Lion Meat: Coulter vs. Maher
by Tim SlagleIt was a crisp night in Chicago as I ventured down to the Chicago Theater, the Grand Dame of State Street, to catch the final performance of the Bill Maher - Ann Coulter Debate. The ninety year-old movie house dates to a time when they were rightfully called “palaces” because it’s like watching a show inside a giant Faberge Egg. This was the third debate of the series, the other two were held in New York and Boston.
The debate was sold out and people were still trying to buy extra tickets outside the theater. Also out in force were the 9/11: Inside Job protesters, the bane of Bill Maher. I snickered to myself. You would think most people there to be either a Maher or Coulter fan; I forget there are those who can’t stand both of them.
The crowd was fairly excited as they filed into the theater under the chasing lights and I swear I could smell the NPR on people. By my estimation the audience was for Maher by a ten to one advantage. It was also aged roughly 35 to 55, and almost entirely Caucasian. Before they introduced the speakers, they did a quick bias check. By applause volume it seemed four to one. When Rush Limbaugh’s name was mentioned half the audience began to boo so I knew I was in for an interesting evening. I also noticed that those for Coulter were all in the cheap seats (so much for the myth that the GOP is the party of the rich.)
Ann started off by speaking for fifteen minutes. In reality, she performed a stand up routine. She did an excellent job for someone more accustomed to promoting a book, speaking on the lecture circuit, and delivering closing arguments — especially considering how hostile the crowd was. I’ve done shows where the audience is apathetic, but working a house that loathes you is a different animal entirely. Even the most seasoned comedy veteran would have a difficult time performing to such a hostile crowd.
Ann nailed some Obama lines that made me realize how deep the political satire void is today. I heard more Obama jokes in fifteen minutes than I have all year:
Obama wants a Portuguese Water dog, so he can take it for walks…on water. Democrats like Jesus now… apparently they like carpenters, they just hate plumbers. The only time Obama didn’t vote present was in Jeremiah Wright’s church. Who isn’t in favor of hope, change and progress, I mean besides Ralph Nader? Big deal, Obama beat McCain by seven whole points. That’s like George Foreman beating Helen Thomas… a fight I’d pay money to see!
After Ann wrapped she handed the stage to Bill Maher. The audience erupted into applause at the very sight of him as though cheering a relief pitcher as he strode to the mound. Maher was car dealer smooth, exactly what you’d expect from a guy with over three decades of stand-up under his belt. He started by saying that Ann is quite brave, that she isn’t afraid to be booed — and that she gets booed a lot.
He listed his 12 things he hates about Republicans, number one was greed. “We all know there is one party greedier than the other.” At this point, Maher himself was booed. He politely said, “Look, in a show like this, everybody wants to boo something. If we let everybody do that, all we’re going to have is booing all night, and is that really worth the money you paid?” That turned out to be the only heckle of the evening. His deft competence made the other contenders go yellow.
He then lit into some, “Republicans are racist” jokes, which is strange considering some of the jokes he told: Republicans passed a bailout, that package was big even for a black man. Listening to Senator Roland Burris is like watching “Sanford and Son.” Republicans bought guns after the election because they were afraid of Barack and his Negro Army: Shaft, Dolomite, Foxy Brown, Cleopatra Jones, and Blackula.”
Why is it liberals think they can get away with remarks like this, remarks that would cause most Republicans to lose their jobs? I mean besides the fact that they actually get away with them?
Big applause lines for jokes like:
Obama could fill stadiums, McCain could only fill the ballroom at the Olive Garden and half the people there just for the free prostate exam. The only stadium Republicans ever filled was the Superdome after Katrina.
I liked the McCain banner: “Country First” — of course, then he nominated Sarah Palin (big applause).
Obama never put on a duck suit like John Kerry… Oh yeah, but he did bowl one time… he bowled a 37… Is that black enough for you?
Joe the Plumber claiming liberals were wrecking the American Dream … while he’s snaking out a septic tank– Pinch me!
Bush thought Voltaire was a character in a Harry Potter book.
How could you hate Hillary, a blander candidate we’ve never had, unless of course, you were once molested by a Real Estate Lady
Incidentally, fear of real estate ladies, is a plot line from a Lemony Snicket book.
After Bill wrapped up, they sat down to take questions from Mark Halperin who started by asking about a news item that broke after the show had started, Bristol Palin and Levi Johnson had split. Ann said that she didn’t like to delve into personal family business, and the audience laughed at her. Bill said the break up would be the most obvious headline since the 1976 classic: “Ghetto Residents Apathetic about Bicentennial.” He blamed Sarah Palin for being a bad mother and claimed that Sasha and Malia would never come home pregnant because if they did, Michelle will tell them, “I will knock the black off your ass.” At this point, I noticed the people behind me, one of the few black couples present, had stopped laughing about three or four jokes back.
Ann responded that an unexpected pregnancy wouldn’t ever be a campaign issue for a Democrat: “I believe Democrats would just use an alternative that is not available to Christian Conservatives, and we will never know about it if it happens.”
In an argument over whether Reagan won the cold war, Ann claimed that Carter was losing the war so badly, that, “like 37 countries fell to Communism while he was in office.” Bill responded, “Oh, another one of your rectum derived statistics?”
