Hitchcock, #1 Overrated Director?: Bravo, Ben Shapiro!
by John Nolte
After Ben Shapiro first submitted the article that created such a hailstorm yesterday, here’s what our email exchange looked like:
Ben,
Hey, you’re right, Scorsese hasn’t made a movie worth a shit since ‘96, but…. David Lean??? Hitchcock??? We must have a vigorous debate over many beers.
Ben responded:
Yes, and then you can explain the plot of Mulholland Drive to me!
The only thing that comes close to the pleasure of watching movies is the pleasure of debating them. And that’s what was so invigorating about Ben’s list of the Top Ten Overrated Directors Of All Time and the just as invigorating response from the readers.
We could all come up with lists like this, lists that defy the conventional wisdom in one area or another. Taste is subjective. Certainly there are those who somehow find themselves in the enviable position of being “cinematic tastemakers.” But…
…who anointed them?
Who anoints the anointers?
Who knows?
Who cares?
There are many film writers and historians worthy of admiration for both their passion and knowledge of cinema’s rich lore and history. Off the top of my head I can’t get enough of Robert Osborne, Kurt Loder, David Thomson, Richard Schickel, and Ephraim Katz. Not to mention our own Robert Avrech and Leo Grin. Leonard Maltin’s movie guide has been a well-thumbed staple at my side for a quarter century. So I say with no offense to any these gentlemen that their opinions mean nothing to me.
As with any art medium, no matter how schooled, experienced, educated or knowledgeable, when it comes to likes and dislikes, there is no arbiter. No one knows.
I’ll take a velvet Elvis over a Picasso or Jackson Pollock Any. Day. Of. The Week. Because…
No one knows.
Certainly there are reasonable ways to objectively judge the look of a film, the performances, the score, and the other cogs that make up the wheel. But not the wheel itself, not the movie itself. That would be like judging someone’s love for another. You and everyone else may find her homely and dumb and a lousy cook, but he loves her and she makes him happy.
And I’m tired of being told what to like. I’m tired of being told that this director’s important or that film has something to say…
My personal definition of what makes a good film is a terrible one, but it’s all mine and nothing will ever change it. And so I rise from my chair, clear my throat, raise my index finger and proclaim in a booming voice dripping with authority:
A good film is one that casts a spell and doesn’t break it.
That’s it. That’s all I got. Because that’s all I want — to be transported from the everyday and taken someplace else. I’m a degenerate junkie and movies are my heroin. I am only about the high and what some beard-scratcher with elbow pads thinks of how I go about finding lift-off means nothing to me.
Sure, some part of me might understand that Citizen Kane is the “better” film. But the real part of me, that part with only so much free time, the part that craves escape after a long grueling grind of a week watches Death Wish II and Abbott and Costello Meet Whoever a whole lot more often.
There’s a school of thought that serious cinema-types must subscribe to certain schools of thought. But I don’t. Sure, I could fake it. I could write about Fellini and pretend I like watching his paint dry, but frankly I’m too lazy. Writing with passion is hard enough. Faking passion is breaking rocks with a sledge hammer.
So in the spirit of Ben Shapiro’s shot across the conventional wisdom bow, here are some thoughts of my own in the overrated department.
1. The Beatles suck.
2. People I respect tell me good things about Ingmar Bergman and Christian rock and yet while the “importance” of both washes over me, my only thought is, “Gee, this gun barrel tastes oily.”
3. I can name ten Abbott and Costello movies funnier than Duck Soup.
4. Who cares what Mulholland Drive is about, I still love it.
5. Laurel and Hardy are tedious.
6. The Magnificent Seven is so much better than The Seven Samurai.
7. Saving Silverman, DC Cab, The One and Only, and Deuce Bigalow are all funnier than Some Like it Hot.
8. Easy desert island choices: The works of Adam Sandler over Chaplin; the works of Charles Bronson over, well, anyone…
9. Titanic and Legends of the Fall turn me into a fourteen year-old girl.
10. I loved Ben’s article and loved just as much the response from everyone in the comments.
Yes, right here at Big Hollywood, let’s tear this mother down, start over, and have at it.
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432 Comments
I had an English professor who referred to certain books as "wonderful trash". She liked reading them and made no apologies. Well, I can think of any number of movies that are wonderful trash. I'd rather watch The Incredible Shrinking Man than The Rules of the Game any day of the week. And you are so right – the Seven Samuri is down right tedious compared to The Magnificent Seven.
