Marlon’s Mao: Part Two
by Michael MoriartyI was a mere teenager in the fifties when it was broadcast widely that the Chinese “don’t really have the same love of life that we do.”
Apparently the Americans at Jonestown were part Chinese, eh?
Here is the Last Will and Testament of Jonestown:
Dear Comrade Timofeyev,
“The following is a letter of instructions regarding all of our assets that we want to leave to the Communist Party of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics.
Enclosed in this letter are letters which instruct the banks to send the cashiers checks to you. I am doing this on behalf of Peoples Temple because we, as communists, want our money to be of benefit for help to oppressed peoples all over the world, or in any way that your decision-making body sees fit.
The letters included listed accounts with balances totaling in excess of $7.3 million to be transferred to the Communist Party of the Soviet Union.
Hmmm …. Communism.
It is my opinion that the ultimate fate of both Communism and the American version of the same tyranny, the centralized governing ambitions of Progressivism, will prove to be as murderous and as ultimately suicidal as Jim Jones and Jonestown.
The body count of Mao Zedong’s own Jonestown-like reign over China is presented in detail by the authors Jung Chang and Jon Halliday. Now we have high-level members of the Progressive Obama Nation’s court and Progressive Hollywood’s elite applauding the likes of Mao, Che Guevara and Hugo Chavez.
Millenniums of Judeo-Christian Law, not to mention a bust of Sir Winston Churchill, are now being tossed out the windows and doors of the White House.
The question is: how can Hollywood and its Progressive Film Industry romanticize the likes of Mao Zedong in a film of his life?
Unless Mao can become the charismatic magnet of Hollywood that Marlon Brando was at one time, the likes of Anita Dunn and her admiration of Mao cannot go any further than the Oval Office.
However, Mao and Che shirts are being sold worldwide.
Mao’s image was on the White House Christmas tree.
What is Mao but a survivor’s version of Jim Jones, multiplied by a death count of about 27,233?
And where did Mao spend all the money he received for selling almost all of the rice crops in China to Stalin’s Soviet Union?
As payment, China received lethal military weapons and materiel.
These were Mao’s endlessly death-dealing obsessions.
Former Governor Sarah Palin labeled one particular portion of the multi-thousand-page, obfuscating Health Care Bill as the creation of a “death-panel”. With Mao on the minds of the Obama Nation, what have we invited into our most powerful seat of power?
All that Progressives need now is a super-star they thought they had in Barack Obama. Obviously they are looking above and beyond Obama to Mao!
If only Marlon Brando hadn’t gotten so fat and died, eh?
Obviously the great actor had a taste for roles holding imperial power, performing as both Marc Antony of the Roman Empire’s first Triumvirate and Napoleon Bonaparte of France. Also we caught, I believe, a brief glimpse of a Mao-like guerrilla fighter in Francis Ford Coppola’s Apocalypse Now.
Brando’s Col. Kurtz wallows in an insanely homicidal progress through Vietnam’s own “killing fields”, killing, killing and killing, mirroring much of Pol Pot’s Communist massacre of Cambodia.
Cambodia post-Pol Pot
Mao Zedong’s Great Leap Forward left a similarly homicidal swath of starvation throughout all of China.
“The horror …” as Kurtz says. “The horror of it!”
Marlon Brando could have had Mao mugging through the Lotus Gardens like a playful Don Corleone with his grandchild. He could possibly have charmed us with Mao as another revolutionary, Emiliano Zapata, stumbling humbly through his reading lessons.
In the same way Marlon Brando inspired our affections for Don Corleone, he could have actually left us amazed with the deadly declarations of Mao’s right-hand man, Zhou Enlai.
However, as Hollywood does do, the script writer could put the words of Zhou in the mouth of Marlon’s Mao.
So far my article on Kissinger as a “Courtier” is the only response to what I still consider one of Kissinger’s most revealing admissions: how the Mao Regime had “shamed” him.
How can the most shameless dictatorship in the world possibly shame one of America’s most shameless advisers to one of our most shameless Presidents, Richard Nixon?
Mao Zedong is, in actual fact, the secret God of not only Dr. Kissinger but American Progressivism in its entirety. Therefore it is not so much “shame” as reverence.
In conclusion, if you really wish to be led to drink Kool-Aid or starve to death like the so-called, life-hating Chinese, then fall for Progressive Hollywood’s version of Mao.
Combine Brando’s poetic but ruthless Kurtz with his lighter turns in Teahouse of the August Moon, the cunning madman in Missouri Breaks and, of course, Don Corleone of Godfather?
You are well on the way to Marlon’s Mao!
However, there are reports that Marlon Brando’s own last days were like a self-inflicted euthanasia.
Purposely disregarding the advice of his doctors? Hmmm …. there is certainly a personal Apocalypse Now, or, even more precisely, The Heart of Darkness in that decision. Marlon’s Mao, I have no doubt, would be everything Joseph Conrad, Francis Ford Coppola and possibly even Mao Zedong himself might have dreamed of.
A lofty and irrefutable model for Progressive Maoism, with a particularly intense concern for the environment which, in turn, would nicely justify wholesale slaughter and some forms of genocide. In Marlon Brando’s absence, who could possibly capture this monster adequately?
