Joe Klein on ‘Avatar’: ‘Americans Are the Bad Guys’
by Big Hollywood
Three out of five leftists agree: Avatar is anti-American….
But that wasn’t the most amazing thing about the movie: the Americans were the bad guys. They were a mercenary army working for corporate villains who wanted to strip-mine a tribe of alien, cerulean nice-guy, enviro-theists. The dialogue was awful; the characterizations were crude…and I’m sure that conservatives will dismiss this as another excretion of the Hollywood left. But still, it was something for a mainstream–indeed, a blockbuster–motion picture to have you rooting for the blue dudes flying about on birds painted like Chinese fans…and rooting against the humans, none of whom had the requisite Eastern European or Arab villain accents.
The message that big trees are good and bulldozers are evil seems rather timely. The message that God is Green is fascinating stuff to be peddling in the shopping malls of middle America (I particularly liked the moment when the mercenaries chuckled about the fact that the primitives believed in a tree god). Movies are usually overrated as agents of social or political change–I remember when The Right Stuff was going to launch John Glenn into the presidency–but the zeitgeist is a subtle thing and the impact of Avatar is bound to ripple in all sorts of lovely, little enviro-theistic ways.
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91 Comments
Enviro-theistic? Umph! Excuse me, I just threw up in my mouth a little.
Klein is a nutjob. People went to see Avatar because of the visuals, not because they loved the American hating. It was the whole new 3-D thing, coupled with the holiday break. Had this been the 5th new 3-D movie and came out on a random weekend, it would have never done the kind of business it has. Except maybe overseas. The dialog sounds like it was written by a bunch of 5th graders who grew up on Disney films.
What's really unbelievable is that Klein seems to think that liberal-themed films are a new development.
Yeah, I don't get why he thinks this theme is new or even interesting. It's been done to *death*, which is why I won't even bother to see it for the spectacle it no doubt is. Maybe Klein doesn't actually go to movies, or even think about them at all. It is more rare for Americans to actually be the good guys in such a movie (when it happens, the movies are almost universally slammed as jingoistic by the Left).
As for the 3D – it is like the fourth or fifth. I saw Coraline in 3D last spring, and there have been a few others since. Honestly, I think the new 3D is just like the old 3D – a headache inducing mess.
Still, I like how even the Left admits that the dialogue is terrible. Cameron may have done the Left no favors with Avatar. They've got people dismissing the story as boring and the characterizations as flat and silly. It's not a large leap to go from that to the idea that the ideology behind it is just as silly.
Here's My Avatar Review:
A good looking piece of shit.
Bingo!
Some should snatch Cameron, and drop him in the middle of the Australian outback with nothing but a loin cloth, knife, ancient long bow, and a bundle of arrows and see how long he survives. Hollywood could turn it into the next Survivor series. No Blackberry. No internet. No fossil fuel powered vehicles to shuttle him from celebratory event to celebratory event.
Let's see how long Cameron stands around worshiping nature when a salt water croc is dragging that flabby lib's butt into the swamp.
If Klein was only a nut job.
When he took over Time magazine, he destroyed it. He turned it from a mostly centrists with a leftists bent to a democratic party fanzine.
One of the best moves I ever made was letting my subscription run out. Life is so much better with out that rag stinking up my house.
http://www.reason.com
I saw it last night. I guess I was expecting the political stupid to be far more obvious so what struck me the most strongly about it was the portrayal of very "human" savages. I do science fiction, so my standards for "alien" are rather high. (Even alien-aliens in fiction are stand ins for humans or some aspect of human nature, of course.) Avatar really did seem to pick up the "noble savage" from the surface of the Earth wholesale and paint them blue (keep the feathers and the "bone in your nose") and plop them down on Pandora. (Yeah, pretty much it actually was that bad.)
So, was that a result of the all around shallow characterization? Everyone is a cliche and the "aliens" are too?