Laurel and Hardy tedious, whereas you rate Abbot and Costello so highly? Obviously I'll have to view future comedy reviews by you in a new light. Bizzaro light that is.
Well put, John!
And I agree, a good movie takes you hostage and doesn't release you until it's over.
the good thing about opinions is that is just what they are…
We, too have opinions on films. Some of which is met with praise, and some with derision. As Mr Nolte no doubt will find. 'Duck Soup' IS pretty funny, but as a whole the Marx Bros are overrated. Laurel and Hardy are NOT funny, and Charlie Chaplin is interminable to watch. We'll take the Three Stooges any day and twice on Sundays. Charles Bronson in anything is watchable (ok, maybe not 'Mr Majestyk') but 'Telefon' rocks.
The Beatles suck? Not with you there, brother. And 'Titanic' was the silliest film we've ever seen.
Opinions, yes…
If and when Saving Silverman comes out on Blu-Ray, you should really call up the studio and volunteer to record a "fan commentary track."
I've watched a few Bergman and Fellini films – I can appreciate the craft and their place in history but it doesn't mean I'm gonna rush out and buy the Criterion boxset either.
I've got a few thoughts
-I love the Marx Brothers and the Three Stooges but I never got into Abbott and Costello. (Sorry…)
-I like Timothy Dalton's James Bond films (The Living Daylights and Licence to Kill)
-Innerspace and Robocop are close to perfect movies
-If Congo is on at 2 in the morning, I need to finish it
-I love Alien and Aliens but I also love Alien 3 (in its extended form)
-I still haven't seen Some Like It Hot but if you insist Saving Silverman and D.C. Cab are funnier, then Brain Donors is probably funnier as well
That's all for now. I don't have a lot of sacred cows to break since I still haven't seen every classic movie ever made. I will conclude with this:
I HATED HATED HATED Bringing Up Baby. Give me Arsenic and Old Lace or His Girl Friday anytime.
I agree…the Beatles suck. In a fingernail meet chalkboard sort a way.
Really, at the end of the day, we're all just looking for a really good manipulation.
I'm homely, dumb, and a lousy cook. Doesn't make me a bad person !
P.S. "Duck Soup" and anything by Laurel & Hardy are Glories of Western Civilization
but John . . . I do know what Mulholland Drive is all about. The Beatles, by definition are overrated, but to say they suck deems, well, just a tad harsh.
C'mon. This is a tired debate. Yes, there is a large subjective component into what is great art. And, clearly, we can talk about which is "better." But, to deny there are standards by which one can judge great art? It speaks to the kind of relativism that values John Cage's 4'33 seconds over Bach's Brandenburg Concertos. The discipline, the mastery of craft are simply not in the same universe. You're taking a page from the "deconstructionists" – my pile of trash, or a crucifix in urine is as good as the Mona Lisa.
I prefer my kindergartener's drawings to Picassos, but to say that therefore Picasso is not an "artist" is ridiculous. There IS such a thing as great art, and then there is my or your preference – whether we LIKE the great art or not.
I mean, soon you'll be attacking good grades, the SAT as hallmarks of who's a good "student". I mean whose to say what makes a good "student" after all?
YES…YES….someone else who thinks the Beatles suck.
1. Revolver is way the hell better than Sergeant Pepper's.
1a. Pet Sounds is not only better than Revolver, but the best thing to come out of the Sixties.
2. Anyone who puts Hitchcock not merely on, but at the top of a list of Most Overrated Directors is not to be taken seriously. They are interested not in stimulating discussion, but in iconoclasm for iconoclasm's sake.
3. The Three Stooges were more consistently funny than the Marx Brothers.
4. I've laughed my fucking ass off at Larry the Cable Guy.
5. Anyone who thinks that animation, as an art form, is strictly for children needs a good stern lecture, if not a kick in the seat of the pants.
6. I don't find Monty Python as funny now as I did when I was fifteen.
6a. Life of Brian and The Meaning of Life aren't fucking funny at ALL. In my opinion it's a toss-up as to which actually sucks worse.
7. Anyone who finds jazz music "boring" should never again be allowed within four yards' distance of a jukebox, phonograph, CD player, MP3 player, or any computer running iTunes.