Well, with Oliver Stone’s revised versions of World History, perhaps his most culminating achievement will be his revisionist’s history of Mao Zedong.
There will really be no way to “top” such a film. Could there be anything more centrally important to the Progressive New World Order than Oliver Stone’s MAO?!
We certainly don’t want the God of Communism to be left misunderstood in the same way that Oliver Stone feels Hitler has been, do we?
It is possible that Mr. Stone might convince one of my favorite actors, Sir Anthony Hopkins, to create the same, immensely complex and surprisingly sympathetic portrayal of Mao that he did for Oliver Stone’s Nixon.
Yes, perhaps Marlon Brando’s absence, in this case, was a favor, not only to Oliver Stone, but to Marlon Brando himself.
With only the likes of Oliver Stone’s MAO to beckon Marlon Brando back to his former imperial glory, is it any wonder that the Far Left’s Screen Hero just stopped taking care of himself?
[Part one of this article can be read here.]
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87 Comments
There's a revolution coming, alright, and the Tea Party is it.
Brando as Barney Frank – "Raging Bulldyke".
Thank you for part two of this excellent article, Michael.
I met someone from China who said in school they taught the children that there were great floods and thats why why there is no food. Long story short, he studies meteorology at an american college and finds out . . . guess what? . . . there were no floods.
And why is it important to have a Separation of Education and State ? ? ?
Brando as Al Gwhore- "Weather Chasers"
When's BigHollywood gonna make a movie, play, flash, cut out puppets, shadow puppets, musical on Mao!!! & Anita "lip smak" Dunn!!! AAAAAGGGGHHHHHHhhhhh!!!!!
Now that Marlon is with Mao in the ever after, DiCaprio will be the default to play Mao.
I was in high school when the Jonestown Massacre happened and as much as it was discussed, I never heard that Jim Jones and his followers were Communists. Last year there was a huge article in WaPo on the anniversary of the massacre and again, no mention of Communism. It shouldn't surprise me, but it does, how the media completely whitewashes the communist/progressive ideology of so many tyrants, dictators and murderers.
Ben Stone wins another case.
Mr. Moriarity, may I say that the benign face of evil in your narrative is not only cogent and well stated, but completely correct. Somehow, our society has given the serial killers of progressivism/socialism (and the rest of the statist ism) a coolness because they use the PC words of empathy. Everyone forgets Jim Jones was the darling of the Progressive/Socialist of the San Fransisco soviet. Keep up the god work sir. I just hope our Dear Leader, his most holiness of the new cult of personality, Barak Hussain Obama (Allahs Peace Be Upon HIm) will not be able to implement his version of a progressive/socialist utopia on America.
Perhaps to grasp the power Mao had in 1940s China is to know my friend from Hong Kong.His wife, also a Chinese, came from Uruguay. In addition to speaking fluent Chinese, she speaks fluent Spanish.
How did she come form Uruguay, you ask? Well, her family had to flee from whatever Mao was doing in late 1940s China.
Speaking of Jonestown, I had the most eerie feeling in the late 1970s. I was doing outside sales and happened to be in San Francisco at the time of the Jonestown suicides.
The "People's Temple", if I am not mistaken, was a former synagogue on Geary Street.
I drove behind it and saw literally hundreds of cars parked and trunks ready for shipping. I then realized that all of the owners of these items were dead.
And in a bit of historical trivia, largely forgotten, Jim Jones had a lot of friends – all Democratic. From Jerry Brown and Jimmy Carter on down.
He could deliver the votes. Of course, they dropped him like a hot potato after the "suicides".
On the Left's idolatry of despots like Mao and Che i believe they want to think of them as they imagined them rather than what they were.
There's a revolution coming and it's pretty freaking scary IMO. I found this by accident just a little while ago and have been devouring it ever since. Everyone should read this and glean as much info as possible from it.
http://www.worldrevolution.org.uk/index.php?id=35...
JIM JONES: AN OBAMA PROGRESSIVE BEFORE HIS TIME
Jim Jones and his "People's Temple" (note the socialist implications of this sect's name) were a 1970's Democratic Party racket that got out the vote for Jimmah Carter and Walter Mondale, as well as served to carry water for Jerry Brown.
I once heard audio tapes of Jim Jones hosting some French Socialist who praised the Jonestone settlement commune as a wonderful example of egalitarian dialectical living.
Anyone wanting to see Jim Jones pimping around with the San Francisco Liberal establishment should go to this link:
http://www.brasscheck.com/jonestown/pics.html
Amazingly, the origins and purpose of all this chaos are predicted and accounted for in the prophetic, political Conspiracy Thriller book, BLACK ROAD 2012, which I bought on amazon, and was a real goose-bumpy, totally absorbing ride: http://tinyurl.com/amazon-BLACK-ROAD-2012
Joe,
Thank you for the link.
It will most certainly be entered into Marlon's Mao Part Three.
The suicidal nature of Communism now has a stunningly relevant body count of American devotees.
Perhaps Jones is ultimately the best object lesson to those who would trust Communism or, as it is now called, Progressivism … trust it in any way.