Ann flipped out. “What is this a Roman Colosseum? I’m so sick of you pulling that Whoopi Goldberg crap. All you’re proving is that you have a stupid audience that agrees with you.” She was right. Anytime she brought up any statistic that supported her arguments (Like: crime declines after concealed carry passed), the people in the audience would shake their heads in disbelief while Bill mugged it up. It made me realize how much of liberalism has become conventional wisdom.
One of the more interesting moments was when Bill tried to get Ann to debate religion. Apparently after making his documentary he thinks he’s built an airtight argument. It reminded me more, of the sophomoric discussions we’d have back in smoke filled dorm rooms: Maher asked, “Did God create evil? There is no scientific evidence that proves God exists, it’s all based on a 2000 year game of telephone.”
Ann rebutted with very good points, “Religion isn’t a scientific debate, it’s a theological or philosophical debate … And without evil, there would be no free will, we would all be like God’s farm animals.”
On a question about what Obama did right, Ann listed: Continuing the Bush policy in Iraq and admitting the detainees at Guantanamo are dangerous. She was relieved he’s not playing to the MoveOn-Code Pink-crazy base or backing down in the name of political correctness. “He’s not closing Guantanamo; he’s just going to rename it Obamaville.”
“She wins,” Bill finally said, exhausted. “I can’t compete. What are we going to do, cover every topic in US history?”
While Maher dominated the stand up portion of the show, he seemed to have a difficult time with actual debate. I’ll admit bias, but still I would have to give it to Ann. She won simply by insisting that Bill actually debate. When he was forced into it, he couldn’t.
After a couple quick one word joke questions, the two said goodnight. Bill Maher did compliment Ann once again on her bravery in the face of hostility. It would be interesting to see the same debate held elsewhere with the percentages reversed to see if Maher could maintain his composure.
On a Military base perhaps?
I’m quite certain he’d go white.
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115 Comments
I like Ann but why she would even spend her time to be on a stage with this piece of trash is beyond me…I don't think you could pay me to waste my time doing it. He doesn't deserve the time of day.
her detractors can say what they want; the woman knows her stuff. she's untouchable.
At leas it was a debate, not the moderated talking points memo that televised political debated have become.
I know what you mean but confronting people like Maher with facts does seem to be an effective strategy……….sounds like at least one couple had their eyes opened a little to the inherent racism of the "progressive" movement.
Ann won the debate, AND no one denies that she'd beat the crap out of him in an UFC bout. If Maher is the best the left has to offer then they really need new heroes. Condering Sean Penn is in their bullpen, their entire game is in disarray.
Ann won the debate, AND no one denies that she'd beat the crap out of him in an UFC bout. If Maher is the best the left has to offer then they really need new heroes. Considering Sean Penn is in their bullpen, their entire game is in disarray.
thanks, i was so dying to hear this debate… i hope to see it on vid somewhere soon.
Were these debate appearances a last ditch attempt by Bill Maher to promote his failed RELIGULOUS documentary? He tries to use bawdy humor to cover his weak arguments and Ann Coulter catches him every time. I'd say Ann is the clear winner with her increased book sales.
http://the100mostannoyingthings.blogspot.com/
I was at the first debate in NYC on Monday night. I laughed when you mentioned the Republicans being in the cheap seats. I was 'way up' and everyone around me agreed with Ann. The thunderous BOOS came from down below. The jokes were pretty much the same- the written and the 'ad libbed' the major differences were on Monday the first topic was Stem Cell research to which Ann used some brilliant verbal judo on Bill. Bill stated that Nancy Reagan was for embryonic research and Ann said, "Liberals mocked her for using Astrology and now you see her as a seer of technology!" To which Bill's only reply was, 'Touche." The second big difference was Bill used that "rectum facts" line and Ann didn't react as loudly as she did in Chicago. I'm sure he used it in Boston and she got fed up after three nights. And since it was the last night it seems Bill gave in and quit obviously fatigued from debating the issues for three nights straight. But it isn't bias on your part when you have a lawyer who is also a best selling author debate a stand up comic who, unfortunately, is the best the left has to offer.
If they were serious about a true debate, they would lose the live audience(Mahler;'s crutch), have a more intelligent moderator and follow the basic rules for debate. Colter would clean Mahler's clock and make him cry like the little girl he always wanted to be. Of course, liberals like Mahler, O' Donnel. Robbins et al ad nausium know that without the support of a left-wing crowd who, if thier backs are against the wall, will shout down the conservative if it appears that he concervative is winning.
But a true debate as the one I described is what is needed. I want to see good points being made and not punch lines. The rest is just car-crash entertainment.
I think they actually dated a while back. Bill Maher has never uttered an intelligent word. He makes fun of things he does not agree with, so what. It is also the same with most Democrats and Liberals. They just attack or make fun of things that don't fit thier agenda. It is easy to play to the masses when you do this. It is especially easy when you premise it by saying your opponent is the mean one so that it stops you from responding in kind because it adds weight to thier argument. That is one reason Reagan was so great. He could respond with humor but was never ever mean. He could ridicule his opponent while at the same time get his opponent to laugh. It is a rare talent.