8. Nobody will ever top Audrey Hepburn.
Meh, there is a difference between making a provocative point and being an internet troll.
You, Nolte, often do the former (which is why I like your posts), but the Shapiro kid only does the latter. I don't know, maybe it gets the site a lot of hits, but overall I don't think he is a credit to this blog. His posts are always very tedious, but this recent list was just ridiculous. Not because I disagreed with his choices per se, but rather because he didn't really seem to have any rhyme or reason for it at all. That post is the very definition of trolling.
I don't mind people having opinions that are outside of the box, only as long as they have some intelligence to back it up.
For instance, it's hard to take anybody's opinion of anyone at my school on movies consider all they see is dreck like G.I. Joe or Transformers.
Since you seem to watch more movies than I have, I'll take it you know what you are talking about, even if your opinions isn't as important as mine.
I agree in part about point #1. The Beatles are wildly overrated. The true rock gods of that era were, are, and will continue to be, The Rolling Stones.
Gosh, now I feel like my last 10 years of training in literature were all for nothing. There's nothing I can teach my students about literary value because there's no such thing as an objective standard. Their opinions are just as accurate without any training. I'm so depressed. I'm not an arbiter of taste, just someone who has been trained (or so I though all this time) to recognize literary value. But still, why did I bother to get my Ph.D.? I have no more mature or valid opinion about literature than a 15-year-old high school student in shop class. You've ruined my day Mr. Nolte.
The tastemakers annoint themselves, then get everybody else to jump aboard their cool kid train.
It's sad, but people really just want to be part of what they see as the 'in' clique. Movie fans are no exception.
Bingo. See my post above.
I think Raging Bull is a steaming pile of excrement – and I think Rocky 4 kicks all kinds of arse.
Matt Damon is not an action star and the Bourne movies are comedies disguised as action flicks.
George Clooney is not the Jimmey Stewart, Humprey Bogart or Gary Cooper of our time.
2001 is pretentious crap!
I forgive all when someone badmouths 'Some Like it Hot'. I once watched that thing in a film class surrounded by a bunch of people who laughed even less than I, and they still came away talking about how brilliant it was.
I went home and watched 'Three Amigos'.
Amen on "Arsenic and Old Lace."
the sinner,
Patrick
Point Break might be the best movie ever. There, I said it. Now I feel better.
HERETIC! Heretic! How DARE you so defile the glory that is "Duck Soup." Once cannot compare perfection except to perfection – say, "Animal Crackers."
Yeah, opinion is opinion, but let us not wander off the cliff of absolute relativism, even in this arena.
the sinner,
Patrick
John –
You complete me. Having said that, Duck Soup is awesome and Abbot and Costello suck.
And, YES, the Beatles are WAY overrated. If I had a nickel for every time a Baby Boomer told me in the 1970's and 1980's how we will be listening to the Beatles 200 years later – like Beethoven and Mozart, then…well..I'd have a lot of nickels. Fact is… Beatles are no better (or worse) than hundreds of other bands – it is just that the Baby Boomers were so self-important as a group that they really thought they had INVENTED music!
Everyone knows WE invented music in the 80's.
Everyone has opinions, and is entitled to hold one. Reasonable people understand that their opinions ought to be supported by evidence, lest they be put on somone's "10 Most Overrated Commentators Of All Time" list, and once you're squarely on that list, you may be risking your credibility and the credibility of those who publish you. The problem with Shapiro's article, IMHO, is that there was a wont of "in my opinion" – it had that definitive (or perhaps smug, or confrontational – even modifiers are opinions, I suppose), "this-is-the-way-it-is". I suspect he will grow out of it, but until he does, he has to be willing to accept the volume of contrary opinions, and to step back into the fray to defend his own opinion. That another Big Hollywood writer should either volunteer or be drafted to defend Shapiro does little to support the original piece or to sway the, what, 500 responses? IMHO.
Wonderful article. Sometimes I like to have my tastes challenged (unless it's done hatefully); blind fandom is never pretty. Here's some riotously unpopular opinions from yours truly:
Black Sabbath is a better band than Led Zepplin.
Mike makes me laugh more than Joel does.
The Dark Knight is way too long. About 30 minutes of the movie amounts to dead air (it's still a good flick, though).
Larry is the funniest Stooge.