Even so, though, the whole thing was sort of bland. It's not going to go down as a movie classic by any means. And I wonder, if Cameron hadn't come out and *said* it was about Iraq and Bush, or whatever he said, if the reaction would have been as strong or if the grating bits would have gotten shrugged off as typical and to be expected.
the impact of Avatar is bound to ripple in all sorts of lovely, little enviro-theistic ways.
Exactimundo. The class of people who foolishly don't believe that they are personally effected by TV commercials don't think this kind of propaganda can effect them. Then one day they can't find they can't buy a safe car that can move quickly out of the way of a lane changing truck or that their heating bill makes it impossible for their children or grandma to be comfortable in their house in winter without a coat on. Then they'll wonder what happened to their comfortable lifestyle and why they live less well off than their parents or even grandparents did. Never making the connection that their reduction in lifestyle in their neo-third world community was bought and paid for brick by brick, television program by television program, movie block buster by movie block buster because they and everybody else now just accepts that is "the way things must be".
From Doonesbury to Avatar, left wing droolers like Klein have always adored comic books.They don't interfere with their hyper ventilation or ask too much in the way of thought
Old PC: Treehugger
New PC: Enviro-theist
Rhetorical question: If environmentalists are now envirotheists, can an atheist be an environmentalist?
I believe that, buried somewhere in the closing credits, is the following disclaimer:
"No liberal nut-wing viewpoints or sensibilities were harmed in the making of this movie."
"But that wasn’t the most amazing thing about the movie: the Americans were the bad guys. (…) But still, it was something for a mainstream–indeed, a blockbuster–motion picture to have you rooting for the blue dudes flying about on birds painted like Chinese fans…and rooting against the humans, none of whom had the requisite Eastern European or Arab villain accents."
It's not at all amazing that the Americans were the bad guys. The bad-guy humans in movies haven't had Arab villain accents in a decade. (Indeed, it's almost shocking to start watching an old movie where the terrorists are Arab because it's almost never done. "Taken" wasn't an American production, and is an exception.)
OTOH, it is unusual for a *blockbuster* to have an anti-American tilt. If this is because audiences in the US simply don't care for the notion or because any producer and director with that motivation puts the message above making a movie that isn't a stinker… well, the result is the same.
Hey, Joe Klein, on the off-chance that you googled yourself and are reading this:
If the plot and message of Avatar are so unusual for a mainstream blockbuster movie, why was my first thought on hearing about them "oh great, another tired old pile of cliched crap"?
One of us is badly out-of-touch, and I don't think it's me…
Next year, this will be shown in schools while teachers grade papers. Bank on it.
What's really unbelievable is that Klein appears to think.
The mark of a true pen craftsman, saying everything in a few sparse words.
I remember the first time I was confronted with that argument.
English class, 9th grade. Assigned reading The Scarlet Ibis. The next day when discussion on it began, that was the teacher's view. If you didn't like it, you didn't understand it. And it drove me nuts. Who the hell was she to tell me I'm too stupid to understand it.
Liberals. Somethings never change.
I hope your right. I dropped my subscription to that rag a couple of years ago.
I still get snail and email from them begging me to come back. Last offer was basically 95% off the news stand price.
I smiled all the way to the recycle bin.
Ed, in the spirit of your post, might I suggest:
"Concise wordsmith"
<insert smiley here>
Thanks, took me a while to get it down to that
Are you sure the loincloth is necessary?
If you want to read what a thoughtful liberal (close to an oxymoron, but not completely) has to say about the bad guys (see: American military) in Avatar, go read Greg Easterbrook's take in his latest Tuesday Morning Quarterback column for ESPN. Or scroll down a little because Big Hollywood excerpted some of on Tuesday afternoon. As for Klein, he is awful…just unreadable most of the time. And just barely the others…
I know. Time will tell if this movie is as great as it's critics say it is. Year from now, the Blind Side will still be a heartwarming story for the family. Star Trek will be like the original Star Wars, your friends will be honestly shocked if you haven't seen it. And movies like the Princess and the Frog will still be must-watches for small children everywhere. But as soon as the thrill of 3D wears off, no one will want to rewatch Avatar. Just like no one really cares about the first "talky" anymore either, or the actual first technicolor movie ("The Gulf Between").
