‘New Moon’ Trailer Arrives
by John NolteKnowing nothing about the source material, “Twilight” caught me completely by surprise – which is the only excuse I have for falling pretty hard for a longing, dew-eyed romance aimed at teenage girls. “Twilight’s” has its flaws, but underneath the vampirism-pathos was a surprisingly old-fashioned love story set in a small American town not filled with Hollywood stereotypes. Goodwill goes a long way and helps to forgive much (like weak special effects and listless action scenes), but “Twilight” earned plenty of goodwill with parents everywhere using metaphor as a way to teach teenage girls that true love is not based on sex.
“Twilight” is all about the self-restraint of both appetite and passion. Also playing an important thematic role is the importance of self-sacrifice, loyalty and family. It’s awfully hard not to like a film aimed at teens that’s so unapologetically earnest and well-intended. In this cinematic age of nihilism, moral relativism and hyper-sexualization of young girls, ”Twilight” should be hailed as the work of iconoclasts.
Director Catherine Hardwicke is unfortunately not returning for the sequel, which opens this November. She’s a fascinating and complex filmmaker — hard to pigeonhole. A former production designer, her debut “Thirteen,” was one of the most interesting films of 2003, and I would argue (and have), one of the most conservative of the last ten years. Her sensibility which stamped the first, will hopefully set the tone for the rest.
The “New Moon” above trailer looks like more of the same.
Nothing wrong with that.
Email this to a friend | Print |
Share on Facebook
| Tweet this
| 
Follow Us on Twitter
Subscribe via RSS
Tips & Feedback
130 Comments
I wanted to like "Twilight." I tried to read it. But the "vampires" shimmered. Really!? I just can't bring myself to go along with that. It's wrong in so many ways….
I didn't like the books but I did think they'd do better on screen. Anybody have thoughts about why it's easier to make a terrific movie from a mediocre book but so many "great book" movies flop?
If you're only qualification for "wholesome" is that the main characters don't have sex, I suppose it applies. Personally, I found the entire book to be both tedious and disturbing on multiple levels.
(Some are slightly spoilerific, from the book, though I tried to be vague and some may not mean exactly what you would expect them to mean.)
1. It's ok to lie about every aspect of your boyfriend to your parent because "he wouldn't understand"
2. Parents are oblivious and mostly non-existent
3. Of course you are going to be suicidal when separated from the SO, after all he is your true love and you can absolutely be certain of that at 17
4. It's perfectly fine to have the boyfriend sneak into your bedroom after Dad goes to sleep and watch you while you sleep, so long as you don't actually have sex with him.
5. Oh, and it's perfectly alright to go around the boyfriend's back to make life-altering decisions that affect him, after all, he'll come around to your thinking at some point.
It's not unfortunately that Hardwicke isn't coming back. She did fine with the first one, but – according to Meyer and the production company – wanted to completely rewrite the second installment. It was my least favorite of the series, but I guess I'm in that minority of folks who go to adaptation films wanting to see a visual representation of the written work, not a director's "improvement" on the original story (cf. OotP).
Sorry, Jennifer, but I love that Saga. Meyer is a very good storyteller, the kind that can drag one from one page to the next with no problem. The hero is a "gentleman", which I have said many times is a great term that has disappeared from our world for some 40 years. It is nice to have it back, and I hope that young girls demand that their boyfriends behave in a 'gentlemanly' manner. There is one moment: our heroine doesn't want to go to a school dance because she is awkward; her loved one notes that there will be no problem because 'it's all in the leading'.
The relationships are of course, magical, ie, vampires, werewolves, but at its heart, the story is unabashedly about True Love and making the Right Moral Choices. Who cannot at least honor such a story, even if you cannot stand fairy tales?
I don't like Twilight at all. Give me Buffy the Vampire Slayer, instead (the tv version, not the awful movie).
*spoiler*
Apparently at some point in the series the two main characters have a baby together. I had a coworker railing about how some friends of hers had forbidden their daughter to read that book in the series. She thought it was because he was a vampire. Without having read the books myself or knowing any more than that, my private guess was more that the parents didn't like the idea of their daughter reading about an unwed teen having a baby, but I could be wrong knowing so little about the books.
Amen!
*actual spoiler*
They get married first. FYI.
I'm sorry Another Carolyn and sqt, but you were both off the day we sent the memo about banning folks who bad mouth the "Buffy" movie which raw-huwks in too many ways to count.
Now if you would both please just initial here ___ here ___ and here ___ that you've been warned….
Thank you.
Shoot. First Lawhawk bans me for mentioning some untalented actress named Buffalo or something and now this. I haven't been shunned like this since college.
If you keep this up, they'll expel you and send you to that special school for troubled kids. . . hufpo.
"definite spoiler": The vampire and the human are MARRIED first. Then they go on a honeymoon and she gets pregnant, and he finds out that such pregnancies lead to the mother's ghastly death, and so he wants her to have an abortion, but she doesn't WANT an abortion because she loves the baby inside her; and she almost dies (the pregnancy is very weird), however, all ends well, and the baby is wonderful and magical and the mother's life is saved by her beloved husband who transforms her into a vampire…. but then… there are the evillll Volturi who take up the rest of the book. A totally great story.
Many people hate that pregnancy thing because (a) the heroine CHOOSES to go through with a very dangerous pregnancy; and (b) the actual birth is quite awful (although women who have themselves given birth are probably not as shocked as those who have not done so…)
Are you sure they didn't "shimmy"?
I am so with you on that — if they're going to turn a book into a movie, turn the book into the movie. If they want to rework the book into something else, then don't tell us how faithful you were to the book.
I'm sure I can count on you to defend me, Andrew.
Would it be wrong to report this comment for the images in conjured in my head?
Sounds like you're the one with the dirty mind!
Agreed. I'm still waiting for a half way decent movie version of Richard Matheson's I Am Legend.
Absolutely. This is the worst outrage I've ever encountered as an attorney! I am horrified that this can happen in this day and age in America.
(You can pay my fee right?)
Pay your fee? Where's your empathy, Andrew?