The Addams Family was, at its time, one of the edgiest, cleverest shows on television.
The Lord of the Rings trilogy is at least 60% people staring out over a forbidding horizon. If you cut out all the scenes of Viggo and Elijah Wood looking despondently into the camera, the whole schmeer is only about 45 minutes long.
And that's why I, sir, am an idiot.
Bobbo is correct above. The voices on Big Hollywood are the last ones I would expect to promote such relativism.
This is true, despite his searing and perceptive criticism that "Alien is slow." Shapiro is way too wet behind the ears to be making posts like that.
Let's get into metacriticism, where we criticise different forms of criticism:
Subjectiveism – What Mr. Nolte is advocating, what one finds funny/good/boring one finds funny/good/boring, every list is personal, and therefore irrefutable.
Objectiveism – There are objective good and bad films, which can be assessed either by experts (objective-eletism) or by popular appeal (objective-mobism/democracticism).
Iconoclasism – What is held up as a good film must have flaws, and must be ridiculed as trash in order to obtain the proper distance to appreciate what those flaws truly are.
Trivialism – It's all too unimportant to get worked up about, therefore it's fun to get worked up about it when I choose that, and dull to get worked up about when I choose that.
What other metas do we see at work in this thread?
So true. I thought at Big Hollywood I'd be safe from the chaotic relativist mindset I encounter so often everywhere else.
The problem with Shapiro's article, IMHO, is that there was a wont of "in my opinion" – it had that definitive (or perhaps smug, or confrontational – even modifiers are opinions, I suppose), "this-is-the-way-it-is".
That's it — that's what bugged me so much about the article. I couldn't lay a finger on it until now. The most annoying thing about it was that it was written in an authoritative, almost arrogant voice that seemed to assert its personal opinions as matters of objective fact. There's no "This is why I think Hitchcock is overrated" — it's just "Hitchcock is overrated", phrased as though there's nothing further to argue. It reminds me of Ayn Rand at her lowest moments.
Another vote for Larry!
Brilliantly subtle, understated nuances that hark back to the milieu of Moliere, and presage the present post-modern apathy.
P.S. I'm full of it, ain't I? Nyuk Nyuk !
Ya know, it's funny. I'm 26 and my folks first sat me down to watch Duck Soup when I was only 10 or 11. I loved it. Then I watched Animal Crackers and I didn't think it was that funny (except for Harpo's schtick).
However, today I love Animal Crackers just as much if not more than Duck Soup. I've caught gags and references that obviously went over my head the first time around (especially the "Strange Interlude" scene).
"The world would be a much better place if the parents had to eat the spinach."
David Letterman hasn't been funny in about 20 years and I would still rather watch Leno than any of the other current hosts.
I don't think the Beatles suck, but I do think they're overrated.
I am not looking forward to The Who performing at the Super Bowl – Daltry can't hit high notes any more.
I don't want Led Zeppelin to get back together for the same reason – Plant can't hit the high notes.
I don't think the soft drinks with real sugar taste any better than the regular versions with corn syrup.
I think Hooters actually has good food (and so does my wife).
I don't think "Citizen Kane" is all that great a movie – innovative yes, but not that great otherwise.
I also think Hendrix is overrated as a guitar player – like "Citizen Kane", he was innovative, but not that great technically.
I think "Blazing Saddles" is one of the top 5 funniest movies ever.
I think "Who's on First" may be the single funniest piece of comedy ever conceived.
unfortunately most of the debates i have now about movies are "do you want to see this?" NO! quality has long been replaced by quantity and 10 years from now Ben will be resubmitting that list as the 10 most underrated directors.
Also, I love The Postman. Yeah, there, I said it. I love it when Will Patton chews up the scenery with "You want a war?… I'll GIVE you a war!" And Dennis Hopper makes Waterworld watchable, too.
2001 is beautiful genius.
If Bloodsport is on, I will stop down and watch it. Every time.
I don't like the Marx Brothers or the Three Stooges.
I've fallen asleep four times trying to watch Psycho from start to finish.
To "Duck Soup" lovers – I am supervising an independent study for a very smart 22-year old college senior. We were talking about why people join fraternal organizations and I repeated Groucho Marx's line about "Not wanting to belong to anything that would have me as a member." My student looked at me and said "Who's Groucho Marx?" Talk about making you feel old!!!