Never mind that…Jjust drop him off at the nearest local park and he'd start crying.
I am the Lord your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery; do not have any other gods before me.
You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
You shall not bow down to them or worship them.
Avatar: The Most Neo Con Movie EVER!
So says this writer at Forbes:
http://www.forbes.com/2009/12/23/avatar-neo-con-m...
"You should see it especially if you are "right of center" or conservative. Forget the sneering reviews–this is the most neo-con movie of 2009, or perhaps ever, because it illustrates, rather than argues, the point we neo-cons made in Iraq: that American blood is not worth more than the blood of others, and that others' freedom is not worth less than American freedom."
Setting aside my personal opinion that James Cameron is a raving-progressive-statist, I thought Avatar was very well done movie and with a solid plot dealing with property rights and individual liberty of the native Na'vi. The native homestead ("Hometree") sits on the greatest deposit of mineral resources on the planet, yet they have no need for anything that the humans ("skypeople") possess. Also, they do not have much need for the mineral resources themselves. Obviously, the native Na'vi had every right to defend themselves and their property from people wanting what did not belong to them. That is the essence of what we as Americans enjoy today when we defend our own private property from an oppressive gov't through forms of eminent domain which is protected under the 5th Amendment. In this case, the Na'vi did not want to give up their rights to their property no matter what (public good) was offered to them.
…continued….
http://andykatherman.blogspot.com
…continued…
I believe in reason, liberty, private property, and the belief in unalienable natural rights that come from our creator and the use of self defense to protect those rights from being infringed by external entities. This is where Liberty comes from. The most important principles and ideals that have made America what it once are founded in LIBERTY. Sometimes, that is just a useless word that people don't seem to be able to wrap their heads around. But, I do believe that this story is a great example OF Liberty, whether it makes people uncomfortable or not. Sure, there is a bias here against "the military" or "greedy corportations". But, that misses the point of liberty, freedom, and property rights that are 100% requirements for realizing the American Ideal we all believed in. If Libertarians/Anarcho-Capitalists/Conservatives want to really debate the environment and counter the neo-Marxist-internationalist-greenie-zero-growth-Malthusians… then property rights and liberty need to be the weapons to use on the battlefield of ideas … like the Na'vi do clearly in the movie, "Avatar".____http://andykatherman.blogspot.com
I don't know why Klein was surprised at the audience rooting against the Americans; he's been doing that for years.
They'd have to pay ME to watch that piece of shit movie.
So: Joe Klein figures that bloodthirsty mercenaries stealing from the natives must be Americans.
You guys see bloodthirsty mercenaries stealing from the natives, and ALSO figure they must be Americans.
And you say this like it was a good thing?
I've heard it too many times to remember the first one. But the most vivid one was at a video rental store. I rented "Lost in Translation" and thought it was incredibly stupid. When I took it back, the 17-year-old kid at the counter asked me what I thought of it, and I said I didn't think it was very good. He just gave me this pitying look and said "Well, I guess you either get it, or you don't."
I wanted to punch him, but I figured that kid probably got beaten up enough in school already.
THREE REASONS WHY I USE THE NY TIMES TO WRAP FISH OR CLEAN UP DOG POO.
"the Americans were the bad guys. They were a mercenary army working for corporate villains who wanted to strip-mine a tribe of alien, cerulean nice-guy, enviro-theists."
~ Hey, m-f'er, that $h!t ain't nothing new. People been saying that about us military personnel for years, anyway. You are a dip$h!t to think there is a shred of originality in that thought.