Thank you.
God Bless,
Michael
I hate to be the picky one but I cannot help myself, it jumped right out out me. FYI Marc Antony was not a member of the Roman Empire’s First Triumvirate that was Caesar, Crassus & Pompey. Marc Antony was a member of the Second Triumvirate along with Octavius & Lepidus.
Interesting article, it makes me wonder why these people on the left are drawn to these sociopaths, the people I look up to are kind of different.
Thank you for the correction!!!
You are painfully but accurately and precisely CORRECT!!
God Bless,
Michael
I believe some people in the U.S like Mao simply because of his charm. Mao is a very charming political leader.
As for us, I am so glad now I am proficient in English enough to at least make some voice to correct the biased idea about Mao and communist China (now it's capitalist China and I really hate it).
Have you guys ever thought about the fact? For all the years who have you been listening to? People who tell their stories in English only. And who are the people in China, back in 70s, 80s and 90s, could deliver their voice to the world in English? Those who left China because they couldn't tolerate it. But there so many people who chose to stay in China, like my grandparents, my parents, and 1,300,000,000 Chinese. Had they have the chance to talk in English or publish their book, I bet you wouldn't thought about Mao and China this way.
It's all about POWER OF DISCOURSE.
.
continue:
My grandparents are intellectuals, and they experience Jiang Jieshi's administration, the civil war between National Party and Communist Party, the WW II, the establishment of People's Republic of China, and cultural revolution. I dont have the time to tell you all how they thought about each event, but I can tell you guys after the 60 years hard life, my grandparents still favor Mao. Yes he made many mistakes, but he is still a good political leader. His leadership, together with a lot of Communists with ideals and beliefs in the 30s and 40s, saved China from becoming the colony of Japan or United States. Their efforts established a foundation for China to become an independent country as today.
And Mr. Talionis, please check your words before telling a lie. No floods? I am so fed up with this kind of arrogant, ridiculous lies about China. The natural disaster lasted for 3 years, and my grandparents told me stories in my childhood about the miseries they had suffered. Yes, the Party made horible mistakes during that 3 years, which made people suffer even more. But look at Haiti now. Surely if they had a better system less people would die. But would you blame Haiti government killing all those victims in a natural disaster?
As much as I respect Mr. Moriarty, I couldn't tolerate his readers' comments. I am glad although he is a little biased (I understand that, because he doesn't read Chinese), at least I didn't see him making jokes like his reader Talionis
I came to this country to find free speech and studied law because I admired your legal system. Even in China, the government told us in the U.S, your media respects the truth and your legal system represents the justice. I learned while I was in China that our country has many many problems, and we are looking for improvements, and we need to learn from the U.S. So I came here to study law.
And what I found here? My professors or even deans are discriminative towards international students. Your media is as much a joke as Chinese, no matter left-wing or right-wing. Obviously their political views are too aggressive to deliver the truth. In my class, my classmate told me I was brainwashed. I had to tell them the same. You are brainwashed about the history as well. At lease while in China I knew the U.S is good and the communist party made aweful policies, but what did you guys learn in the U.S? You only learned your country is the best and the rest of the world is trash, especially China and communist party.
M,
I posted this above, but just in case you didn't see it:
Joseph Stack was the guy who flew his plane into the IRS building in Austin. Here is how he ends his manifesto.
The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed.
You sound very young, so I will spend a little time answering you.
First off, Americans know nothing of Mao’s charm. We have never seen anything of Mao except for his uniform and little hat. He is to us not like a big brother, an uncle, a father or grandfather, like some Soviets who left that country describe whoever their leader is. I know of a Jew, a Brooklyn red diaper baby, who told me that in his home growing he was taught to think of “Papa Stalin.”
The truth is that China has 600,000,000 to 700,000,000 who are still uneducated. The same point you make about America applies to China. They do not speak English so they know no other point of view. Of the ones who did want out, China’s iron curtain held the rest in.
Mao accomplished at least one amazing feat. He destroyed England’s legacy that followed the Opium Wars. He did root out an exceptional evil thrust on it by the West.
I wouldn’t, however, rate him as a great political leader. Beginning in 1958, he “accidentally” starved 30,000,000 Chinese to death – at least partly by forcing professionals who knew nothing about on farms to grow food.
Actually, the USA stopped Japan from making a colony out of China. You might look up the Flying Tigers, a group of Americans who a few years before WWII moved to China to help it build an air force against the Japanese who up until then bombed China without any resistance.
Can you please name one “colony” that America controls that even comes close to living under the tyranny of Mao or any other big league communist leader?
Thank you for being gentler with Wenyan than I am.
GB,
M
America is not perfect, especially when it comes to discrimination. However, don’t feed me the line of crap that the Chinese set a great example. They are like everybody else. Many of them are curious about other cultures. Many of them can’t stand outsiders.
However, Americans fought a Civil War to free the black slaves. In doing so, 600,000 whites were killed. No other race, religion or ethnic group at any time in history has ever done that for another.