As for the rest, I can only say to Messrs Nolte and Shapiro….. "I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY disagree with what you say but will defend to the death your right to say it." Alfred Hitchcock was THE BOMB! (Hope I am using that term correctly.)
I agree totally. A Ph.D. in literature or any other liberal art is worthless.
As someone who vigorously criticized Shapiro's initial post, I can assure The Former Dirty Harry that I don't have anything per-se against someone not liking Hitchcock or anyone else. What I have something against (a lot, actually) is his specific post — its schoolboy fact errors, its pronunciamento tone, and its utter lack of argument and support that might make a discussion with him over beer *actually worthwhile.* Yes, subjectiveness are *IN* every aesthetic judgement, but that doesn't mean every aesthetic judgement is NOTHING BUT subjectivity. That way lies nihilism.
And nobody is trying to tell you or anybody else what to like. Only, at most, to recognize that artistic canons exist. And that if one DOESN'T like a canonized work or body of work, then it's incumbent on that persons to state reasons in a way that is less so for the person who likes it. Yes, this is unequal, but that argument should only persuade nihilistic liberals. Aren't conservatives supposed to stand for Tradition, for the settled ways that represent the accumulated wisdom of the past, like in artistic canons that liberals tried to trash as oppressive during the campus wars of the 80s and 90s? Or are we now all radical subjectivists all the way down.
Rocky IV is awesome.
2001 is likewise awesome. But I'm a science geek, so take it with a grain of salt.
I admit I was probably too harsh on Ben. I mean, I did not have to roll his house and egg his car.
But he is wrong on REAR WINDOW.
Very. Wrong.
Some Like It Hot is not funny. I love Jack Lemmon and Marilyn Monroe, but there's just no there there.
Hot Fuzz and it's tribute to Point Break are better.
I meant to say "forboding" instead of "forbidding." I really am, sir, an idiot!
I genuinely love it that the following statements will put me in the minority on a FILM SITE discussion board. Wonderful!
> The "Seven Samurai" could kick the asses of the Magnificent Seven. It would be a whirlwind of Samurai pigtails, a shiny shaved (Japanese) head, and a banshee shriek from Toshiro Mifune..and then silence and the dust settles over the formerly Magnificent, now Dead 7. I loved "Samurai" from the first time I saw it and am glad somebody told me I should. I could watch it every week. Love the characters, the pacing, the length. Love it.
> Same goes for "8 1/2". Love it, makes me laugh with it and at it. One of the best self-conscious things about the creative process…and it makes fun of French "intellectual" film auteurs as well as showing funny European people dancing.
> Agree w/ Jake. I'll still talk to you and be your friend if you show ignorant dislike about jazz…but I will never respect you.
The casting of Elijah Wood ruined LotR for me. I'm a fan from way back and seeing Frodo as a 13 year-old little girl really took me out of the movie.
…and while we're at it…
> "Dumb and Dumber" absolutely slays me whereas Chaplin makes me chuckle sometimes. I can't shake the sense that this makes me an unredeemably bad person, but a flicker of the memory of Jeff Daniels holding on to the toilet seat to avoid blasting himself into the air makes me burst into laughter…at times even as I'm falling asleep…or in the middle of a lecture.
> "Serenity" and "Dark City" are both better than the "Matrix"
> Saying that the Beatles suck (not just that they're overrated) is just stupid, but arguing with those who say this is pointless. Can't make up for the fact that mama didn't love 'em enough…
You, sir, are a heretic. Bringing Up Baby is high-larious from beginning to end. Grant and Hepburn have yet to be equalled.
Someone is confused. David Lean (Bridge on the River Kwai) did not direct Mulholland Drive, that was David Lynch. Any one who confuses the two should spend some time in a Japanese hot box.
I'm soooo glad I refused to get an education !
"Wonderful trash" is a great expression– one I'll be using to describe most of what I read and watch.
I'm 26 and I love the Marx Brothers so don't feel too bad!
And Groucho's line is the same one I give when people ask why I'm an independent.
7. Saving Silverman, DC Cab, The One and Only, and Deuce Bigalow are all funnier than Some Like it Hot.
BLASPHEMY!!!
Rocky V does not exist as far as I'm concerned– but the rest are among my favorites– but you're right, Rocky IV rules.