Shows that Ann has waaaay more patience any lefty by putting up with snark that passes for "serious debate" and just continues with her brilliance. Said it before; Maher is a tool of lefties because his lightweight mind cannot fathom cause and effect, as well as follow true discourse, needed to make a full case of one's logic.
Bill Maher has in fact uttered some intelligent words; he's not all bad. He's brought a number of issues to the public attention that are worthwhile and controversial. I don't agree with his politics or world view, for the most part, but he's the Rush Limbaugh of the Left, and as an entertainer, he's going for ratings. Ann Coulter, like Maher, can be very mean when it suits her purpose. However, I am much more in agreement with her world view. This event was good for both of them in terms of publicity. BTW, Reagan WAS great.
Yes, debates can be hell, especially if the facts get in the way. Playing in NYC, Boston & Chicago, you knew that audiences would be stacked against her. (Probably a rider in Mahers contract) Anybody that saw Anne on Red Eye could see that she has a good sence of humor and can joust with the best of them. She's just being button-holed as a right winged loudmouth. Indeed, Anne can hold her own. Thanks tim for the review
John Q- disagree. Maher is not the "Rush Limbaugh" of the left for the sole reason that he well, has no reason.
Maher merely throws up lame one liners containing lefty buzzwords and catch phrases that his bonehead audience claps at like seals at a circus.
example:
Maher : "My pet goat- the one book that Bush could get through in less than 3 sittings. The WTC towers were so surprised, they fell over."
Audience: "Honk honk honk!" (mad applause ensues- it is presumed sardines are thrown here.)
Rush on the other hand uses, what's that word again? Oh yes, facts and cites.
Bad analogy.
I've always been a huge fan of Ann's and have always been repulsed by Maher. He seems to mock everything that is good and/or moral. When he's no longer of this earth I have little doubt where he'll be spending eternity. I've read all Ann's books and continue to be amazed at how intelligent and articulate she is. I hope she keeps up the good fight for those of us who see her as a champion of conservatives!!
Regarding Reagan….he was one in a million and I doubt we'll have another like him anytime soon!! He's greatly missed.
Never liked Coulter, but she became anathema to me after her vicious comments about the 9/11 widows. I used to enjoy Maher but his open contempt for religion has really turned me off lately and I'm not even particularly religious. Put 'em both on an island and let them gnaw each other to death.
Paul
"If they were serious about a true debate, they would lose the live audience(Mahler;'s crutch), have a more intelligent moderator and follow the basic rules for debate."
If they were serious about a true debate, they'd be two different people. At the end of the day, the reason these two get along so well (and can take this dog and pony show around) is because they're both running on the same schtick: Well-read, acidic comedians pretending to be cultural commentators.
Look Anne is doing what we all should be doing. Example: If some Leftist stray from Huffpo comes here or to any blog that good thinking faithful Americans congregate at and starts calling the posters racists, homophobes, etc. call them out. Ask them to debate honestly. I like listing a bunch of topics and tell them they can choose with stipulations: No leftist mythology. As in no 9-11 inside job garbage, Iraq mistakes…that front has been won, we debate policy not the past. They usually go slinking away with their miserable tails between their legs.
Bill must have known he was doing badly when he tried to go to his "bread and butter." Figured he could rally behind his go-to strawman and Ann picked it up and beat him around the ears with it.
John Q do not insult Rush by comparing him to Maher. Obviously you don't listen to his show. He speaks logically and he doesn't make stuff up. If you can point to me one thing Rush has said that was anything like Maher I will listen however since I do listen to Rush and stopped listening to Maher years ago I don't think you'd find one thing.
Anne is a hard case. We need hard cases. People don't like it? Then too bad.
[...] Gutsy Posted on March 12, 2009 by Caleb While I personally don’t like the woman very much, I’ve got to admit that Ann Coulter’s got some serious huevos on her for being willing to debate Bill “Communism Rocks” Maher in the heart of Obama land. [...]
You know, you'd think it was an effective strategy but it's not. It angers me to no end, every time you hit them with a fact they just dismiss it as a lie, or even when you show them the source of the fact they just dismiss it as wrong. There's no winning with liberals because they're utterly incapable of ceding any ground in their argument even when totally proven wrong.
They then of course pull some number out of their ass that they can't back up with any source material as proof of their own argument. I actually had someone at work make a totally wrong statement that when Reagan left office unemployment was at 8.9%. I then asked for his source and he sends me a link to data that very clearly showed it was 5.9% When I called him on it, he just ignored me and continued his original argument.
That's a prime example of every debate I've ever had with a liberal.
The only proper place to see those two perform is at Gitmo.
OK. So WHO was the "producer" or "promoter" of this event? I used to be a show promoter. At any venue, I could put chunks of the house on "hold" for promotional use or direct sale. This was done in advance of box office opening — just as long as a decent amount of the house was available for opening box office and/or the public perceived they had a fair opportunity to get a cherry seat. So, it's conceivable that the house was "planted," if not, a Maher benefactor made sure to snap up the majority of the house. Furthermore, if Bill & Ann were paid a crazy guarantee rather than a gate share, then their cares about the audience demo would be moot, right?