The Twilight series is a disgrace to the feminist movement where a female's self image and worth is all wrapped up in a male. I'm not a femmi-nazi at all but when a girl attempts suicide because her man left there's something wrong. I appreciate certain aspects of the story but as a whole it goes downhill from the first book…the last book to me was like poorly written fan fiction….and really as a vampire enthusiast I would rather my vampires not sparkle! Give me Dracula any day of the week! (Preferably Langella's 1979 version)
The Volturi are awesome…the best part of the entire series and two of my favorite actors (Christopher Heyerdahl and Michael Sheen) are some of the Volturi so sorry Edward and posse I'm rooting for the other team.
I couldn't agree more. I was appalled to discover that the books essentially teach young girls to devote themselves entirely to a man/husband/boyfriend rather than lead their own lives, pursue higher education/careers, etc. It's quite reprehensible — and I'm no feminist either!
Bella's pregnancy was disturbing…and also resembled the pregnancy storylines of Angel and Roswell. Is it just me or the whole imprinting thing between Jacob and Renesme (? it's been awhile) just kinda pedophile-istic? Why is it creepy when a grown male in real life attaches himself to a young child but in a novel girls swoon?
P.S. To Whom It May Concern Is there a reason I'm stuck at 39 points? I've been at 39 points for a few months and I'm hoping that the system will hiccup and I'll get my other points added but it hasn't happened yet…do I need to join some special club?
Nah, I wouldn't have chucked the book across the room if they shimmied. It would have been more interesting.
Believe it or not, I preferred the Vincent Price version to the Will Smith version. The Will Smith version was just a bland action flick (also they missed far too many opportunities to improve the movie). At least the Vincent Price version kept the intellectual concepts and asked some cool philosophical questions.
Plus, it has a guy named "Price" in it.
My dog ate it.
Duly noted. Though I didn't hate the movie. I was commenting more on the preference of "Buffy" to "Twilight."
Hmmm, the series sounds as if it gets interesting. I may have to rethink my prejudice against it. Soo, thanks. I think.
what is this whole "point" thing anyway? I wanna compete too! Tell me how.
I don't think there's an official "Big Hollywood Handbook" that you can look to as your guide so I'll try to explain it. The points are basically people "agreeing" with you and in agreeing with you they give your post a thumbs up. It's sort of like reputation…those with the big numbers (like AndrewPrice and others in the elite 100+) have a great reputation but others (like random cyborg people that come here to stir up trouble) have like -85 you know that they're basically full of crap whenever they post.
You're able to participate in this is to sign up for an account! It's free and it's fun so you should totally do it.
the story is a FAIRY TALE. It is a ROMANCE. Its subtext of 'making the right, moral choices' in life, and further, emphasizing that choices are important and possible even in the most difficult of situations; and having a hero who is a gentleman (imagine!), and recalling Anne of Green Gables and Wuthering Heights is most admirable.
I wondered when we would see 'feminism' dragged into this. Gosh. Bella the heroine LIKES to cook supper for her father!! She loves her vampire lover. She does not dream of Dartmouth and a government job with a great pension plan. She does not agonize about self actualization. She is kind and helpful to her relatives and her friends.
Although she DOES write an essay on the misogyny of Shakespeare… is that OK??
The points have been in limbo since one of the Intense Debate format changes. I have no idea if our points will start registering again.
I like the Price version. Will Smith needs to stay away from genre classics after the abominations known as I, Robot and I Am Legend. I do like the Charlton Heston version, The Omega Man. It's just not I Am Legend.
There's much more than just Bella enjoying being a wife and housewife…I could care less if a woman's dream is having a house and home. I'm not referring to that aspect at all. I'm speaking more about her attitude and perception of Edward (especially in the last book) becomes her "salvation". Bella was not living until she was "saved" by Edward which in real life translates that they are not "living" unless they have a guy with them. Comparing the Twilight series to AoGG and WH isn't really valid because even though they may have things in common things are completely different. Remember Anne was an independent female who did not NEED Gilbert to survive or have self value. I'm not saying that Bella needed to be a woman who hated men…not in the least! I enjoy men and I hope one day to have a family of my own. I think the problem is that Bella needed to be HERSELF and find out who she was in the series instead of her identity relying on Edward. That's the kind of feminism I am speaking of…
I like Will Smith, but you are right about those movies. They were fine for summer blockbusters, but they stunk if you were hoping for something with a little more merit.
Heston's funny for me. I don't "like" his movie and I don't care for his acting. But I watch them over and over. He's kind of like Stanley Kubrick to me. I don't like anything Kubrick has done, but will watch his movies over and over. Maybe that's his purpose, to disquiet the audience? I don't know. . . only the shadow knows. . .
Well that stinks…
ME—I came to this site from DHP, and have registered numerous times, and still my posts log as zero—I give up!
"She is kind and helpful to her relatives and her friends."
Except she's NOT. She ignores and/or dismisses her friends the moment they have ANYTHING negative to say about the guy she's decided is the be-all-end-all of her life, and she openly decieves her family about every aspect of her dangerously co-dependent relationship with a guy who by any rational perception is a violence-prone stalker.
This series is a "romance" between a guy who tells his girlfriend "I want you so badly it makes me want to physically hurt you" and a girlfriend who responds "Wow, that's SO much more cool than all those boring guys who like me but DON'T want to maybe kill me." And 'conservatives' are lapping it up because it gestures in the direction of the "Purity Ring" crap. I don't have a daughter, but if I did I'd like to think I'd prefer her nudging in the direction of "too far" with a good guy than swapping intensely-chaste dialogue with a obsessed serial-killer in the making. Maybe that's just me…
So, remembering that this is a FAIRY TALE, with vampires and werewolves, note that BOTH Bella and Edward cannot live without each other. Note that Edward has been 'frozen' in a 17 year old state of mind until the moment comes when he is totally transformed by his True Love for Bella. In other words, this is an equal love story. True, she falls apart, into a coma, when he leaves her. But he too falls into huge depression when he is away from her. In fact, he is quite ready to die when he thinks she too is dead. This is ROMANCE. Old fashioned romance. It is indeed, a very Romeo and Juliet story, full of sturm and drang.
As to Anne of Green Gables, another of my faves, Both Anne and Gilbert must wait and work for a time before HE can afford to become her husband (Edward Cullen is RICH). Anne is an old fashioned 19th century girl, and it is anachronistic to describe her as an 'independent person' with 'self value.' Gilbert is a gentleman, quite like my own grandfather was, and Anne settles right into marriage and family life, in the way my own grandmother did. Nobody of that time would understand that concept, 'self value'
Dissing Heston and Kubrick? That's heresy you speak, sir. I'll try to forgive you for saying that Smith's movies are "fine for summer blockbusters". That's an insult to good summer blockbusters which, admittedly, are few and far between these days.