"The message that God is Green is fascinating stuff to be peddling in the shopping malls of middle America (I particularly liked the moment when the mercenaries chuckled about the fact that the primitives believed in a tree god)."
~ Just more Hellywood B S, and you drank that koolaid. God is Green…you really don't know horse$h!t from peanut butter when it comes to religion, do ya?
"Movies are usually overrated as agents of social or political change–I remember when The Right Stuff was going to launch John Glenn into the presidency–but the zeitgeist is a subtle thing and the impact of Avatar is bound to ripple in all sorts of lovely, little enviro-theistic ways."
~ This Joe Klein @sshole uses high-toned drivel to say that the movie has liberal propaganda value. And the dumbphuk doesn't even realize he's 'fessing up to what his commie buddies are doing.
NY SLIME IS NOT A NEWSPAPER. IT'S TOILET PAPER WITH PRINT.
I cancelled Time, Newsweek, Chicago Tribune and Charlotte Observer for the same reason. I'd highly recommend the American Spectator, Weekly Standard, and Human Events as exponentially better sources of news, opinion, and especially thought.
Drop him in the middle of Waziristan with no recourse…no weapon and no ability to speak any of the languages and make sure the natives know he is an American. How long before this anti American drooling toolboy starts screaming for the Marines whom he HATES to come rescue his ugly doughy faced ass?
Yes. But Cameron chose to protray the liberty stealers as American. They could have been Communist Chinese (if they survive as a Communism to 2154, which they can in fiction–A. C. Clark didn't foresee the collaspe of the Soviet Union in his book 2010) had Cameron wanted them to be. If the antagonist were of a culture that we already percieve as restrictive on freedoms then I would have no problem identifing with the Na'vi. Cameron may have been trying to say that if we don't do something about our political culture now, that perhaps by 2154 the United States would be just like any other socialist dictatorship. Having not seen the movie, if this were true, I would expect some backstory exposition that this was the case. Not having heard this possibility expressed by numerous reviewers, I can only deduct that this was not Cameron's intention. If Cameron believes in a Socialist Utopia, then the representatives of the Americans would not be presented as greedy and passionless conquerors and the movie would be something different altogether.
I don't have a problem with what you're saying about liberty and protecting what rights and property. What I do have a problem is how Cameron made the movie as a political straw-man slam to America and what made America great in the first place: capitalism and the soldiers that defended and served the country with honor.
This comment really summed it up as best: http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bighollywood/20... (Scroll down to read the comments by QA_NJ).
You're missing the point; this film isn't just anti-American, it's anti-human.
I think you mean "humans" who happened to be of the big business/mercenary ilk and speak English. Maybe the entire world is inhabited by one-world government run by Americans. I don't know. I was dissappointed that we don't know "why" the humans are in dire need of the rare mineral other than a reference that the "earth" is not very inhabitable. That is something that I feel was lacking and should have been provided at the beginning when the Avatar-driver-main-character guy.
I am trying to present the ideas that I observed about the movie as actually being an argument AGAINST a socialist utopia. So, I think the movie's focus on property rights and liberty are a powerful examples why they will always trump a big-gov't-big-business-fascist empire (such as what was advocated by the Nazis and Mussolini).
As it sounds like you haven't seen the movie, take some of the things I've mentioned and think for yourself and not just what the "right" or "left" thinks about it.
Well, sure it's easy to see the bias and I think trying to compare the plot to current geo-political situation is a bit unfair. But, the overall story is about liberty and property rights. That is the truth and i'm not sure even Cameron understands or realizes that in what he's created through the story.
This country was made great through respecting liberty and property rights (as evident in the Declaration of Independence Preamble as well as the 4th Amendment) and not because some Corporation or Country had property rights to North America. In a free market, there is a voluntary exchange of goods between parties who see a benefit and a profit from doing so while respecting the rule of law and not the rule of men. The "corporation" depicted in the movie does not seem to respect any of these principles I've mentioned… and that is what makes the actions of the humans completely un-American.