A couple of years ago I watched a documentary produced by CCTV (Central Chinese Television out of Beijing) in which they told of 100 Chinese children were sent to America to be educated. The movie read several very heart felt letters between these kids and their American families after they had gone back to China. Two of them who graduated from our best universities went back to China. One built China’s first major railroad and the second modernized China’s navy.
You are right. Much of our media has become a joke. There are two main reasons. Ownership has been taken over by huge corporations. O’Reilly accuses NBC, which is owned by GE, of putting out a party line that favors the government so that GE gets contracts from the government. The second is that the MSM has been taken over by the left which has to lie because they cannot tell the truth and hope for their ideologies to succeed.
Nevertheless, you, yourself, are publically complaining here in the USA without fear of being shot in the back of the head which used to be what happened in China.
That's not the case any more,. Now I can say what I want in China without being shot. Americans used to torture slaves, and now you stop doing that. Every country made mistakes.
Anyway I am not interested in arguing with you here. I am a fan of Mr. Moriarty, if not for that reason I am already too tired of arguing with people on these things.
Yes they are silent, but they know better since they live in China. And even they (to be objective, the majority of them) don't hate Communism as you do. So I am wondering what's the basis of this hatred in the United States? Most of you never read Chinese, never been to China, never read anything written by Mao directly (or even in English)
Don't tell me again I am brainwashed and all Chinese are brainwashed. I have had enough "brainwash" crap.
I appreciate his being gentle.
Mao is a Chinese. Americans are not Chinese. That's end of story. China has been ruled under a dictator for thousands of years—–people lived, had children, produced splendid culture, etc. China remains its culture and tradition.
America has no colonies.
Joseph Stack was the guy who flew his plane into the IRS building in Austin. Here is how he ends his manifesto:
"The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.
The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed."
Your thinking seems confused. You merge China and communism to be the same thing, as if because we hate communism we also hate the Chinese. You are never going to have your head straight in this back and forth until you separate them.
The list of reasons to hate communism would require books to fill. Basically it fails and when it succeeds it does so at a snail’s pace compared to free enterprise. None of us want communism to seize our property and to, whenever they deem, to tell us what to do.
Democratic free enterprise creates more freedom and prosperity for more people than any other system. It is as simple as that.
The Chinese culture has not been splendid to its slaves. The pyramids of Egypt are splendid as is the Great Wall, but I would not have wanted to have been one of the slaves who were forced into that labor. Neither do the Chinese who are alive today. That's the end of the end of the story.
Yeah, I know. That was my point.
I've seen interviews with people in the street on CCTV (Central Chinese Television out of Beijing) and some of them were glad that they have much more freedom now than in the past and that they are becoming prosperous. However, they were clear that they were living under a totalitarian state. They are keeping their heads down. The information in and out of China is also heavily censored. Why don’t you go there and stand up vociferously against that and see what happens.
Technology is changing things. I spoke to one Chinese woman who told me that if Tiananmen Square happened again, that the government wouldn’t be able to so easily squelch that news because everyone now has cell phones and many of them have cameras.
Also Tiananmen Square was only 10 years ago. If that had happened here, Americans would have shot back. Without guns, you will probably never genuinely achieve freedom of speech.
China did have great floods, but from memory they occurred in the 1890s and again in the 1920’s, possibly 30s. Either the Yang Tse or the Yellow Rivers flowed over, each time killing 1 to 3 million. I don’t know of any during Mao’s rule. Can you educate me?
Mao’s disaster was drought. As I pointed out above, his mismanagement that led to 30,000,000 dead is not merely horrible; it is beyond comprehension and 15 to 30 times worse than the previous floods.
Yes, we can blame Haiti’s governments before the earthquakes for not creating a country that could more easily ward off such a disaster by building structures that would not fall down. Instead, the pigs that ran Haiti looted it to appease their own greed.
I have no intention to discuss with you anymore here. Have argued enough in the past. No matter what you think about China and no matter what you say, China is going to be stronger, more open-minded, and strictly independant. And that's definitely not because the U.S government or western media bashing enough.
BTW, thank you for having some knowledge about China. It will be much better if you know your country as well and hold same standard for your own country, from 300 years ago, not only now.
So you ignore everything you've learned over the past decades because someone on the internet makes a claim?
If America fought a civil war to free slaves, doesn't that mean that half of America fought a civil war to keep slaves enslaved?
If Tiananmen Square happened here, people at BH would be cheering for the government to kill all the protestors — as long as a Republican president was in office, that is.
"I have no intention to discuss with you anymore here. Have argued enough in the past. "
Obviously, that's not true because your words didn't end right there.
"No matter what you think about China and no matter what you say, China is going to be stronger, more open-minded, and strictly independant."
That's what America is rooting for, so long as you are talking about the Chinese people and not their government.
"And that's definitely not because the U.S government or western media bashing enough."
Please write that in English. However, without the USA on the earth, China would be a slave state today. That should be obvious.
"It will be much better if you know your country as well and hold same standard for your own country, from 300 years ago, not only now. "
You don't have a clue what I know about America 300 years ago.
Troll, troll, troll your boat gently down the stream
Merrily, merrily, merrily, life is but a dream.