Remembering that we live in REAL LIFE and in teaching girls that their self value and worth depends on a man is extremely dangerous and offensive. We already have problems with girls sleeping around with guys to keep their self worth…now we have girls looking to Bella and seeing that if their special guy leaves them they should go into a major depressive episode! Romance is the love between two people but not the complete and utter reliance on one person for your reason to live.
Did Edward want to die? Yes…did he attempt to kill himself like Bella? No. There's a difference between love and romance and obsession…
It doesn't matter whether people were rich or poor — Anne still found herself before she got married. Her self worth was not wrapped up in Gilbert. Gentlemen are great and I don't think anyone is arguing against them at all. I just know that of the many friends I have who adore the series they have this idea that I keep saying that their identity depends on having a male by their side….and it's obsessive…not love or romance.
The imprinting thing is not (or is less) creepy in the book because it's stated that it's not a sexual thing when the girl is too young. It's something more like the guy's "world revolves around her" – which is still kind of weird (and Jacob agrees, at least until it happens to him).
Edward is even more weirdly dependent on Bella than she is on him. I think their super mushy codependency is kinda freaky, but hey, it's a vampire novel. Maybe the freaky emotions make up for the lack of freaky sex? I dunno.
Thank you, John, it was because of your recommendation that I saw the movie and, thus, I read the books. Even better,I was able to introduce the series to my daughter-in-law. She grew up, not really reading. She can read, but never really did. Once the books were introduced to her, we had great conversations (aka comprehension sessions). I have given her a new set of books to read, so that we can discuss them. Mrs. Myers has given me a great gift with my daughter-in-law and to think, John, all because of your recommendation.
I like grown up trashy vampire tales, like the Sookie Stackhouse ("True Blood") or Anita Blake novels. There, the love interests still have otherworldly beauty, but the heroines are smart and strong (although not above being rescued on occasion by their supernatural lovers) and they can have all the sense-shattering sex they want without worrying about pesky things like birth control or unwanted pregnancies! Now THAT'S fantasy with teeth! While I know and respect several grownups who love the Twilight books, they're just not for me.
Bella never really had human friends, except the one shy girl. Jessica was never a friend.
Also, I don't think Bella gets off on the possibility of Edward maiming her. She's more like, "But I LUV U, therefore I don't care." She's the "We can work it out" girl. Which is still bad. But maybe less bad. I think.
Edward didn't become dependent like that until after the first book. (I happen to like the first book—like I said it went downhill from there.)
You didn't think him biting a pillow to prevent from biting her, feathers everywhere the morning after, and bruises all over her to be freaky?
Eh, I wasn't in love with Twilight and I think it was due to some poor decisions on Hardwicke's part, such as not reshooting the car scene in which Bella says "What is going on?" like a zombie robot. Yeah, the baseball scene kicked @$$, but the meadow scene… oh Lord, the meadow scene… I almost drowned in the cheese.
Indeed. That's why I loved it, despite some elements I wasn't crazy about.
As a forty-something mom of 3 kids (2 daughters) I have to say that I was enchanted with the Twilight movie! The books … not so much. I'm just a very visual person. *SPOILER ALERT* I love that Stephenie Meyer (the author) keeps the Edward and Bella in love and lust … and waiting for marriage, which, in the book, Bella is quite loathsome to do. Bella is very worried about what all the townsfolk will think of an 18 year old girl marrying her boyfriend, even though she knows it is True Love and not a shotgun wedding.
Okay, it's not Shakespeare, but I let my 11-year-old daughter see the movie -with me- and we talked about it. BTW, Stephenie Meyer is LDS, if that matters to anyone.
Ummm……you ARE wrong. They ARE married when that baby comes along and were married when that child was conceived, on their honeymoon to be exact. Case in point, some people like to talk about things that they know nothing about. Maybe you should do your research before talking about such things. I am not trying to be mean but this deserved a gentle rebuke.
Well, that is pretty freaky. However, it's a freakiness that's left up to the imagination. What I meant was there are no freaky sex scenes (just a couple fade-to-blacks that leave ripped pillows and shredded headboards as the only lasting evidence of what took place).
Well, that is pretty freaky. However, it's a freakiness that's left up to the imagination. What I meant was there are no freaky sex scenes (just a couple fade-to-blacks that leave ripped pillows and shredded headboards as the only lasting evidence of what took place).
The Ladyfaire and I enjoyed the books and the movie. I intend to watch the movie when it comes out.
Buffy is definitely cool (although I won't give my opinion of the Movie for fear of Editor. Hmmm, I could say it was not the worst movie ever made.)
And yes, Twilight is a disgrace to Modern Feminism ….which is one of its plusses. And its a story so 1)It needs to make sense in its own terms. In the Meyersverse, different biologies are different in thought. Would some more SF writers realized that. 2) Homo fictus always has a more exciting life than Homo sapiens.
True, there were several things that didn't translate well. As John pointed out over on the DH post, the initial attraction between the two isn't very clear, and comes across a bit forced. Also, the car scenes are, like you say, stiff, but I think that's because Hardwicke made several decisions that changed Bella's character and therefore changed the way that character would react to those situations. Bella is responsible, but not a "have to be in control of my situation" type of girl, and would never have said that horrid "strong, independent woman" line. Ever. Bella's vulnerability in the books is, I believe, what drew so many women to her, and Hardwicke (presumably with Kristen Stewart) tried to stamp it out.
Yes. And the first Twilight film does diverge from the source material in a few places, some forgivable, some not. Since it's written in first-person, obviously you can't have the whole movie be one continuous voice-over. But then you have someone like David Yates, who is on my fantasy hit list after what he did to Harry Potter, and I am still sick over the fact that he is doing the subsequent films. So, if Hardwicke was going to pull a Yates on us, I say, Good Riddance.