I imagine Shapiro would be a blast to watch movies with, because you never know how much LSD he's on.
It was" 8 1/2 " that matured me from " movie-watcher " to " cinema lover ".
"The problem with Shapiro's article, IMHO, is that there was a wont of 'in my opinion' – it had that definitive (or perhaps smug, or confrontational – even modifiers are opinions, I suppose), 'this-is-the-way-it-is'"
Do you think critics think they're scientists? No. Fault him for being too strident or too close-minded, or whatever. But to be angry at him for not adding: "IMHO" every line pulls you down to the level of a junior high kid. They love to have exchanges like:
"Well, yeah, but that's just your opinion!"
"It's a fact!"
"It's your opinion that it's a fact."
"No,. it's a fact that it's a fact, so nanna-nanna-boo-boo"
"Hey, Aaaaabboooott!"
Just hearing that as a kid could make me crack up.
Shapiro's article was crap. (Consider replacing him with DZ from the Hollywood-Elsewhere site if all you want to do is throw out stupid opinions to get comments and debates.)
Simple Mr. Nolte. Objective questions vs. subjective questions. One has an absolute answer, the other has no absolute answer.
Dr. Thomas Sowell describes the difference using the building of a football stadium. The exact dimensions of the field, the marking of lines, the number of end zones, all those questions are objective, and can be positively answered by consulting the NFL rule book. Nothing fuzzy, or gray, they are simple yes or no questions. They are objective.
Now, where to build the stadium, and how to pay for it? Those are subjective questions. There is no right or wrong.
The Three Amigos is one of my favorites (best western ever made)! I watched it twice in the theater when it came out in the 80s, bought the video, and now have the DVD.
"Excuse me, are you the singing bush?"
Everyone has a different taste for movies, art, etc. But some stuff is crap…no matter what.
Then again, most average people who had a crap week at work liked Transformers 2, John.
Just sayin…
A doctorate in regurgitation of what others have said, or navel gazing. (Looks like a troll posting, but I will keep it anyway).
I tried to watch Wild Strawberries last night but gave up after just 10 minutes.
Though I hear he does like The Rutles ; )
For an aggie, you seem smart! I must ponder this….
Okay this is going to be long and involve several posts. Read if want . . . or don’t.
Can a conservative website dedicated to conservatism and entertainment actually promote "relativism" when it comes to entertainment (movies, books, music, art, etc.). Well I don't think "entertainment relativism" is the same as "moral relativism". I read books, listen to music and watch movies usually for the same reason that Nolte does – to be entertained. I'm not always looking for something deep, although if it winds up being deep, I'm pleasantly surprised and accept that as a plus part to the package.
Cont'd
My best example is this: Steinbeck, Hemingway – they are considered great novelists are they not? They are always taught in literature classes, right? Well, I was an English Lit minor and I HATED THEM BOTH. Boring, horrible dialogue, never got into the characters or the stories. Just hated them. Want to know what I love: good sci-fi stories that keep me riveted. I love Frank Herbert, Dune being my all time favorite series. I loved Harry Potter and read the first 5 books in a week and a half, that's how riveted they kept me. I love Stephen King's classic stuff (Carrie, etc.) and they also kept me riveted. I read IT in a day and a half (all 1100 + pages).
Again, why? Because I was riveted and entertained.
Cont'd
Now, I have read some non-conventional stuff that I enjoyed, but mostly because it was being shown to me, or I was reading it, in an specific context provided by a third party – an interpretation of the book or movie that made it interesting, but not necessarily because the book or movie was interesting, but because the third party's interpretation of it made it interesting. Reading it on my own, or watching it on my own would have probably produced a different response.
So I agree with Nolte 100%. Most of the critiques of entertainment mediums like movies, books, etc. are SUBJECTIVE. I mean, Titanic may have done very well. But that was because a bunch of love-sick 13 year olds went to see it over and over again. But so did a bunch of grown women who thought it was also romantic. Does that mean I'm an idiot because I liked it and someone else didn't. See, that's what is at the heart of this subject for me. I get tired of it because it is elitist. If you don't like Steinbeck or some other famous writer, you must be an idiot. If you liked the Twilight series, you're an idiot. If you liked Titanic, you're an idiot.