So? 600,000 white men were still killed in that conflict and the morally correct side won. As I said no other race, relilgion or ethnic group has ever paid that price for another.
There's a big fat story about SF and Jim Jones, but they are hoping it will blow over like the suicide and Ryan's death. Remember what else happened at the same time to push it off the front page ?
The Mao book by Halliday/Chang is a true horror show, even the Black Book of Communism is riveting as an objective accounting.
What a crew ! The American people are going to get an unfortunate comeuppance for their mistake in electing this one, Frank Marshall Davis's son.
Not biological son, but certainly an ideological one.
"That's what America is rooting for, so long as you are talking about the Chinese people and not their government."
"Please write that in English. However, without the USA on the earth, China would be a slave state today. That should be obvious. "
This is so outrageous! I beg you not "represent" Chinese people. That's you arrogant Americans always think you should do—-representing people in other countries. You never truly understand what "independence" really means. Talking about "very young", I think you are talking about yourself, as an American.
OK let's be civil and stop here (I hope). I still want to read Mr. Moriarty's blog here so don't want to be at war with his dear readers.
Thank you for this one.
Now I'm really ticked off. After reading another great piece by MM about Communists and their sycophants in Hollywood and the US government, I started thinking about the former State Department official and his wife who were arrested last summer for being Cuban spies. I did a search to see what was happening and was surprised to see the couple had pleaded guilty last Nov.
Here you had a man who worked for the US State Dept, taught at Johns Hopkins, came from a prominent family (grandson of Gilbert Grosvenor of National Geographic and great-grandson of Alexander Graham Bell), and was a spy for Cuba for thirty years. Many Americans would find this intriguing, a glimpse into the world of government and academic traitors and Marxists.
But the guilty plea and subsequent low-key media coverage, not surprisingly, slipped past me. Probably having something to do with the plea coming on a Friday and the meager media coverage on Sat. here's the NYT coverage of the couple's guilty plea. Unbelievable. Besides their despicable treasonous acts, the couple exhibited the typical leftist hypocrisy.
The media Marxists do everything they can to gloss over the prevalence of their fellow travelers in government and academia, especially when there's one in the WH.
Now, if Myers had been a Tea Party participant spying on Cuba………..
Now I'm really ticked off. After reading another great piece by MM about Communists and their sycophants in Hollywood and the US government, I started thinking about the former State Department official and his wife who were arrested last summer for being Cuban spies. I did a search to see what was happening and was surprised to see the couple had pleaded guilty last Nov.
Here you had a man who worked for the US State Dept, taught at Johns Hopkins, came from a prominent family (grandson of Gilbert Grosvenor of National Geographic and great-grandson of Alexander Graham Bell), and was a spy for Cuba for thirty years. Many Americans would find this intriguing, a glimpse into the world of government and academic traitors and Marxists.
But the guilty plea and subsequent low-key media coverage, not surprisingly, slipped past me. Probably having something to do with the plea coming on a Friday and the meager media coverage on Sat. here's the NYT coverage of the couple's guilty plea. Unbelievable. Besides their despicable treasonous acts, the couple exhibited the typical leftist hypocrisy.
The media Marxists do everything they can to gloss over the prevalence of their fellow travelers in government and academia, especially when there's one in the WH.
Now, if Myers had been a Tea Party participant spying on Cuba………..
Got any evidence? I recall several thousand being murdered at Tianammen Square. I don't recall any time in American history that our government was responsible for such a massacre.
If Moriarty suggests that Brando, had he lived, might have been a perfect choice to portray Mao, how would you feel about Sean Penn as an apologist for you?
Thanks for the heads up on the Cuban spies!
There's a story there, closer to home than China.
God Bless,
Michael
"I beg you not "represent" Chinese people. That's you arrogant Americans always think you should do—-representing people in other countries."
You constantly tell me to shut up, usually because I am impolite or misinformed. This is a basic commie ploy to circumvent freedom of speech by supplanting it with political correctness. Yet you refuse to address any of my points and instead jump to another subject.
Telling Americans that they are a young country is another commie attempt to make us feel inferior and thus incorrect about any propagandistic point you want to make. I have noticed it for 45 years. Got any original thoughts?
"OK let's be civil and stop here (I hope)." You can stop any time you want. As an arrogant American I am going to demand the last word, especially against a Chinaman who habitually sings, "Yakity-yak, don’t' talk back."
if I start address your point, it will become endless. You got basics wrong, so tell me from where should I start to address your point?
I am here to read Mr. Moriarty. I started this whole conversation merely because Mao is my idol and I felt offended. So I complained. That's all. As a poor communist in this free country America, can I choose to complain a little bit instead of arguing with someone who is not even on the same page? I am not in a position to lecture you modern Chinese history. And you said, "a Chinese woman told you….." what am I supposed to say to this one? Tell you she is a liar, or tell you you misunderstood her? Who cares what a random Chinese woman told you. And Tiananmen….why don't you just continue to read your CNN? Do you really care what really happened and what ordinary Chinese think about Tiananmen Square??
I didn't argue with you about American history right? You even picked on my English, did I say anything about it?
You are not impolite though….I don't think you are as against China as you sound in recent couple comments as well.