Not everyone swooned. A good number of ladies I know who read it, myself included, still reject it. Of course, I'm an Anti-Jacob person anyway. But I found that whole aspect way too…..odd. I don't even read the second half of Breaking Dawn anymore. I think Stephanie Meyer has great talent, but I didn't care for the ending. To neat and organized and easy and safe. The whole Jacob/Renesmee thing was a part of that nice, neat organization that felt like, "See, now we can all be one big happy family."
The Twilight series is a disgrace to the feminist movement
Is there such a thing as being too anti-feminist? I think not. To quote Margaret Thatcher, "I owe Women's Lib nothing." Oh, and when did Bella attempt suicide? Because I've read those books more times than my husband wants me to admit and it's not in there. She starts living a more thrill-seeking lifestyle, but death is not her intention – adrenaline is. She isn't attempting to end her life, she's living it more fully, like with the cliff diving scene.
Actually it has to do with the intentions behind it. The fact that she is injured when they have sex is due to the fact that they were both inexperienced, not just with the physical part of sex but also with the emotional. Edward loses it, and – if you actually read the books you'll remember – tries to keep from having sex with her to avoid hurting her again. As they get more experienced, the flesh-deep injuries disappear. So it's not a sadistic "I want to hurt you" type of thing on his part. And she knows that and responds accordingly.
I am having somewhat contradictory thoughts regarding the abstinence theme of this series. I keep being reminded of that ever first movie poster: http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/4707/newmoonltc….
So there's clearly no endorsing of pre-marital sex, yet the promotional ads aimed at fans (which include young girls) are plastered with these young, shirtless, male Hollywood actors?
Does anyone else but me sense a tad bit of hypocrisy here?
I admit I have not seen the movie or read any of the books, so I probably don't know what in the world I'm talking 'bout here.
I think it's because there are so many fundamental differences between what makes a good book and what makes a good film. If the book is as awful asTwilight (and it truly is appalling) then when making the film people feel more able to make the necessary changes. Whereas if the book is good, there is the temptation to remain too faithful to aspects that may work on the page but not on screen.
YES. Only someone obsessed with sex and virginity could find Twilight anything other than disturbing. I for one would rather have the girls of the nation sleeping with entire football teams every night than look to a passive agressive, co dependent manipulative little girl and her equally manipulative, often violent and misogynistic boyfriend for guidance on healthy relationships. Praising the books for the lack of sex just makes many conservatives look foolish – and with a serious one track mind.
have your reply notifications died too?
The books are good, not great, just like the movie. The characters are incredibly one-dimensional but none of this matters. Teenagers love the romantic tension between Bella and Edward and that's pretty much all that matters. I wouldn't read more into it than that.
Jennifer was obviously NOT bemoaning the lack of sex in those stupid books. She was pointing out how creepily hypocritical the premise of the books are in spite of the lack of sex. They're about a relationship between a teenage girl and a VAMPIRE for heavens sake written by a not very bright woman who evidently has no problem exposing her bizarre, sicko fantasies to the world.
The Sookie Stackhouse series are tons of fun. What Alan Bell and HBO did to it should be a capital crime. I guess it's what you can expect from a director who views America as and racist and homophobic and who uses every nasty stereotype of middle and rural America to express his leftwing viewpoint.
[...] praise for Twilight? And of course, [...]
I wouldn't say ALL feminists dislike "Twilight" as this blogger explains
http://blog.newsarama.com/2009/01/03/twilight-eli...
She is correct that elites (radical feminists) are the ones driving the anti-Twilight backlash. These elites want women to be "equal to" (i.e., just like) men. So, the success of the "girly" vampire books is consider a threat to the elites' ludicrous goals.
The irony is that "Twilight" isn't as truly pro-abstinence as the elites believe. From the reviews I've read, Edward doesn't have sex with Bella because of biological reasons (vampire bloodlust), not self-discipline. The latter motivation would make Ed's restraint as truly impressive as that of a mortal virgin.
Exactly.
Despite the mainstream media and radical feminist hype, there are conservatives who share Jennifer's concerns that a "pro-abstinence" message doesn't make "Twilight" a positive influence on teen girls.
Here are two examples of conservative critics willing to ask hard questions about the "Twilight" craze. First is Mark Earley, who weighs in on the books:
http://www.breakpoint.org/listingarticle.asp?ID=9...
Second is Chuck Colson who does a great commentary on the movies:
http://www.breakpoint.org/listingarticle.asp?ID=1...
So, it's a stereotype that ALL conservatives will accept bad behavior from Edward as long as he's abstinent. There are more perils in the world than the negative consequences of premarital sex.
If you're familiar with the series, you would know those guys are the shapeshifters, close to werewolves. They go shirtless because their clothes are destroyed when they shift. I agree, mind you. The poster presents the attractiveness of the figures. But the stories themselves aren't about a lack of attractiveness. Quite the opposite. The story is about resisting temptation, rising above it, doing what's right for the person you love even when you selfishly want something of them.
If you're familiar with the series, you would know those guys are the shapeshifters, close to werewolves. They go shirtless because their clothes are destroyed when they shift. I agree, mind you. The poster presents the attractiveness of the figures. But the stories themselves aren't about a lack of attractiveness. Quite the opposite. The story is about resisting temptation, rising above it, doing what's right for the person you love even when you selfishly want something of them.
I'm not really looking forward to this movie in the series. It's just so depressing, this segment of the story. Still, some thoughts. Someone said Bella was suicidal, but she never is. She's depressed, clinically so, I would suppose. But she never sets out to end her life, not even once. The hallmark of this part of tale, anyway, is that Edward leaves Bella, out of the sense she's better off without a vampire for a boyfriend, because he believes she deserves better than a monster in her life. I thought such a motion was a great example of love, that really loving someone is about putting their needs even before one's own wants and desires. All in all, the story is really good.
You would not believe how many girls and boys love the Twilight series. I could not keep them on the shelves. __I am having a hard time dealing with the "feminism" comments made by some of the posts. Can't we just have a great love story and leave it at that? Weren't you ever 17 and so madly "in love" you thought you were not going to live unless you heard his/her voice? It is both wonderful and awful at the same time and THAT is what is drawing the young people to this book. It is an old fashioned love story with all the angst that goes along with first love. Stop making it into something political. Cripes!
@MovieBob
Don't believe the mainstream media and radical feminist hype. There are conservatives who don't believe that Twilight's "pro-abstinence" message makes it a positive influence on teen girls.
