes the cost is then $78.00. Let's say for argument sake, this is the wholesale cost of the good. When you add the Fair Tax the good is now $95.94. Opponents to the Fair Tax try to fudge it so it looks sneaky. B/c when you add 30% to the $78 it takes it back to $100.00. Some suckers fall for it hook line and sinker. Unfortunately Mccain was one of them.
Also to your first comment, everything we buy, own and use are already taxed, whether you see the tax or not. The Fair Tax only taxes NEW, look at it again, NEW goods. That means you would only be paying taxes on a brand new house or if you build a house. And you pay that tax only once. Or a brand new car, not used or preowned.
Please read the actual bill and on Fair Tax.org there is a letter that was sent to Obama by 80 economists explaining how this would be great for everyone and the economy.
Everyone knows that McDonald's is bad for you. But lots of us eat it anyway.
Blood Glucose Levels…
[...]why diabetics need to maintain glucose levels[...]…
Dark Under Eye User Testimonials…
[...]my husband can’t stop complementing me[...]…
eBook Bestsellers…
[...]all of the best selling novels of our time[...]…
Free Glucose Monitor…
[...]through the Diabetic Connect program[...]…
What Is Glucose…
[...]and why it’s important to monitor it[...]…
Dark Under Eye Circles…
[...]are easily fixed with dark under eye[...]…
eBook Library…
[...]an entire digital library of ebooks[...]…
Sites we Like……
[...] Every once in a while we choose blogs that we read. Listed below are the latest sites that we choose [...]……
Sources…
[...]check below, are some totally unrelated websites to ours, however, they are most trustworthy sources that we use[...]……
Check this out…
[...] that is the end of this article. Here you’ll find some sites that we think you’ll appreciate, just click the links over[...]……
Cool sites…
[...]we came across a cool site that you might enjoy. Take a look if you want[...]……
Visitor recommendations…
[...]one of our visitors recently recommended the following website[...]……
Topic Blog…
Some people make mistakes and this is when right knowledge is very important[...]…
Started Discussion…
…When you are aware what is your job you will be more successful than when you have no ideas…..
Great website…
[...]we like to honor many other internet sites on the web, even if they aren’t linked to us, by linking to them. Under are some webpages worth checking out[...]……
Online Article……
[...]The information mentioned in the article are some of the best available [...]……
Check this out…
[...] that is the end of this article. Here you’ll find some sites that we think you’ll appreciate, just click the links over[...]……
You must be logged in to post a comment.