Hello! The Jonas Brothers are not Virgins!!! They're getting laid. OK. Just like Miley Cyrus. Her 20 YEAR OLD boyfriend just moved into her house. Please, no more of this "Abstinence Only" propaganda.

It's not propaganda if it espouses a different viewpoint Michelle. We're on to your liberal watchwords.

Michelle's point is that a lot of the "abstinence only" crowd is going to feel pretty silly when you realize that Ms. Cyrus and the Jonas boys have been as promiscuous as any teen you see on MTV. To quote Bristol Palin, "abstinence only just isn't realistic".

So we should abandon abstinence education since it's unrealistic, eh? Ok, come to think of it, becoming a famous pop star isn't realistic so how 'bout they cancel American Idol. Winning the lottery isn't realistic so let's do away with the Powerball (the money doesn't actually go to schools anyway). Pornographic films aren't realistic so out with those, too. Avoiding lifelong emotional distress after an abortion isn't realistic so let's overturn Roe v. Wade. Improving US health care (the best in the world) by emulating the woeful nationalized systems in Cuba, Canada, and Europe isn't realistic so Congress should repeal the "Stimulus" Bill.

Wow, this is fun!

Its true that people need to get married younger, but abstinence can be achieved. And even for those who fail, its a guideline, a fence to keep things safer.

Let us suppose two failures in two alterate realities…in the AO reality, the guy sleeps with his future wife and this causes some problems. In the 'Sex is Impossible to Stop' the guy sleeps with nine different girls, and gets several pregnant, spreads STD's and learns the habit of being disloyal to his girl which he carries over when he gets married, and then divorced, and then married and then divorced.

My siblings and I achieved abstinence before marriage. My wife and her siblings all achieved abstinence before marriage. I know of many people who have achieved abstinence before marriage. It is a great goal and I highly recommend it and I am teaching my kids the same principles and I fully expect that they will achieve that objective as well. It really does work. We are not animals subject to our base instincts. We do have self control and have the power to decided how to behave.

You're right. Absolutely. Very logical, since some kids will have intercourse and might not do it safely, we should show them all how to do it "right" as soon as we can. (Wouldn't want them getting pregnant or losing an eye would we?)

You know, I really like that logic. Some kids are going to do drugs, but I'm not sure they'll know how to do it safely. Why not teach first graders how to shoot up? Hmmm. And I'm sure we can agree that some will use guns to settle their problems. Why don't we start teaching kids how to use guns safely, without hurting innocent bystanders or themselves — just the targets they're aiming at… Wow, I think I like this…

One cannot "achieve" abstinence, Shane. One can REMAIN abstinent, but abstinence is not a goal to OBTAIN.

VERY good point, Pete.

Oh yeah, the Jonas Brothers are AS celibate as Bush was AS able to form a coherent sentence.

"we're on to your liberal watchwords"

lol. they're on to us, boys. everybody run!

So, I assume you've been peeking in on the Jonas Brothers' bedrooms to confirm this.

I'm not going into how creepy that is.

No. But I live in Wyckoff, NJ, where they were raised. And it is a widely known fact HERE that they-they meaning the two older one's, anyway-have slept with at least girls from Ramapo High School. How do I know this? Because my daughter's are the girls two best friends. And, in act, Nick has been to my house on a couple of different occasions. So much or your creep factor.

Why is it that the pervs are always the first to go there? Oh, yeah. Cause they're pervs.

Rob, I completely disagree with you. A standard of sexual purity can be set and one can make decisions based on that standard when opportunities arise. If the decision to abide by that standard is not made in advance, then you will not maintain that standard. People do it all the time when they decided there is a value to live by. My employer has a vision statement and a set of company values and those are the standard by which we are expect to conduct our business and it is my “goal” to incorporate those values into the way I do my work. Whether you call it abstinence sexual purity or whatever you want to call it, living to that standard is a goal. When a situation in life comes along and there is a choice to be made between living according to that standard, and I make the choice to live it rather than succumb to temptation, I have achieved my goal. It does not mean that I will not have to work to achieve my goal the following day, but by making the right choice every day it becomes easier. As Emerson said “That which we persist in doing becomes easier – not that the nature of the task has changed, but our ability to do has increased.”

That's hysterical!!

Sex for ALL living creatures is a BIOLOGICAL IMPERATIVE. DO you know why teenagers all o a sudden want to start humping like rabbits? Cause they're bodies tell them to. And that's not RELIGION telling them to, that's SCIENCE. Remember SCIENCE? The thing with EMPIRICAL, VERIFIABLE FACTS?

Look, I'm not saying it's BAD thing. In fact, I really don't think teenagers should be doing it given their inability to reason effectively, and their LITERAL lack of brain development to make responsible decisions. However, they ARE doing it. They are GOING to do. And they are going to do now more then generations of the past (except say, when people only lived to thirty, when 12 and 13 year olds were doing it and getting married), so why DENY why try to subvert? Give them access to abstinence related material AND give them access to birth control options too. That' show i see it.