Here are two conservative critics willing to ask hard questions about the "Twilight" craze. First is Mark Earley, who weighs in on the books:
http://www.breakpoint.org/listingarticle.asp?ID=9...
Second is Chuck Colson who does a great commentary on the first movie in the series:
http://www.breakpoint.org/listingarticle.asp?ID=1...
So, it's a stereotype that ALL conservatives accept Edward's bad behavior because he's abstinent. Premarital sex has negative consequences (teen pregnancy, STDs, emotional damage, etc.), but it's not the only threat to teens' health and well-being.
first of all bella NEVER tried to commit suicide in any of the books! SPOILER…she discovered that if she did things that she thought Edward would disapprove of then she could remember him more clearly (apparantly in the movie they are going to change that a little) she was cliff diving, that's all it was…
As for Edward and Bella having a child, they were married…how she got pregnant was a litlle out there, and she had the baby within a few weeks instead of 9 months which is beside the point. Anyway they did wait to have sex until they were married b/c Edward wanted it that way, he was always too afraid he would hurt her
Yes, Bella was shy and timid in the beginning, but throughout the rest of the books she came out of her shell so to speak, she took things into her own hands and became very forceful
I loved these books…the movie was good, but too rushed, i hope they do a better job with new moon even though it was my least favorite of the books.
This is one of the worst book series to ever be published. The "gentleman" stalks the girl, is one of the most abusive pricks I have ever read about, and one of the characters in the last book "imprints" on a baby, and she grows up to reach sexual maturity when she's 7 so he can have her then. There is some absolute horrifically bad mojo going on this series, and it's turned a lot of fans (not all) into real nuts.
Here's a board with a mature discussion with both adults and children about the complete atrocity that is this series.
http://twilightsucks.proboards.com/index.cgi?boar...
My daughter is almost thirteen and while she never hated reading she only read what she had to. I introduced her to Narnia and Potter, nothing grabbed her. She'd never read any book longer than 200 pages and she devoured the Twilight book in a day! She read the other three books in the same manner and has re-read the books several times since. The gift given to her by the Twilight series is that she is now reading other books in the same manner. Somehow these books turned a switch on in her brain and I will be forever grateful to Ms. Meyer for that transformation. She loved the first movie and we talk about the Twilight story all the time. It has great teaching moments were we can discuss choices made by Bella and Edward. My daughter gets that the vampire stuff is nonsense, we laugh about some of the vampire "facts". She doesn't idolize or envy Bella, but we can use her life to examine consequences and choices without sounding like she's getting another lecture. I had my concerns about the material in the book, but based on her comments, my daughter won't be using Bella and Edward's romance as a blueprint for her future relationships. So let her enjoy the angst.
C'mon–will you seriously tell me that Tara and Lafayette aren't massive improvements from the books? I will grant that they've inexplicably made Jason a sub-moron, but on the whole they've done a great job. Two things I'll agree with you: ***1st season SPOILERS*** the girl Bill turns is a ridiculous good girl to bad girl because she was raised repressed and religious cliche, and the thuddingly obvious vamp/gay parallel when Jason has that guy chained in the basement. But I'm sure we can agree that the biggest offense of all would be the absolutely horrendous "southern" accents. I can't wait for the new season.
From a domestic violence perspective, Edward does and says things that should be huge, flashing red signs that say Stalker! Batterer! These books do not represent healthy relationships to teen girls. A story without sex is not defacto wholesome. If Edward were not a vampire in a fantasy book, he would be a very creepy boy that Bella would eventually need a restraining order from. Hopefully he would only have to beat the crap out of her once before she got a TRO, but because of how desperate she is to keep him around, I'd say that's unlikely.
I'm not bemoaning the lack of sex. The – not very bright, as you put it – author has the right to make her characters do or not do whatever she wants. What I am protesting is the fact that a lot of people seem to think the lack of sex makes Bella and Edward a healthy couple, despite the fact that they have the single most unhealthy relationship in teen literature, and some of the least appealing personalities and moralities in literature as a whole. Surely there are books which are well written, which promote abstinence and which see sexual conduct as a significant part of morality, but not the whole part? That's what I meant by a "one track mind".
Oh come on, Edward is forever conscious of Bella's human fragility… and his whole thing is 'mind over matter', or self restraint so that he doesn't kill his human loved one. It is his self discipline that drives most of the story!
wow, sounds like if YOU had written the books they would have been pretty damn boring! This is an example of the "all or nothing" idealism that many conservatives suffer from. This malady is what keeps us losing elections and staying silent while our country is taken away from us. This Leftist Revolution did not happen overnight, it happened in degrees over YEARS. Public education and media indoctrinated our youth for 30 years and here we are. Compare the Twilight series, which I did not read, but my wife did (I like the Anne Rice Vampire novels), with ANYTHING else out there consumed by teens today and it is seriously Nancy Drew. I thought that the messaging is most important and those items you mentioned are trivial to an overpowering message that does much more GOOD than it does HARM.
How you can begrudge that, I just don't know. But keep on not compromising and you will be left out of the debate altogether. Hell, that has already happened to us.
I read both authors too. But I am NOT suggesting Anita Blake to my mother!!!! and we discussed Twilight. (they were nearly too much for her) so the discussion ripples were wider
I read the Twilight series because someone else wanted an opinion. They were what they were. I liked the storyline and there were some twists I was NOT expecting. Haven't seen the movies and don't intend to. But I liked the books for exactly where they fit in the genre/age levels. Although I didn't love her falling apart after Edward left – I've been dumped – hated it. Went through my own being alive without living. What we saw was that she was coming out of it with Jacob & friends – and she was different because of the experience. And the choices over the baby were good. He wanted to choose her; she chose the baby. There was merit there.
don't over-think. Let them be what they are.
Do you also have an issue with romance novels (you know, the cover has a scantly clad woman leaning into the arms of some over-muscled, long haired man)?
I see this series as teenage girl fantasy, a bodice-ripper without the bodice or the ripping. In response to your objections:
1) Has to lie to her father or he will be killed. There is this code of secrecy among vampires where if you know about them, to have to either become one or you die – again this is fantasy
2) Teenager fantasy – don't really need parents, except for inconsequential things like food clothing and shelter.