And about your next comment—–whatever Mr. Moriarty says I will just listen. It's not only because I am his fan, it's also because he always quotes from books, not keep on saying "a woman told me", "my friend said"….etc. For this reason I respect him.
Troll.
“If I start address your point, it will become endless.”
Quit shifting your problem to me. You can quit whenever you want. All you have to do is stop typing. This is the third or fourth time that I have told you that. If you state your opinion, you shouldn’t then tell me to shut up.
“I am here to read Mr. Moriarty.”
Then read Moriarty and don’t tell the whole world what you think. If you want to speak to only him, figure out how to email or call him. If you post it here, you are also talking to a very large group and you know going in that any one or more of us might answer you. Quit acting like you are being victimized by not being allowed privacy. This is an open, confrontational forum. What do you expect?
2 of 4
“I started this whole conversation merely because Mao is my idol and I felt offended. So I complained. That's all.”
This is a pro American, pro capitalist, pro democracy forum. Did you really expect someone to pat you on the back for loving Mao? It is almost as if you got up one morning and said to yourself, “How can feel offended today? I know, I’ll go to a conservative forum and start making communist gang signs with my fingers.”
“As a poor communist in this free country America, can I choose to complain a little bit instead of arguing with someone who is not even on the same page?”
Find a different forum. How many times do you ask the same question? You should post in a communist forum. You might remember the Beatles lyrics: “But if you go carrying pictures of chairman Mao, You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow.” More importantly YOU ARE NOT THE VICTIM. I don’t care if you are poor, Chinese or an ET from Mars, if you complain in public here, no politburo is going to tell us to shut up.
“I am not in a position to lecture you on modern Chinese history.”
If you are too busy, just quit typing. There’s no shame in that.
And you said, "a Chinese woman told you….." what am I supposed to say to this one? Tell you she is a liar, or tell you you misunderstood her? Who cares what a random Chinese woman told you.
Your thinking is muddled. I was not discussing the facts of Tiananmen Square with her. She was pointing out to me that the news of that event couldn’t be contained today as it was in 1989 because camera cell phones would get the news out all over China within a few minutes. Given your above statement, I have to wonder if you are a typical commie who is trying to obfuscate the truth or if you logical enough to talk to?
“And Tiananmen….why don't you just continue to read your CNN? Do you really care what really happened and what ordinary Chinese think about Tiananmen Square??”
Do I spend time in heartfelt morning about the loved ones I lost in Tiananmen Square? No. Do I want to make sure that Stalin, Moa, Castro nor Chavez take over here? Definitely.
4 of 4
“I didn't argue with you about American history right?”
This the fourth attempt in post alone that you tried to control the conversation by telling me what I can and cannot say. This strikes me as consistent with communist rhetoric and thinking.
“You even picked on my English, did I say anything about it? “
You just did. However, yesterday, I made up for it. I explained to my Hong Kong roommate why there is only one time in English that she should use “ing” endings with an infinitive. That would be when she is adding a progressive aspect to the infinitive.
“You are not impolite though….I don't think you are as against China as you sound in recent couple comments as well.”
I am against slavery. To the extent China favors it, I am against China.
Someone forgot Indians?
I guess American culture has not been splendid to them as well. America was a colonies. I think at least on this point US was the same as China and both fought back.
I like Mr. Washington more than Mao personally, as a Chinese. Mao is limited by his background and he likes power. However, Mao is very important in Chinese history. There are bad things about him but his good decisions made China totally different from India (which I feel very lucky), which is often ignored by western people (because of your media? I would guess). Please understand that attacking him will not make Chinese people happy, even to me who dont like him very much.
US did a good job in WW2. However it was far from perfect as far as I know. US waited until her own benefit was harmed and at the same moment, European, Chinese, Russian used lives to hold the enemies for years. I don't think US can do it if everyone is like French (dessolee, mes amis). Anyway, US did a good job and I respect that very much, but it was not a job by US ONLY.
All in all, Understanding is more helpful than Ordering.
(Sorry if you find many grammar mistakes. I was a pretty bad student in English related courses. The language of C++ is my favourate.
)
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No one forgot the Indians. You are working out of the communist inspired modern American text books. You have probably been made to believe that the Indian/white problem began 250 years after the real start, say, at Wounded Knee.
In fact when Columbus arrived, the Indians immediately attacked his people, killing 39.
Powhattan tried twice to commit genocide on John Smith's party.
The truth was that there was plenty of room for both whites and Indians. Indians, however, were at a time in the Late Stone Age when tribes were getting huge and killing and enslaving other Indians to control trade routes among themselves.
It was also unfortunate for them that rats from white ships brought the plague. At least 9 million of the 10 million of them died. But that wasn't unusual in the world, The plague was an Asian disease beginning in Mongolia where as it spread to China killed millions. Then Genghis Khan took it to the Middle East where it killed millions more. It hit Europe twice, the first time wiping out half of the whites and one third the second time.
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Unfortunately for the Indians and the whites, who were in a kind of post Medieval, early industrial age mode, neither had been through a 1960s American style integration movement.
The Indians gave us syphilis and by some accounts smallpox, but that is a pre-Columbian story that few historians even know about.