You should note that as a LIBERAL I'm a OPEN to discussion about this and I actually think you made some salient points above. I just think that religious doctrine falls very far short of addressing the realities of living in the modern world and MOST religious peoples address that problem by simply denying it's existence and running in the opposite direction. They don't offer solutions to problems, they run back to their precious, sacred texts for answers to questions that didn't even exist when these so-called "words of God" were written by the men and, in a few cases, women, who lived in Ancient times so far removed from present day reality. It is LUDICROUS to expect and intellectually dishonest to apply these "rules" to a modern society.

If you read ANY of my comments above, you would know that EVERYTHING you just said is a complete JOKE.

I'm not outraged. I couldn't care any less. Nor do I hate them. In fact, I have a great relationship with the boys and their parents.

NOR am I against abstinence or celibacy, for that matter. What I am against is people trumpeting the Jonas Brothers as examples of said purity when that is simply FALSE. As it was also false with the CHRISTIAN Britney Spears, who made the same claims about her virginity. It's a MARKETING gimmick that you and your brethren exploit for the sake of STRAINING to find an example in order to get teenagers to think about abstaining from sex: "Well, if the Jonas Brothers wear purity rings then I should remain "pure" too! "

You willfully ignore or simply DENY the truth in order to use them to further your abstinence agenda, plain and simple. That is simply DISHONEST and also really quite pathetic. And, oh, by the way, an overwhelming majority of teenagers don't BUY IT. And do you know why that is? Because they have genitals, and their genitals are telling them they've got some HUMPING to do.

If you want Teenagers to abstain from sex, as I think many of them should, you are not going to anywhere by lying to them. And that, unlike your defense of their purity claims, is the real TRUTH.

I'm with you Rob. In my view sex ed is best taught at home by responsible parents but I realize that's asking a bit too much these days. Wherever they're taught, at school or (God help them) in the media, at least let them hear all of the facts without any dismissed out of hand. It may be just one way to equip some of these kids to break the cycle of irresponsibility and poor decision making that may doom them before they've had a chance to mature.

You are a lowlife. I can see by your very rude comment that you do not have any self control and you are as an animal.

Um, how does ANYTHING I wrote above apply to your comment below it? And, since YOU said it. I want EMPIRICAL, actual, literal facts in the form of verifiable sources in order to prove your statement, "Milk is hailed as a hit". Yeah, really? By WHOM? Orm are you too much of a coward to support your claim?

Sounds like somebody's got a little obsession going. How many locks of their hair do you own perv?

WAH WAH WAH!! Were you not the one to INSULT me first, COWARD? What's the matter, the God question got you all tied up in knots?

As I said, YES. That's OBVIOUS one can control one's biology. But that's MOOT point given what I was talking about.

LOSER.

You've got daughters? That's sad you twisted perv.

ROB:
It's been an education following your string of argument here. You are the living embodiment of STERGEYE's First Law of Critical Distinction: the difference between dumb and stupid is that dumb really doesn't know any better, but stupid chooses not to. The two are not synonymous.
Intelligence or education are no bar to stupidity; in fact, those who achieve really champion levels of stupidity can employ both to maintain their delusions. Look at Jimmy Carter.
Your fallacy is to make the claim that the Jonas Brothers CAN'T be virgins on the basis of fourth-hand accounts of dubious validity. Does it occur to you that you may choose to believe the scurrilous accounts about their private behavior because it fits your template, which seems to be that maintaining abstinence until marriage is unnatural, rather than on the merits of the rumors. Kids in high school NEVER make up nasty stories about other kids who may be more attractive or popular, do they?
It doesn't strengthen your case when you immediately go to ad hominem attack mode when you respond to a challenge either.

So all your outrage is because they're hypocrites? Doubt it. You'd hate them even more if you thought they were being true about it. Being a Liberal is entirely about feeling "judged". It's reactionary. Children in grown bodies still rebelling against "daddy." Like I said. Celibacy=Liberal kryptonite.

I was responding to Drew's post, not yours.

(Continued)

Because of the above evidence, there are a growing number of unbelieving scientists who concede that the cosmos came into being by some supernatural power. Here are two striking admissions from such scientists:

“Now we see how the astronomical evidence leads to a biblical view of the origin of the world. The details differ, but the essential elements in the astronomical and biblical accounts of Genesis are the same: the chain of events leading to man commenced suddenly and sharply at a definite moment in time, in a flash of light and energy.”

– Dr. Robert Jastrow, writer of "God and the Astronomers" (agnostic)

“The beginning [of the universe] seems to present insuperable difficulties unless we agree to look on it as frankly supernatural.”

– General Relativity expert Arthur Eddington (atheist)

Okay, Rob, do you have any other eyewitnesses to confirm your claims about the Jonas Brothers?

It's always good to have at least one non-relative to prove your case. This is for objectivity's sake.

Wow. Let another Rob chime in to balance out the "evil Rob" (joke) that is soiling my good name.