3) Teenage girl fantasy. If there is a teenage girl that takes these books seriously, get her some help. In addition, this was a very tedious portion of the 2nd book as many teenage girls will agree. I will submit that this is a warning, don't do this, its really tedious.
4) See number 2
5) OK, any womans fantasy. Of course we like to think we know what's best for everyone. Not a good idea to actually do that, but it makes for nice fantasy.
What I liked about the books (no, I am not a teenager, had I been fortunate enough to have children, they would be teenagers or older by now) is that it is the antithesis of the hook-up culture. It is about commitment and loyalty. My niece loves these books. It has helped inspire her to pursue a writing career.
How can you water down an Icon of horror and steal from several television series by throwing in the teen slant……..Twilight.
The strongest reason for 'waiting for marriage' before sex is not only Edward's fear of hurting Bella. It is also his wanting to keep one area of his existence pure: he had murdered, and coveted and broken pretty much every one of God's commandments. He was still, however, 'pure' in the sexual sense. To him, that is of transcendent importance. It has something to do with having or not having a soul… and since he is a monster, he definitely has his doubts about his own soul.
There is a lot to be gained from this Saga.
There is something so creepy about Volterra and the Volturi: the herding of tourists into the killing ground. Eww. It speaks to an underlying fear of any tourist in a strange land. "Anything" can happen even if you are careful….
Kimbergrl – great post, I was about to say the same thing. IN THE CONTEXT OF THE STORY, the behavior is acceptable within that universe. If Edward were human, then NO IT WOULDN'T BE, but there are rational and acceptable explanations for almost everything, although the whole "depression" thing after Edward left I will admit was a little over the top but it's been 20 years since I was 17 so I may have forgotten how ridiculous teens can sometimes be.
Like Harry Potter, it involved wholesome adventure that yes, did include some rule breaking, etc. Otherwise, for heaven's sake what kind of boring book would it be?! Adventure and action is sometimes about going outside "reality" and having fun and that's all this stuff was.
Was her writing a little amateurish? Sure, she could improve. But overall I enjoyed it for what it was FICTION and FANTASY.
Um, you are wrong. Bella NEVER tried to kill herself, per se. She was seeking the adrenaline rushes that brought out Edward's voice in her head. A little weird, yes, but it's a FANTASY NOVEL, for heaven's sake.
Edward actually did try to kill himself. That's the whole point of the final part of New Moon:
SPOILERS:
Bella goes to Italy with Alice to save Edward because he's about to reveal himself to humans int he Volturi's hometown and he knows that they will kill him for it. It's kind of like suicide by cop.
I will grant you that the mooning over each other and I can't live without you bit was a little over the top, but I haven't been 17 in 20 years so sometimes it's hard to remember that perspective. When you are 17, everything is a big deal and when things don't go your way, it all feels horrible and like the end of days.
Edward is a VAMPIRE! HELLO! Are you sure you actually read the books? The greatest part of Edward's torment is that he loves Bella, but he also wants to drink her blood because technically she is food. The lion fell in love with the lamb. A little cheesey but true to the story.
She had bruises all over her because he's strong and his body is like granite and she was still human. He hated himself for it even though it was unintentional and tried to keep from doing it again.
Weird, yes. A little disconcerting. Maybe. But if you ever read Anne Rice, especially Memnoch the Devil, then this stuff is kitten play compared to what Anne Rice wrote back then.
It's a novel about Vampires and Werewolves and so there is inherent violence in the story.
But it is a FANTASY and I saw nothing in it that promoted anything untoward.
Excellent post. SPOT ON!
Although "Romeo and Juliet" had a tragic ending, part of the reason I remember loving the story as a child was the "Romantic" part and let's face it, for the most part, that kind of "romance" is fictional. Real life is NEVER that exciting, not even your LOVE LIFE. Reality always sets in.
So it's a FANTASY for young adults. Big deal.
And yes, I guess we have all forgotten what it was like to be 17 and stupid. Unless of course you (as in the general you) are remembering yourself as an awesome 17 year old that never did or said or thought anything stupid. Well, lucky you, then. The majority of us were young and dumb which is a natural developmental stage and not something to be derided per se.
I actually quit reading the 2nd book in the midst of the depression section for a couple of weeks, it was just too much angst (its been almost 30 years since I have been 17…was it really like that!). I am with you, I liked the Harry Potter series better, I think JK Rowling is a better writer, but so what. They are both good STORIES with good characters. In both stories you had characters with supernatural powers that CHOOSE NOT to use them to dominate others. This is a great lesson!
Ok I'll bite. While the books tend to be anti-feminist, I think Meyer captures the essence of a 17 year old brain. It hasn't been a long time since I was 17 and I can tell you that most girls do feel like the world just ended after a break up. Cannot. Live. Any. Longer. I guess the author could have moralized and idealized and made Bella indifferent to the whole thing, but teenage girls wouldn't buy that character. That's why they all love the book: they connect with Bella's feelings about losing Edward.
While I am not a big fan of the books, I consider it a good alternative to Gossip Girl et al (which are all anti-feminist). If you're like those characters you wouldn't feel upset after a break up, after all, you barely can remember your partner's name.
Yes. "Gentlemen" always stalk and act emotionally abusive toward their girlfriends.
(And don't pin the "feminist" tag on me — I'm as conservative as they come. But sadly, quite a few conservatives have been deceived by "Twilight.")
And then there's the exaltation of all things vampire over all things human, which is quite disturbing.
Actual Meyer quote: "I'm anti-human."
Ok I'll bite. While the books tend to be anti-feminist, I think Meyer captures the essence of a 17 year old brain. It hasn't been a long time since I was 17 and I can tell you that most girls do feel like the world just ended after a break up. Cannot. Live. Any. Longer. I guess the author could have moralized and idealized and made Bella indifferent to the whole thing, but teenage girls wouldn't buy that character. That's why they all love the book: they connect with Bella's feelings about losing Edward.
The whole thing kind of reminds me of the Lisa Lionheart episode of THE SIMPSONS
There is something so creepy about Volterra and the Volturi: the herding of tourists into the killing ground. Eww. It speaks to an underlying fear of any tourist in a strange land. "Anything" can happen even if you are careful….