I grew up in Iowa. Whites created a very lush zone between both Sioux and the Algonquians (from memory might have been another tribe) in which each tribe could hunt and feed themselves. The Indians immediately began killing each other. Whites had to put a stop to it.
Indians weren’t colonized; they were kept at a distance.
BTW, I am the same guy who answered you about Indians. Intense Debate is requiring that I log in each day. It's driving me nuts.
I understand your concerns about the feelings of the Chinese, but I do not see that as a vaild reason for censorship. When we are talking politics, history has to be remembered without facttual distortions.
Timofeyev was the Soviet Rep in Guyana and actually spoke at Jonestown weeks before the mass murder.
Communist Angela Davis who ran for President in 1980 broadcast messages of paranoia to Jonestown residences which enabled the fateful ending. Three trusted aides were sent out of Jonestown to deliver millions of dollars to the USSR mission in Guyana. Charles Garry who was the lead attorney to the Black Panthers and lawyer Mark Lane escaped the day of the massace by talking their way past the guards and running into the jungle while hundreds of people including African-American children and old people were being murdered. Both men are still considered heroes by the far-left today.
OK OK Sir. I am speechless. Hope other readers find this very amusing. I will just be looking forward to Mr. Moriarty's next article.
Thank you autumnworm for your comment
Thanks for the corrections.
I am not blaming anyone for what happened to the Indians although I think it is a tragedy. On that situation and background, it was bad but i can understand the reasons. Past is past and we should focus on today and tomorrow. Bad things should be remembered because we (right?) don't want the tragedies happen again.
And I agree that there is no reason for censorship. However standing on a different point can help a lot to make everything more clear and create better future decisions. It is a small world now and it is becoming even smaller every day. It is interesting for me to know your points. So thank you all anyway, although we have pretty different opinions on some issues.
Have a good day everyone.
BTW: feel free to let me know for any grammar problems, professors.
Check out a great Canadian film: Black Robe, about the earliest contact between the Indians and Europeans. You won't regret it.
"However standing on a different point can help a lot to make everything more clear and create better future decisions.
I have no idea what that means.
"OK OK Sir. I am speechless."
Thank God.
He is saying sometimes you should listen instead of pointing your finger at others and make a quick and stubborn judgment, which will not help your country or yourself making a sound point at all.
As for us I am a communist and I am here reading Mr. Moriarty, autumnworm is a Chinese and he is also reading Mr. Moriarty. We are here to hear the other side story from our respected person, not to look for humiliation of our country.
bwt who gave you thumb up and me thumb down all the time? Was that by yourself? I admit I am young, but I didn't know someone is even more childish than myself.
"He is saying sometimes you should listen instead of pointing your finger at others and make a quick and stubborn judgment, which will not help your country or yourself making a sound point at all."
I am going to quote Ronald Reagan, "There you go again." Once more, you act out like a typical commie rat bully, telling everybody else what to think and say.
Your debate should be addressing the points, instead of getting upset because someone disagrees with you. Again, you confuse disagreement, which is where growth comes from, with an insult.
“As for us I am a communist and I am here reading Mr. Moriarty, autumnworm is a Chinese and he is also reading Mr. Moriarty. We are here to hear the other side story from our respected person, not to look for humiliation of our country. “
In case you haven’t noticed, Moriarty’s disgust with communism and Mao is at least if not more intense than mine. This is the second time around with this point, but if you want a private conversation, don’t post in a public forum. You have to lose that bad habit of telling others when it is ok to speak. Please reread our First Amendment.
Who put you in charge of speaking for autumnworm? The humiliation is in your head. ARGUE FACTS. I am not going to coddle you by changing history to fit your emotions. I am not going to lie for you.
Stand up like a man and figure out how to create a civilization in which the most prosper. I can assure you that if you want everybody to continue lying to you about history that you will at some point begin believing those lies and never be able to dig yourselves out of the horror Mao created.
“Bwt who gave you thumb up and me thumb down all the time?
You just don’t’ get it, do you? This a public forum. No one in this country appoints me the right to express my opinion. That is one of the main points of our civilization.
“Was that by yourself?”
I don’t require a politburo to sanction my thoughts or speech. Telling everybody else what is allowed and what isn’t is not a real conversation/debate, but a very bad habit.
I admit I am young, but I didn't know someone is even more childish than myself.”
Your father and mother might control you that way, but I am three times your age. You have a lot of growing up to do.
Washington was interesting. Many of America's founding fathers could read and write Latin and Greek. Through his classical studies, GW admired Cincinatus,. He was a Roman general who saved the Empire, but when he was offered to be made emperor, he chose to go back to his farm.
Similarly, after our revolutionaly war, many wanted to appoint Washington as our king. He refused and insisted on democracy. He is one of the main reasons we, today, have the freedoms that we do.
But you are sure you know the history. You are sure there was a masacre. It's OK to keep your belief. I just want to quit here….I am afraid Mr. Moriarty is getting annoyed by my comments here. After all he should be the major voice of this thread.
I am sorry that I didn't know you are three times age of mine (which I don't think it's true)….I appologize that I didn't show enough respect.