OMG… I just suggested a "Conspiracy Theory," didn't I?
Apologies, everyone…
It's so depressing…..you're right. It is as infuriating as the way they just "non-sequitor" into something else when caught in their inanities.
I am generally a positive guy that tries to pursuade but it makes me wonder if we should just street fight on their level…….it's just so dirty down there!
I would have loved to be there. I know Bill Maher was always a "progressive" but he used to stray away from all the politics and religon and used to be fairly funny. Now he is 100% douche-bag. I would have loved to cheer Ann on in that mindless crowd of retarded sheep.
Well said MovieBob. Well said
[Maher] "reminded me more, of the sophomoric discussions we’d have back in smoke filled dorm rooms"
Yes, exactly. While I've come to see Maher as an anti-intellectual unable to sustain a debate outside the authoritarian context of his comedy routine, he always reminded me of a type of undergrad from my northeastern liberal college days: the lounge-lizard faux erudition, the stockpile of glib phrases, the skills of a class cut-up — but no staying power. As soon as we broke up into debate groups, the glazed eyes, the lit cigarette, the lost interest.
And then there is the more recent memory of Christopher Hitchens — in that easy contempuous way of his — calling out Maher and his audience on all the retarded Bush jokes. Maher's mask fell for an instant. I was almost embarrassed for him.
Like I've said about a zillion times now. "Being a liberal means NEVER having to say you're sorry".
Not Over.
I took my sister to see Ann speak at Xavier University in Ohio when she was a freshman. Her lecture was insightful, well thought out, and very funny. When liberal audience members tried to debate her during the question and answer portion, she sat them down without much of a contest. Maher never stood a chance against her. He, like his beloved messiah, is amateur at best.
Yes, Anne dared to point out that some 911 widows seemed to be enjoying their popularity at the expense of their dead relatives and used it to make lame political statements. Apparently the media ate it up and thought themselves clever to give credence to what they said simply because somebody in their family died. Apparently maatkare is one of those type that insist that if your relative dies tragically then suddenly you become a voice of reason that should be listened to and used and abused by the leftist media as some newfound hero. I suppose maatkare like many liberals feels that it is ok to use tragedy as a political weapon. Which is exactly what some of the more shameful 911 widows did.
Try it. They either scream more invective at you or disappear. Sadly, that's the last thing we really need. We should honestly be seeking a true dialogue with on another or we're only going to keep drifting further apart and nothing good will come of it and we'll all come to regret it. Besides, I'm damn tired of walking around branded as a racist, sexist, homophobe simply for disagreeing with a bunch of shouting monkeys.
Many times over the years while there's hardly anyting I disagree with Ann, she sounds too caustic – not the message but the way it is delivered. And she is hilarious. As someone once said she is a satirest.
Still you have to admire her for wading into a viper's den of liberalism and coming up with the line:
"All you’re proving is that you have a stupid audience that agrees with you"
Never have liked Maher.
True Dialogue..I have. Let me say you want more name calling and ad hominem go and do it. They don't know what they are talking about and they know it. I would bet 99 percent of the Dems don't even know why they hate W. They just do. Its a lock step psychosis. Hence engage them in a debate when they retreat to name calling you know they lost and they know they lost. They like to bully. You know bullys are the biggest cowards on the planet. All it takes is one good slap down and they never rise again.
[...] to Rush Limbaugh’s view. I was originally guessing that Obama would aim to be another Bill Lion Meat: Coulter vs. Maher – bighollywood.breitbart.com 03/12/2009 It was a crisp night in Chicago as I ventured down to the [...]
One point that burned some military families…. these poor families that lost their husband/wife in the attack were given so much money to help them (I suppose with kid's college fund, etc), but then to see what a military family receives after their spouse is killed defending their country is a bit disturbing. Even the folks who got people out of the buildings…. did they receive millions?
I think Ann is smart and a good business woman. She is laughing all the way to the bank!!!
Money. Same reason as Maher. But he is not motivated by greed…
Ann is brilliant! She understands that she is going against 60’s radical philosophy, to win by any means necessary. You can not deal with people that have no morals and expect reasoned debate, it’s dumb. Leftist can ooze from subject to subject drawing a morale equivalence between everything, it’s a liberal trap. Be aggressive push back on this PC insanity that’s ruining this country, forget Markus of Queensbury rules, you’re dealing with 60’s radicals or their offspring, take a gun to a knife fight, “WIN!” The alternative is the Obamanation, yuk!
So much of liberal behavior can be explained by projection. They examine their own motives and tactics and all the self-loathing slop in their own heads, and–bereft of empathy as they are–they can't imagine anyone behaving differently. All the "data" that they cite is "rectally derived," so that must be what conservatives are doing too. Projection is everywhere with these people: "everyone does it" (Bill Clinton); "nation of racial cowards" (Eric Holder); "lied to get us into a war" (re: Bush); and on and on.
It gets really scary when you apply the "projection principle" to the "9/11 was and inside job" people and those who claim that the response to Katrina was a politically-motivated racial genocide.