It is certainly true that humans have impulses, but it equally true that we must have some ability to subdue them, lest society could and would not function.

As some have hinted at, achieving a society that largely abstains from pre-marital sex is a complex task. Many things about society are now "hard-coded" with the assumption of co-habitation and sex outside of marriage. But these are all effects from a root cause, which is the decline of morals in Western society generally.

Essentially the idea of abstinence would gain huge traction if it wasn't so derided in the culture. I am one of those weirdo Christian people who did not have sex of any kind before they were married, but before I was I felt intense pressure- not from my biological impulses, which were easily controlled. I felt the intense pressure from almost every aspect of our culture, which shouted at me in no uncertain terms: "YOU ARE NOT A MAN UNLESS YOU ARE OUT HAVING LOTS OF SEX."

Let's take a look at another issue that is similar. What about bigamy, having multiple wives? Surely on the surface level this is much more pleasurable for the husband. Get bored with wife #1, let's just move on to another, but still have access to the first. It makes no sense that there isn't a huge desire to legalize and partake in this arrangement, especially with divorce being such a problem.

Of course there is the religious component: Christians are instructed to have one wife as is the case in most other religions. But, there is something else: our society still derides and even mocks bigamy- it is absolutely considered a big, big taboo, and this goes beyond it simply being illegal. There is no TV show outside of that cable program (and doubt that glorifies the practice) that makes bigamy "cool." No movie stars are doing it, no rappers and no rock n' rollers. The culture is clearly aligned against it.

In my view, this tells me that yes, we can have a society where we keep it in our pants for a bit, lol. We have to start producing culture that values this ethic, though, and until we do, it will be difficult.

And one more thing: Bristol Palin's responses to Greta Van Susteran were pathetic and basically stupid. Hate to say it, as I'm a Palin supporter. But yowza, she was bad.

I suspect, Rob, that your motivation is less about condemning the JB's behavior than it is about justifying your own. "Everybody else is doing it" is the oldest hormonal cop-out in the book. "It is only in recent history that sex at such an early age has been frowned upon." Really, Rob? Not as recently as the effort of the popular culture to sexualize every female above the age of three. In those halcyon days you seek to invoke, the young women were married to the one person with whom they were having the sex, and were expected to stay married life-long.

As Chesterton (I think) once said, "Hypocrisy is the tribute that vice pays to virtue." When role models fall short of the standard, that's disappointing. When role models have no standards from which to fall, that's the end of civilization.

"Oh great, cause I went to STANFORD and my Ph.D is in Molecular Biology."

Whatever. You sound like a liar. You don't argue like you went to Stanford. I think you made that up to seem more informed. I would be shocked if you were a college graduate.

You idiots and all your sex/abstinence talk. You are boring. Comment about movies or box office. These debates about religion are so tired and quite played out.

Rob you are one of the biggest idiots I have stumbled across on a message board in recent weeks. Your claims of a Stanford education are so sorry that they are humorous. I bet you live at your mom's house and are currently unemployed. Why do you hate the Jonas Bros. so much? Jealous? It is true that you will never

I don't hate the Jonas Brothers, nor do I dislike them…not in the least. And, if you had even the most basic, elementary-level reading comprehension skills, you would know that already given my numerous posts about them.

Furthermore, I didn't start this debate NOR did I post an article about them or they're so-called PURITY. If you take umbrage with that, then I suggest you send an email to the purveyors of this site, rather than attempt to belittle me for it.

I don't have to justify my educational history to you, you iGNORANT twit. But, if you'd like, I'd be more than happy to meet up with you in the city of your choosing so we can discuss this face to face, you know, like real men, as opposed to the kind making pejorative comments about me long after the fact of my postings.

Why don't we do this? Why don't you share with the room where you went to school? I will provide a PDF document of all of three of my diploma's, and you can put your community college degrees up against them and see how they compare? Or, as I said above, we can just have it out face-to-face?

Something tells me you would too cowardly to do either of those things. But that's not all that surprising given that you've called me out, and, like most internet cowards, will run away and hide because I can provide proof in response, and you're too ashamed to admit the truth about who you are or what you've really accomplished.
Care to actually settle the dispute that you have started OR, are just too much of a PUSS to do so?

Sure Rob. Stanford right? You can go and die any time. That is how pathetic you truly are.

Rob,

Where's the link to the predicted box office for the Jonas Brothers film?

Just making sure you comment is based on hard evidence instead of wishful thinking.

JONAS BROTHERS: THE 3-D CONCERT EXPERIENCE should easily win the weekend with a possible $30M! Except, it didn't even come close.

Yeah, that's right a POSSIBLE $30 million. Except it made around 12.7 million, only 18 million shy of Mr. Mason's prediction. Guess all the purity and righteousness wasn't enough to get the evangelicals out in droves. Maybe they believe that 3-D is the devil's work and that's what scared them off!?

Same, the Jonas brothers can make any song a decent song .

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