“Autumnworm is my friend for years!! Speaking for my friend is way better than an American trying to speak for all the Chinese, isn't it???”
Who taught you this crap? I am not speaking for anybody but myself. How do you even begin to hear such nonsense? You don’t have one example of that. This is a typical leftist debate strategy of intentionally confusing the individual with the collective society. Utilizing this nonsense, you are acting out in a way that makes you seem to have a lower IQ than you probably have. It’s a real bad habit and a loser
“Of course I know Mr. Moriarty disagrees with communism more intense than you do.”
You are making assumptions again. You have no idea how much I hate communism. The truth is that Moriarty and my experiences with communism are somewhat similar, considering the destruction that ideology has done to both of our lives. However, our social circumstances are worlds apart.
In fact, I am pulling my punch a bit, because you are so young, and I was your age once.
“But he didn't argue with me restlessly like you did.”
Probably, he isn’t arguing with you because he considers you a waste of his time. He is probably wondering why I am wasting mine.
If you had half a brain and wanted to complain about American chauvinism, your best place to begin would have been the first sentence of Moriarty’s essay: “I was a mere teenager in the fifties when it was broadcast widely that the Chinese ‘don’t really have the same love of life that we do.’” That is about as incendiary as it gets and wasn’t about China the political system but the people and Moriarty never once refuted it. He began his whole essay argumentatively insulting you.
The reason you didn’t challenge him is that you are a communist who is very afraid of central authority. You will try to justify your choice by saying the he is the respected Grand Pubah, while I, in your mind, am a nobody and you thus don’t fear me.
Come on, man up! Go straight for Moriarty’s throat and don’t let go until he explains himself.
BTW, what it will come down to is that the Chinese, North Koreans and North Vietnamese were fighting all out war. We were mostly trying to adhere to Geneva Conventions.
“Also as I said, because he always quotes from books, not from random friend or ‘woman’, I respect him.”
I have already answered that twice. The woman I was referring to was not talking about an historical fact. Did you hear it that time? If not, let me repeat it. The woman I was referring to was not talking about an historical fact. And one more time, just in case it still hasn’t got into your cortex yet. The woman I was referring to was not talking about an historical fact.
Instead she pointed out that if TianAnMen Square happened again that the government couldn’t censor that news from most Chinese. Camera cell phones would get the truth out instantly.
“Let me tell you why I don't argue with you about "facts", fo example, TianAnMen Square—-because I am not sure about history. Of course I read a lot more about it than you do, and I have certainly talked to more people of my father's age who were in TianAnMen Square during 6.4 period than you do. I made my judgment based on the above knowledge, but I am still not sure about the history, because I know everybody talks about history from his own perspective. I cannot say with preponderence of evidence that, for example, Chai Ling is wrong about 6.4, although personal feeling and moral standard tell me she is an aweful human being.”
If you aren’t arguing facts, you have no argument. If you are here as a university student, how can you not know that?
I will tell you what. Instead of continuing with your attempt to tell people you don’t agree with how they are allowed to talk to you, why not teach yourself to argue facts? As an exercise, why not list the 10 reasons you admire Mao. Why don’t you tell us why he was good for China and the world using specifics?
Arguing with people is my paid job, it's definitely not the reason I came here. I already told you I am not interested in this discussion.
The sole reason why I didn't stop replying to your post is because you write so much, and I feel sorry if I don't reply… And I told you 1000000 times I didn't challenge Mr. Moriarty because I am his fan. I guess being a fan is not a special communist thing isn't it? It doesn't mean I have to agree with him on everything. But thank you for teaching me the word "Grand Pubah"…..it's new to me.
OK Mr. PsychicDiceArt I need to leave office now. Next time I go to LA I will buy you a drink, but I really want to stop making more argument under this thread.
"Arguing with people is my paid job, it's definitely not the reason I came here. I already told you I am not interested in this discussion."
As I have already stated 2,0000,000 times, all you have to do is quit typing.
"The sole reason why I didn't stop replying to your post is because you write so much, and I feel sorry if I don't reply."
I don't believe that for a second. Even for a Chinese, it is a seriously weird way of being polite.
If I can be of help to a commie, I can't think of a more appropriate phrase than Grand Pubah to teach him. You're welcome.
I am rarely in LA, but if you come to SF, I might give you the opportunity to try to shut me up in person.
Autumnworm is my friend for years!! Speaking for my friend is way better than an American trying to speak for all the Chinese, isn't it???
Of course I know Mr. Moriarty disagrees with communism more intense than you do. But he didn't argue with me restlessly like you did. Also as I said, because he always quotes from books, not from random friend or "woman", I respect him.
Let me tell you why I don't argue with you about "facts", fo example, TianAnMen Square—-because I am not sure about history. Of course I read a lot more about it than you do, and I have certainly talked to more people of my father's age who were in TianAnMen Square during 6.4 period than you do. I made my judgment based on the above knowledge, but I am still not sure about the history, because I know everybody talks about history from his own perspective. I cannot say with preponderence of evidence that, for example, Chai Ling is wrong about 6.4, although personal feeling and moral standard tell me she is an aweful human being.
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