I disagree. You can clearly see a difference, in that Ann uses real facts and statistics, generally knows her subject, and cares about getting truth out. She does go for the joke and she does fudge numbers sometimes. But she's more of a real intellectual than Maher, who plays an intellectual simply for the joke.
Maher's movie was such a clunker that while it was playing in a tres chic uber liberal Santa Monica, Ca. art movie haus, it lasted about 2-3 weeks and then *poof!*….crickets chirping in the parking lot!
I'd disagree on this one. While Ann certainly does hit people exceedingly hard with commentary, I think she does her homework and presents well-researched arguments. If you've ever read her books this is evident. Where she runs afoul of most people is just how far she will go with her sarcasm, which I can totally understand.
I've watched a lot of "Politically Incorrect", and while Bill is a good comic, I don't think his intellect is of the same level as Ms. Coulter's.
I saw Ann's similar stand-up lines at CPAC, and they weren't real great, but I admire her for doing the debate.
She is the type of person we need in these circles doing the debating, because even she doesn't get a lot of converts, she's smart enough and well-read enough to really understand and defend her point of view. Yes, she goes too far, but that has not stopped 50 years of liberal cynics from being effective in changing our culture. People may be shocked, but a lot of them will think about it.
We can't win 'em all at once.
A rare talent indeed… almost an "x" factor… and one that I watched with thrill and amazement day in and day out when Rudy Giuliani was mayor of NYC.
Please, john.. i'd LOVE to know what topics Maher actually discusses with some modicum of intelligence?
My only problem with Ann is that she "Tries" to turn regular interviews into the infamous "snark" contests.
Ironically, there were times in her Larry King interview with Joy Behar when she did this.. Joy actually asked her some questions that weren't deserving of a snark response (admittedly they were early on in the interview. the later comments/questions definitely deserved the Coulterisms), but Ann went ahead and did it anyway, just to do it.
It totally watered down her zingers on the later questions in the interview that did deserve the snarky response she gave.
As for Maher… anything he says tends to be ridiculously stupid.. so he can have any Snarks she throws at him.
Has anyone else noticed that so many of the "serious political commentators" and "thought leaders" on the left are stand-up comedians and brain-dead actors? When did John Stewart become a serious journalist? Isn't his show on the Comedy Channel? Same thing with Bill Maher. The political commentators and thought leaders on the right (other than the radio show guys) tend to be lawyers and former governors, senators, etc. And even some of the radio show guys are lawyers or former politicians.
Says something to me about the intellectual level of the discourse on their side…
As someone who sat 10 rows from the front at the NYC debate, it was pretty scary to be surrounded by followers of the Bill Mahar ideology. However, I truly think Ann made some in-roads: to quote a liberal who was sitting next to me after hearing Ann discuss the evolution theory (or lack thereof), "she's right". I also thought Ann handled the Meghan McCain "surprise" very well (who was sitting in orchestra section in front) by essentially dismissing Meghan's recent comments about her and giving her no real credibility. Kudos to Ann for doing what all Conservative politicians should be doing on a daily basis – bashing liberals daily with the truth and exposing them for what/who they really are – Godless and Guilty.
Which reminds me of a show hosted by Wally George – You long time Californians will remember him. He was ostensibly "conservative" but he'd have this audience that reminded me of a Roman Coluseum – whatever hapless and unsuspecting guest he'd have would be sure to be loudly booed at some point in the "interview".
Made me almost embarrassed to call myself a conservative.
[...] by glynjeffries on Mar.12, 2009, under Entertainment A great little review of how Ann Coulter cut Bill Maher down to size in debate. It was a crisp night in Chicago as I ventured down to the Chicago Theater, the Grand Dame of State S… [...]
Rich,
No dating, but they were somewhat friendly when he had the "Politically Incorrect" show. Ann was his most often booked guest, and that show was no where near to the degree of lefty loonie as RT is. Ironically, Evan Sayet and another writer for the show, (apologies here, can't think of her name), a really sharp black lady, have a right -wing stand up show, and perform it in Hollywood. That takes some guts, too. I'm also waiting for the availability of the Maher/Coulter event video. Whoever finds out first, please post here at BH.
And I love that she's a "hard case". I wish our side would stop being so wussified and take it to the other side with both barrels.
I don't care if people think that we're mean. Hell, we're right. That's all that matters
Personally, I think she showed great restraint with Behar. I noticed quite a few other bloggers thought so, too. After all the years that Behar has said nasty stuff about her, I can't believe she didn't strangle her on live t.v. I know I would have.
You're correct about the anger part but how do you think Liberals bought into that Bafoonery? Their party repeated lies so often that it becomes a fact. Maybe confronting Liberals with facts is the only way to get across to those who are open minded, yet closed minded to the rights ideas. Maybe Ann has an incredible idea that will help enlighten some of the liberal audience who would switch the channel when they hear that Ann Coulter is going to be on. They payed to be there so they will listen. If Ann makes 1% curious enough to go home and check out the facts, we've one a battle. Battles are important in the war.
Let them think that they won and I'm sure that you'll see articles everywhere saying that Ann was embarrassed. But in the long run, these are steps that the right must take.