Cont'd
Maybe I am just entertained by something different than you are. Big deal. You like Steinbeck or [fill in the blank] and think the sun rises and sets in the crack of his/her/its behind? Great! It neither picks my pocket, nor does me harm, to use a great quote from Thomas Jefferson.
Not to say that you can't debate whether something is good or bad; it's fun. And I do it as well. But when the debate turns into a "who's more intelligent than who" peeing contest, I'm done. I can debate the facts about why I thought something was good or not, but I can't stand it when it turns elitist.
Cont'd
I think that's all that Nolte was saying and frankly, I think that is a very "conservative" way to be – we don't think the gov't knows better than we do, so why should we think that other groups of people know better than we do as to what is ENTERTAINING. There are many movies that I'm sure people think I should see and that I just won't see because they are not my bad and I'm sure I'll survive without seeing them. Same with books, and especially with art. Art to me is a picture of something where I can actually figure out what the hell it is. If I can't identify it, or if it looks like my five year old could do better, than it's just not art TO ME. But if someone else thinks it's art, well whatever.
Of course, art that is meant to be offensive (like crosses in urine) is a whole other thing – I think most of us can agree that art that is meant to be offensive is just that – offensive, and while there is freedom of expression to contend with I see nothing wrong with calling it out for what it is – crap.
Laurel and Hardy tedious? How dare you, sir! The 3 Stooges, they're tedious (although the actual dialogue is hilarious).
I thought Mulholland Drive was about hot chicks making out.
There's Something About Mary and Being John Malkovich both sucked big time!
Hand-held camera, mockumentary sitcoms like The Office should not be on the air. Although Arrested Development doesn't fall into this category, it still sucked big time too.
The Empire Strikes Back was the best of all six Star Wars movies.
Everytime I sew the scene were the bird's head falls off, I almost die laughing! And then they sell it to a blind kid. S**t!
Great flick!
Best Futurama line: "Awww, how come needy people get all the good stuff." Fry.
The best deconstruction of the TLR trilogy is in Clerks 2. Randal's 2 minute summation is the best: "It's a bunch of hobbits walking around for 9 hours."
Just to expand on this post: The reason why everyone gets defensive on lists of these types is because we all get possessive about the things we love, be it people, movies, food, etc. When someone questions or challenges a choice we make we often internalize it as a personal attack. If you take it in the spirit its given, the debates can be fun. When we don't is when people get vicious.
That being said, I can't get enough of QT, thought Inglorious Basterds was glorious, and anytime Baseketball comes on I get stuck watching the entire thing again and again. Have at it
Wait, how was Shapiro's article in any way, shape or form serious? I mean, his whole argument against David Lean was that his film are too long. That by you is invigorating criticism? Say what you will about the wrong-headedness of Michael Moriarty's and the Alien Nation guy's recent posts about "Casablanca" and "It's a Wonderful Life," respectively, but at least they attempted to lay out a substaintive arguement.
Nowhere in Shaprio's entire post did he even ATTEMPT to put together anything remotely resembling a persuasive argument. Now if you are going to argue that the films of celebrated directors, films that are celebrated by both audiences and critics, are overrated, then at least make a case for it (I mean, he IS a lawyer, right?). Sorry, but "it was too long" when it comes to something on the order of "Bridge on the River Kwai" says more about the critic's shallowness of thought than anything about the film-making prowess of David Lean.
Um, a good student gives more right than wrong answers…right and wrong are not relative in many school subjects, even today. They can tell us that 2+2 equals 5 in any number of ways in modern education….the fact that it still doesn't work in math problems gives us hope to prove them wrong about the relativism in other areas! Personally, I think Citizen Kane may have been the worst ninety minutes or so of my life!
Where would this site be without baseless, mindless hate?
Why don't you just turn this into the partisan political site this blog desperately wants to be, and forget about the Hollywood angle. Just say, we hate everything that liberals like, entertainment-wise, and move on.
Hmmm…
1. Vertigo is brilliant, but not for everyone. I get that. I try not to ram it down anyone's throat.
2. North By Northwest is brilliant, and it is for everyone. If you don't like it, time to quit watching movies.
3. The Beatles are overrated AND underrated. They are overrated for their childish pop-style early stuff but the musical brilliance of their (especially Revolver-era) work is waaaaayyyy underrated
4. I don't get why everyone hates U-571. I really don't.
5. The Good German isn't as bad as everyone thinks it is. It's worse.
6. Adam Sandler has delivered at least 3 Oscar-worthy performances.
7. Best Picture of 2007 is a toss up between Gone Baby Gone and The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford.