I too noticed this (I have a really hard time watching the movie all the way through)… the Bella of the book is sardonic and witty. Kristen's Bella is solemn. Very pretty. But remorselessly solemn. Is this because Kristen cannot act, or is it because Catherine Hardwicke wanted this kind of Bella???
Probably a mix. I have seen Kristen in other things and I believe she can act, but she tends toward subtlety. Plus, she was 17 at the time and so it wouldn't be hard for Hardwicke to lead her in whatever direction she wanted.
A mature discussion titles "Twilight Sucks." Yeah, that's objective.
"I think Meyer captures the essence of a 17 year old brain."
I can't decide if that speaks lower of Meyer or of 17 year-olds…
"Also, I don't think Bella gets off on the possibility of Edward maiming her."
I suppose one can't speak for the "psyche" of a fictional, but I've encountered very few female adherents OR authors of vampire fiction who don't have an S&M thing going on, whether they're consciously aware of it or not.
I WILL say that Bella, as-played in the film, is a near-perfect recreation of every girl or woman I've ever known who just "happened" to continually wind up in violent, abusive relationships. She's not even RARE.
Didn't say she should be praised for it. She certainly hit the jackpot by exploiting it.
Anyone who believes 17 year olds are capable of rational thought is either
A) A 17 year old or B) Too old to remember what 17 was like.
True. True. But its like that everywhere. My husband and I just watched "Say Anything" a few weeks ago (for the 1000th time) and we both realized how creepy Lloyd Dobler acts after Diane breaks up with him. But ask any girl who's seen the movie and they LOVE Lloyd. He can do no wrong.
I couldn't agree more! I did not watch the film but I did read the first book because it was given to me. I could not believe how codependent this relationship was, and how disturbing. Sure, they didn't have sex, but that's all they seemed to think about! Do I want my teenaged nieces behaving in this manner – completely obsessed over some boy? Of course not! Who in the world thinks this is healthy?
For the life of me I cannot see why this series is praised so much! And aside from the morality, it wasn't even well written!
Since Lafayette was a minor character in the one book he was in I suppose that if I liked watching foul mouthed, jive talking, flamers it may have been considered to be an improvement. As I don't, I don't. Tara's transformation from a white, elegant business owner who overcame a troubled childhood into a stereotypically lazy, trash talking black woman who can't hold down a job was an insult to black women and a continuation of the low expectations of liberal bigotry. If the actress had been, for instance, the gorgeous Rosario Dawson, and the character of Tara had stayed the same as portrayed in the books I would have thought it an excellent device to encourage young black girls and women to exceed the expectations of their liberal plantation masters. And yes, I agree with you wholeheartedly that the "southern" accents were absolutely awful and all over the place. I've read that Ball will completely scrap the books from now on. I'll say it again: what Alan Ball did to a fun series should be a capital crime. It was "American Beauty" on the Bayou.
Dirty Harry/John Nolte — I could not disagree more.
The books and movies are a social disaster. Teen girls are prone to making bad decisions about guys anyway, and the books and movies (despite the tease/come-on of anticipated sex) teach all the wrong lessons:
1. Ignore nice, but geeky guys who are into you in favor of moody, dangerous, bad boys who get into fights and have problems with physical aggression/tempers.
2. "You can change him," perhaps the single most dangerous message to girls/women ever.
3. "You can make his power your own," the second most dangerous message.
4. Your identity at 17 is wrapped up in a guy AND how big, bad, and feared he is by other guys.
5. Ignore questions about character, intelligence, how a guy relates to others, what his beliefs are, and expect "magical" solutions to all problems in selecting whatever guy is the least into you and the most arrogant.
6. Have negative opinions about young men your own age, who have obvious flaws (and don't look to see their virtues) and in the most lazy way possible, seek an OLDER GUY (who looks younger than he is) so you don't have to deal with your male peers immaturity (or your own).
The books and movies cater to the WORST instincts about guys (instead of the better ones), teach all the wrong lessons about guys (it's a how-to manual for abusive relationships for teen girls). That both film and books are immensely popular with girls and women are cited regularly by "Pick Up Artists" on how to become a Class-A Jerk ought to be both telling and frightening. The bit where Bella arrives at school, and geeky but "nice" guys pay her attention, which she hates, and is immediately drawn to the stand-offish guy who is an A-hole to her (and everyone else) is cited on so many PUA websites it's not even funny.
The original Dracula by Stoker was all about how the nuclear family was threatened by a foreign guy, who's absolute despotic power women found irresistible, but who was totally rotten underneath (because of in fact his despotic, "undying" power). A guy defeated by a bunch of ordinary guys cooperating with a scientist. A much better story.
I doubt many boys read the Twilight series.
I found Twilight the movie and book disturbing because it undermines the most important lesson that teen girls need to learn:
The guy who makes you all hot and bothered because he's the most dangerous guy around (and intimidates other guys) does not make the best boyfriend or potential husband. The guy who is "boring" or "looks at you ickily" (i.e. obviously is into you but lacks the intimidation factor of other guys) might not impress all the other girls or scare other guys but quite often makes a dependable, loyal boyfriend or husband.
There's also a gigantic portion of teen immaturity and fear of taking on Adult responsibilities (wanting adult freedom but not adult choices). Bella wants to be 17 and young and beautiful and carefree forever, not having to make difficult choices like: Where will I go to College? How will I pay for it? What will I study? What do want to work at? How much will I sacrifice NOW in fun, guys, whatever to get into the College I want? Can I work hard, sometimes for years, to get ahead in my career?
Not even: WHAT kind of guy will stay with me as we both get older, age, have kids, and I quite likely get a lot less hot a lot faster than he does?
Kids don't have parental guidance and the collapse of churches and other institutions leaves entertainment the only guide. Twilight and MTV and Sex and the City (a fave of pre-teen girls on TBS reruns) is not IMHO healthy advice for successful decision making.
I love your sci fi blog, have been reading it for over a year, and I thought I recognized your little blue avatar! So funny that you are a Big Hollywood fan! I adore Twilight and can't wait for New Moon. Edward can shimmer for me anytime!
It is a string of primary character self hating books, so I've no doubt that they'd make another.
I recently saw most of the first movie.. and I… I…. what was I writing about? My apologies and I'm sorry. I did see much of the movie, but because it was soooo dull, it was thru barely open eyes. I believe I've found the perfect means to send me straight to slumber. A slumber soooo deep, that the loud noises near the end only jolted me out of sleep to blearily let me catch the long crawl of credits.