I'm in Chicago and I couldn't make it for the debate. I always get angry that nobody visits Chicago for campaigns or things exactly like this because Chicago is always going to be Democrat, so nobody even bothers. But now this happens, and I couldn't make it! Oh well, thank you so much for the update!
The left loves the victims. They know that no one can attack the poor, poor victim, to do so would make you seem heartless. So, if your spouse is killed in a tragedy, and some pol is running for an elected office, and he thinks your stance on Good Morning America on ______________ is a win for them, and you are a figure that kind hearted Americans will pity, then only an animal will dare say they are wrong about ____________. Fill in Christopher Reeve, Michael J. Fox, Nancy Reagan, Jersey Girls, James Brady, Willie Horton, etc. as the possible victim. This is their long-standing m.o. Kind of like their strawmen Obama so likes. "some want to just do nothing on the economy." Who? Who is this person? "Others want to kill the advances of science." Again, who is this idiot? No one knows this people, they don't exist. But for the vast majority of people who don't follow politics, that stuff sounds great in soundbites. Same old game, different players.
If they got different people, would it matter if they debated? No one would know, because no one would be that interesting in seeing two nobodies have a dry, egghead debate. Might be a good learning tool, but it won't pay the bills. People came to see who they wanted to see, to be entertained.
The difference is that those in the military voluntarily place themselves in danger, whereas the 9/11 folks did not. I think, had the country ever taken seriously that we were at war post-9/11, a similar event would not have had the same payoff. I agreed with Ann, though, and have always considered the attacks of that day to have been on US as citizens of the United States, and that the widows should have had no more say in policy than any of the rest of the country.
I attended the debate in NYC a few days ago and almost wished someone else besides Ann had been there to "debate" Mahr. Coulter has an encyclopedic amount of information and wanted, time and time again, to present a detailed and well-thought out argument for her opinion. But whenever she did this, Mahr would cut her off and spout off a one-liner that had his disciples in the room practically ROFL.
Perhaps Dennis Miller, who can exquisitely cut a person to shreads with his sarcasm, would have made a better pairing with the comedic hack Mahr.
Mahr's most passionate moment came when he declared that gravity is just a theory (wrong, idiot), and yet everyone knows it is true, therefore, the theory of evolution is equally true, even if it's still referred to as a "theory". He went onto describe, to the cheers of the imbecilic audience, how certain bacteria have "evolved" to become resistant to even the strongest antibiotics known to man. Hmmm. This is his "evidence" of evolution?
Unfortunately, Ann didn't have the rational and truthful retort to Mahr's ridiculous argument…which would have simply to explain that the phenomenon he described was certainly "mutation" and "adaptation", but NOT evolution. You see, even after this bacteria's rise in rank to super-strength, it was still the EXACT same genus and species of bacteria it was before when it was "weak". It simply did not evolve into a fungus, a slime mold, a tadpole or, God forbid, a liberal.
Yet, the audience cheered him as though he was the Galileo of his time.
He also sneered at Coulter when asking her whether or not she believed in the Biblical account of Genesis and Adam & Eve. Of course, instead of simply answering "yes", I wished she'd have said that her belief was just as strong as his that his ancient ancestors were pond scum. Now, that's a fantastical and outrageous belief system!
It wasn't a fair fight. Maher is the typical liberal; ideology without intellect. Ann is a polarizing figure. I would like to see her tone down the sarcasm a bit, but she's right on the issues.
Engaging with liberals is always entertaining. Unfortunately, actual debate collapses with the first volley of facts.
To my fellow right wingers, why do we pretend that Anne went out to "fight" for us when in point of fact she and Maher are good friends (by her own admission). Most of the pundit-types we give so much of our time and money to are part of the same social circle, making a fortune off of our anger and fear. Let's wake-up and start to think for ourselves.
you used the term monkey your a racist
j/k
I wish I could upvote your comment about 10 times.
"This event was good for both of them in terms of publicity."
I assume they both made lots of money off of it as well, which is fine.
In the end, I think a few liberals in the audience may have been forced to think by listening to Coulter's arguments, since they normally aren't exposed to any conservative thought at all, except in caricatured form.
I am only amazed that Obama didn’t put the stupid movie in Prime Minister Brown’s gift basket of old DVD’s that will never be watched.
Kudo's to Mr. Slagle for an informaitive play by play. I look forward to a commercial TV replay. I strongly disagree with those who view Coulter as an entertainer first. First, she's brilliant, and second, she's all ours. Whether in print or in person, she's always conveying conservative argument with wit and logic. Not only will she take on the challenge of facing Maher (in a faux debate with both a hostile audience AND a hostile host) & the same with Joyless Boarhair in the studio of the enemy – she'll showcase her talent with Clare Booth Luce & The Young Republicans when invited on campus. She's provided more spine tingling moments of astonishment my way since Buckley's FIRING LINE left the air than I can recount.
Evolution IS mutation and adaptation, and speciation is a process which takes place over a long period of time and several generations. The phenotypic and genotypic change observed in antibiotic resistance most certainly is evidence that evolution is a FACT. Next time, try reading an actual biology book instead of parroting Coulter's idiotic and woefully uninformed talking points from Godless.