8. Film Noir needs to come back but their are very few directors today that I would trust with the genre.
9. My favorite kind of music is late 70's/early 80's punk and post-punk. It was a rebellion against the decadence and grandiosity of the 70's. Everyone should appreciate that.
10. There is only one Hitchcock. But if there were a director worthy of inheriting some part of Hitch's legacy it is not M. Night Shyamalan. It's Christopher Nolan.
Re: Star Wars – Mark Hamill does an excellent job in "Return of the Jedi." Look at the character arc from Episodes 4-6 and how Hamill pulls it off. From whiny prodigy to conflicted and tempted young adult on to an almost weary superpowered hero faced with the cost of "saving the world." Good stuff and wayy underappreciated acting.
Compare to Harrison "I didn't really want to be in this one" Ford by the time you get to "Jedi."
I too loved The Postman…
Ditto on 80s music. That decade rocked! Reagan and 80s music.
We can only hope that you will now teach accordingly…."This is what I think, and why. Now go out there and THINK FOR YOURSELF!!!
Who's on first… best… comedy skit… ever…
Most embarrassingly, Mad Max and the Poseidon Adventure were my favorite action movies when I was a kid. I watched Tron more than once and Goonies is priceless.
Most overrated personality of the 20th century: Marilyn Monroe. Played the same plastic character in every one of her films.
Most overrated actress: La Hepburn, Kate the Not-So-Great. Her Yankee affectations and mannerisms are grating to say the least.
I still have to watch the climatic dogfight everytime Top Gun is on.
Speaking of which, I can't completely rag on Tom Cruise because he has made many entertaining movies. Thought he was great in Rainman, Top Gun, and the Color of Money.
Pretty Woman is the most annoying film ever made and Julia Roberts' stork walk is not pretty at all. This is mistakenly called a chick flick. However, I firmly believe more men watch it than women. It's a sick fantasy thing.
I am heartened by the Three Stooges prolific fandom here at BH. I consider Jerome "Curly" Howard to be the most underrated and underappreciated comedian ever. I put him above Chaplin.
Give me Showbread over The Beatles any day.
Frank Capra is underrated.
"I Don't Know"…… Third Base !
I have disagree with your opinion of Seven Samurai, The outcome of bringing a knife, even a big knife to a gunfight is never very good!
Ditto on 1, 2, and definitely 5. I don't know if you were around when Mr. Nolte ran his last website but his reviw of The Good German is classic stuff. I don't even hate George Clooney – it's simply a bad movie.
http://dirtyharrysplace.com/?p=6031
I had a English professor once say that more people would rather read Jackie Collins than Edith Wharton and if they say they don't, they are lying.
Ditto on 1, 2, and definitely 5. I don't know if you were around when Mr. Nolte ran his last website but his review of The Good German is classic stuff.
http://dirtyharrysplace.com/?p=6031
Amen to the Stooges. As far as parody and satire, "You Nazty Spy!" is the best WWI satire ever, succinct and eminently more watchable than "The Great Dictator" or "A Night in Casablanca."
Love it! Love it! Love it!
I don't really care for Scorcesee, Goodfellas felt long and boring. All mafia movies have the same arch – everybody's having fun at the begining, and then times change and they get desparate – just like like Boogie Nights.
I HATED 8 1/2
Terry Gilliam is in love with his own images. His movies are interesting at first and get tedious.
You DO mean "emotional manipulation," don't you?
Nolan's storytelling method in Memento is definitely a gimmick worthy of Hitchcock.
One last note … Aerosmith is the best American band of all time. Beach Boys are next.
To me part of the new Conservatism is that old ideas (even about things as silly as directors and musicians) can finally be turned over and taken apart.
The vital thing is that we define precisely how this is different from what liberal postmodernists do.
Oh, and I'd agree that Duck Soup is overrated. It's supposed to be an "important" Marx Brothers movie because it satirized fascism at a time when fascism seemed to be engulfing Europe. Maybe so, but I don't think it can compare with Animal Crackers and A Night at the Opera. And frankly, once you've seen those two flicks, you've seen about all the Marx Brothers you need to see. Everything else is just more of the same – only not as good.
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