I saw it again because of my favorite -though sadly expectedly libatarded- comedians who once rifted out grade z movies on Mystery Science theater 3000, has thru true American go getting. Made a business of making mockery of recent movies thru a downloaded audio that you would have to sync yourself personally. It costs are little for the true laugh out loud humor they bring to even the best of movies. So I actually sat down and viewed it with the assisstance of those guys, and suprise. I stayed up for all of it. The story? emo emo.. emo emo… confusion… emo.. emoemoemoemoemoemoemoemomeo… ACTION!… emo.. emo.. the end.
This advert for the sequel promises the same amount of emo, so I'll be catching it again only if those three guys give it a round. There is only so much emo one man can endure
I love 'Twilight' the movie. The book was okay – the second one was also good. But neither of them were well written – the author merely had the story teller's craft of keeping your interest so that you turned the pages until the end. But as a crafter of words? Nope.
I have watched 'Twilight' (on DVD) so often that I have it memorized. And now I plan on doing the same for 'New Moon'. I love this series. Love it.
ME – by your reasoning, we should therefore destroy 'Romeo and Juliet'. What does Juliet do when she wakes up to discover that her lover/husband is dead? We should also, by your reasoning, destroy 'Othello'. What does HE do when he realizes that he slew an innocent woman?
Frankly, a clue to your inability to understand the tremendous value of love is explained by the fact that you say the Twilight series is a 'disgrace to the feminist movement'. Alas, you are right. And that is the tragedy of it. The tragedy is that the feminist movement has destroyed respect for love. Love is now a four-letter word to them. And a woman who feels that love is more important than an MBA, a condo in Manhattan, a whopper of a 401-K, etc., is a failure. Oh, God! Feminism is the enemy here. And a powerful one. That fact that it now has convinced someone as intelligent as you to completely believe that love is not the highest value – well, the feminazis have done their job far too well.
I'll agree, in the pilot I was concerned about where they were going with Tara, but I think the actress improved exponentially with further episodes. And since Tara was pretty peripheral in the early books–and dull when she turned up with a larger role–(interesting you pegged Book Tara as elegant…I pictured her as having one of those strip mall shops with a lot of polyester skirts) it made sense to increase her part–unlike a novel, a tv heroine needs someone to talk to. As a black person pretty sensitive to stereotyping myself, I didn't see any negatives to Tara that screamed lazy stereotyping. Since pretty much all the main characters have severe personal issues (telepathy, lycanthropy, sexual abuse, drug abuse, astoundingly promiscuous, etc.) , she doesn't stand out as someone setting a worse example than anyone else. They're all seriously messed up. Equality achieved! That's why the show is such fun. And c'mon–I don't see anyone on the show as being role model for youth. Considering the blood, gore & sex, young girls shouldn't be watching it at all. Leave it to old pervs like me! But I do agree with you about American Beauty…my hate for that film is only eclipsed by Magnolia.
Wow, I leave for like 12 hours and the fangirls come with torches and pitchforks ready to burn the anti-fans at the stake.
My inability to understand love? When did I say or even IMPLY that? Why even attack me as a person and my viewpoints that a woman should know who she is BEFORE she enters into a serious relationship? Have you not read ANYTHING else I've written? I could care less that Bella get a degree…I don't want other girls to follow in Bella's footsteps in having their whole world revolve around a guy and nothing else matters…I don't want their self identity or self esteem to be in the hands of some jerk they THINK is their "Edward". Why can't people understand that and quit jumping to conclusions? The teenage years are already hard enough let alone when a person has their self worth dependent on what someone else thinks or if they're going to be with them forever. Now love to me is laying your life down for the other person…not laying your life down because they left you.
BTW: I never got the story of Romeo/Juliet and Othello…so perhaps it's because I don't like Shakespeare or I'm really a coldhearted vampire who cannot love another mortal soul.
I think that both Twilight and GG are dangerous in their own ways…one promotes sleeping around as a way to help your self esteem while the other places all of the female's identity on one person. Why can't there be a happy medium where a girl is confident in who she is and she loves someone with all of her heart?
If they're trying to get laid they are, or at least enough to fake their way through an icebreaker…
I have read the books if I hadn't why would I have known about that scene in the first place?…I know all of the reasoning of why it happens but it's still funny/freaky if you really think about it.
Thank you for the refresher.
It has been a year since I read the novels so stuff gets muddled. 
I was 17…*counts* 6 years ago and I can honestly say I never felt like that at all…but maybe I just slept through those terrible teenage years?
You know, you're absolutely right! The idea of being upset by the change in Tara or the effect of that on the behavior of young women is pretty goofy when, as you pointed out, there are some SERIOUSLY weird behaviors being exhibited and I do hope, as you do, that young people aren't watching this program.
Perspective, perspective, prespective! LOL
You are so bad!
Probably not as many boys have read the series, but some have and really liked them. I think they read it more for the violent vampire scenes than the romance. Have you read them? They can be fairly intense in the action department.
I am still a sucker for a good romance. Realistic or not. I'll bet you also love Zeffirelli's movie version of Romeo and Juliet. I was just out of high school when that movie came out. I can remember my girlfriend and I not being able to move from our seats after the show was over. We were both speechless. Wowee-wow-wow!
No, that kind of romance is neither real nor sustainable. However, it is darn fun to read about it or watch it in a great movie.
Oh wow! I'm so flattered.
Yeah they have. Kind of stinks not knowing when someone replies to one of your comments.
Never heard of either of those conservative critics … both times that you've posted this now.
How's that axe coming? Is it ground yet?
In the words of our big toe, Sgt. Hulka, "Lighten up, Francis."
It sounds like you really have not read the books, only the critiques. Otherwise, you wouldn't focus on the extremely negative interpretations of Edward's character without considering any mitigating examples of positive traits.
Really, those "lessons" you describe can only be derived from the book/movie if you make a series of increasingly unlikely assumptions given the evidence actually written and portrayed in the material.
I KNOW! You're so right. Okay, we get that you don't want Bella to seem like a pushover type, Ms. Screenwriter, but remember that thing writers are supposed to do: SHOW, not tell.
LOL! I hear ya.
You must be logged in to post a comment.