In order to get the nut out of the nutter one must crack some shells.
[...] Big Hollywood covered this interesting debate/standup between the 2 extremes. [...]
[...] See the original post: Lion Meat: Coulter vs. Maher [...]
Using facts and logic? No wonder the crowd was hostile. You are supposed to smirk, gawk, mug and get personal and viscious. Doesn't Ann understand the crowd?
God, I do miss Bill Buckley.
I do agree that Miller would carve Maher a new one in a few minutes.
Note that this event was held in Chicago, an area where liberal and/or Democratic views are much more popular than conservative and/or Republican views anyway. If you open the box office there, you are going to get more Maher fans than Coulter fans walking up to the ticket counter regardless of anything else.
Oh, goodness. The debasing of the mighty Chicago theater. Saw 'You Only Live Twice' there as a kid, it made even great Bond movies better… Maher is a standup comedian, and a mediocre one at best, who discovered politics (leftist, of course) would meld nicely with his libertine lifestyle (porno, drugs- this guy's private life is not admirable) and became the tonic for the Bush Derangement Syndrome sufferers. He doesn't really debate issues because he is either ignorant of them or cannot articulate them; either way he has always been
a less than erudite spokesman.
Ann, on the other hand, is an acerbic policy wonk. She has literally forgotten more about actual issues than he has ever learned, which is why he falls into invective and shopworn platitudes so darn quickly. Essentially, he is battling a destroyer escort with a squirt gun, and she knows it… and, according to insiders he's actually quite smitten by her. Not terribly surprising- he's aware she lays waste to him fairly easily…
I can only think of three countries that became Communist during the Carter administation: Afghanistan, Grenada, and Nicaragua.
Clearly Carter did a poor job handling the Cold War, but other presidents have had even more countries turn Communist during their administrations than he did.
Liberal snark versus conservative bark. I'll take the bark, thank you very much.
…. say it brother
There is no comparison between Maher & Rush. Rush politely explains to callers that disagree with him why he thinks they are wrong. Whereas Maher makes fun of anyone who disagrees. I used to think Maher was almost evenhanded until he (along with the rest of the drive by media) sold his soul to the devil to defend Bill Clinton's antics.
I believe Coulter said that how did the wives know that their husbands weren't going to to divorce them before they died, which I found incredibly insensitive, especially when delivered with her abrasive style. It's possible to make the point without such a heartless remark. Anyone has the right to advance their cause. All the victims have that right–she was just going after the ones she disagreed with.
Why yes, of course…and…uh…(I was trying to poke fun at myself; e.g., "Conspiracy Theorist" ala the eveready M.O of the Other Side; an oft' excuse.) But, of course — you're right: heavy Dems usually the case for hip urban centers of America. So….points for Coulter: the chick's fearless of sauntering across the DMZ and straight into the line of fire. Glutton for punishment propositions must really turn the gal's crank…and anyone's gotta dig that. Altho' I'd ask her to clarify…."WHY, girl?"
Excellent points. Also, start looking into the educational background of some of those on left and you start to shake your head.
I'm glad to see Mr. Slagle note Coulter's view that Maher's following is just gotchya-maniacs without the ability to weigh the consequences of their views–"All you’re proving is that you have a stupid audience that agrees with you.”
This reminded me of Christopher Hitchens' appearance on Maher's show (adult language) in which he expresses the same observation but with different style.
Military members, if they are smart, will supplement their SGLI life insurance, I do – especially if they are married and have kids.
If by disturbing you mean not enough… than I agree. That money my wife will receive if I die in the line of duty I pay for monthly. It is called SGLI (servicemembers group life insurance). I also have an additional policy because, according to this calculator (http://www.insurance.va.gov/sgliSite/calcuator/ne... it isn't enough.
However, I don't begrudge anyone money they may receive. I try to be content in all circumstances.
An attorney, author, lecturer, T.V. personality v . a pompus, shallow, empty suit. No contest. A woman beater, beaten by a woman. Delicious.
Thanks for spell check, it’s Ann! She’s has the right approach. Cutting through the clutter a little shock value is in order.
You've nailed it exactly. Zero regard for fact or logic.
Great Article
I wish I could have been there!
I was differentiating between those who voluntarily place themselves in harm's way and those who do not. As I pointed out, were a similar event to occur during a state of war, compensation might have been different. I said nothing about insurance. And, personally, I didn't feel that the families were owed anything by anyone other than the terrorists who perpetrated the attacks.
They had become political activists, and set themselves up for 'heartless' remarks. No one imposed upon their private grieving. The widows Ann made a point about wore their victimhood as an armor against anyone questioning their positions. You put on that armor at the risk that someone might point out the kinks in it, and Ann did just that. Too many people are afraid of being labeled 'insensitive' IMO.
If you want to see what happens when an intellectual and a performer debate go to youtube and check out the Dennis Prager vs Staphanie Miller debate. It's about an hour long and it takes place before the elections but it's interesting to watch. Logic and composure vs. one liners and baseless mantra. It was the first time I'd ever heard of Dennis Prager and now I'm a fan.
Needless to say Prager beats her about the head for about an hour with facts and logic.
I love Ann Coulter. She's funny and always right. i used to like Bill Mahr when he was funny – but that was decades ago.
Wow, I remember Wally George. His show was briefly broadcast across the country. Pretty awful stuff. Then Morton Downey stole his schtick and became more successful with it. These are lowlights of the 80s, which was a pretty awful decade if you ask me.
George, by the way, is the father of Rebecca de Mornay, so he did contribute something of value to the world.
Arggggg… it's ANN…. not ANNE already…
And, she rocks by the way. Get one of her books. She isn't, by any means, a snarky commentator on the culture. Go see her bio on her website.
I'm not quite sure I follow… military members' families shouldn't be compensated if they die in the line of duty? Their families don't receive anything unless the servicemember elects to have that insurance. The family will have a monthly stipend (based on 75% of that member's monthly base pay only).
The most embarrasing thing about Shill Maher's "material" is how dated some of references are; Sanford and Son? Shaft? Blackula??? Way to keep current with black culture!
She used to say that they were friends. Not anymore though. Whacked!
Being able to slice and dice a popular libtard priceless, the money to do it, gravy.
I'm also sick of hearing guys like O'Reilly and even Conservative pundits insist that she doesn't really mean what she says that she's just saying it to be provocative and sell books. How they can say that about someone who documents and footnotes her books as extensively as Coulter does is beyond me.
Great column, as always. I fervently hope someone was burning some video of these shows.
Ann Coulter is a master debater. Bill Maher, since he started taking his stand-up as fact, is something that almost rhymes with what I just called Ann, intellectually speaking.
C'mon, Blacula is a great film! William Marshall rules!
Think of it this way – it wasn't the conservatives that needed the message – the seat you would have occupied was taken by a liberal – the one who needs to hear the conservative message.
Rush refers to those calls as "teachable moments"
The show was taped by a local video company. As far as the cameraman knew, it was only being done for archival purposes, and there are currently no plans to release or broadcast the show.
They entered the political arena of their own choosing. They let themselves be used by the leftist politcal machinery and also, as Ann correctly pointed out, they seemed to be enjoying their moments of fame and taking advantage of it. They chose to make political fools of themselves and they more than deserved to have the obvious truth of it pointed out. And concerning rights, Ann had the right to go after those phonies and self-serving activists and she was right about their lame attitude and their lame rationale. I am glad that people like Ann dare to point out the kind of crap that leftists involve themselves in and their less than worthy motivations and less than worthy agendas.
Cameron – when I read that in imdb that he was the father I couldn't;t believe it! Genetic science is a fascinating study isn't it?
I wonder why people would go on his (or Downey's) show just to be booed?
BTW there is another interesting tie in with Morton Downey – he was a talk show host on Sacramento's KFBK – got fired for using a mild ethnic slur against Asians – and who should the station hire in his place but a guy named Rush Limbaugh.
By this time in Rush's career he had about had it – been fired 6 or 7 times and he was going to give this one more try.
The station manager told him that "I don't care what you say on your show – but you have to believe in it.".
For the first time in his radio career program managers weren't dictating his format and the rest, as you know, is history…He was in Sacramento about 4 years when he decided to try a national syndicate based in NYC
Maher on a military base ??? You think he would make it out alive ?
Great post Tim — thanks. As much as I like Ann Coulter and think she's brilliant, I can't understand what thrill she gets from Maher. The man is a tool. And not even a funny tool. So Ann going into the ring with him would be like Andre the Giant going in against Tonya Harding – Albert Einstein against Al Gore – why lower yourself and step in the ring with someone who's intellect and standards are subpar. I don't get it. Although I'm sure dollars play into that equation somewhere.
folks tell me that Maher is pretty genial in real life- and so is she; it is not unusula for polar opposites to attract. Look at G Gordon Liddy and Tim Leary…
I'm amazed that Ann even went to Chicago, which is an unbelievably Democratic stronghold. She's smart and tough and able to draw out facts that support her arguments while the liberals hold their hands over their ears saying "I'm not listening…la…la…la." I wouldn't loved to have gone to see this event, although listening to the obligatory liberal bile from Bill and the audience would've set me off.
thank you, but prefer Sista! LOL
[...] I came home from the fabulous sold out Maher -Coulter debate, I began to wonder something. The next big show on the MSG Speaker series is the Al Gore show on [...]
[...] Couples for Christ Solomon Islands placed an interesting blog post on Lion Meat: Coulter vs. MaherHere’s a brief overview“What is this a Roman Colosseum? I’m so sick of you pulling that Whoopi Goldberg crap. … we going to do, cover every topic in US history? [...]
[...] Big Hollywood » Blog Archive » Lion Meat: Coulter vs. Maher bighollywood.breitbart.com/tslagle/2009/03/12/lion-meat – view page – cached It was a crisp night in Chicago as I ventured down to the Chicago Theater, the Grand Dame of State Street, to catch the final performance of the Bill Maher – Ann Coulter Debate. The ninety year-old movie house dates to a time when they were rightfully called “palaces” because it’s like watching a show inside a giant Faberge Egg. This was the third debate of the series, the other two were held in New York and Boston. — From the page [...]
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