You can shred it and use it as kitty litter too. reduce, reuse, recycle!
Klein, you are the journalistic equivalent of a sea lion clapping it's flippers at Sea World. AR, AR, AR!
Avatar is Disney's Pocahontas
http://www.buzzfeed.com/reddit/james-camerons-poc...
Are they really planning to strip-mine the other planet? Why would humans be able to zip around in outer space and still have to strip-mine?
I reccommend the American Thinker.
Isn't it funny that a lot of these critics have lambasted Cameron in the past for his shoddy writing, but when his movie advocates a left wing philosophy that they embrace, Cameron is lauded for his amazing talent?
Are you still writing screenplays? If not, do you mind if I totally steal this idea?
SPOILERS: I managed not to cheer when they blew up the tree. Also, Jake was supposed to know all about the forest after being there for only a few hours, but the blue chick couldn't figure out that the guy she was with was actually an avatar and his real body was in the pod inside the building after hanging with him for months. Stupid blue chick! Plus, if a bunch of full gospel Christians worship God in unity, it's creepy for liberals. Blue people worshiping a tree? That's beautiful, man! It's cool when you stand over the body of your unconscious mate and hiss at his attacker. Once. The third time, lame.
Lots of action, really nice technical aspects, story line was unreal and almost cartoonish…I liked it ok,
but it is not a master piece by any stretch of the imagination. And, the political overtones are a little
troubling.
After reading your comment I started thinking about a story. What do you think of a collaboration? Drop me a line dpcrandall – at – gmail – dot – com
Oops, the editor forgot to do her job! Let's see if I can fix this:
"The message that big trees are good and bulldozers are evil seems rather [simplistic].
The message that God is Green is fascinating stuff [if you're the kind of person who keeps his brain in a lockbox for safekeeping...] to be peddling in the shopping malls of middle America [...or if you think the only people who would BUY things from STORES -gasp- are clueless Cher Horowitz clones]
(I particularly liked the moment when the mercenaries chuckled about the fact that the primitives believed in a tree god [Don't people know all trees are gods? Durrr.]).
Movies are usually overrated as agents of social or political change–I remember when The Right Stuff was going to launch John Glenn into the presidency–but the zeitgeist is a subtle thing [because that's the only way to convince people they want a more socialistic government]
and the impact of Avatar is bound to ripple in all sorts of lovely, little enviro-theistic [DOOF-tastic] ways."
Well, because if they didn't Cameron wouldn't have been able to make his Big Point, plot holes be damned…
That's the secret of enjoying Avatar: watch it, but don't think about it.
What really gets me about this whole thing is the continued malleability of the "if you like/don't like this movie you're stupid" argument.
It's my most hated opinion-based argument: when you say you liked or didn't like a movie and some self-obsessed elitist jackass disagrees with you. Like, "Oh, you didn't like No Country for Old Men? Well SORRY Joe Six-Pack, maybe if it had more 'splosions you would have liked it! Go watch Transformers 2 again!"
But more frustrating is when those same people love an idiotic movie like Avatar, a film that they openly admit had stupid dialog, poorly-written characters, and a lame, derivative plot, and defend it with statements like "The visuals make up for all that!" or "Turn your mind off and just enjoy it!"
Famous Chicago Pinhead Richard Roeper pretty much said the same things…
All the left is in synch on this (wow- collectivists in synch!) and have rallied behind Jimmy 'the Thief' Cameron as the new spokesman for Gaia and all things green. Or smurf blue, if you prefer.
Look at all the $$$ it's making! People love liberal messages! People hate corporations and former Marines!
Yay!!
Not so fast. The film is more a Disney thrill ride than a movie, and it's jawdropping effects in 3D are the real story.
No one will care much about the silly plot or the anguished liberal nitwittery inv olved in it in a month or so.
Then it will be 'what's next?'…
If I were Joe Klein I wouldn't sweat it. Time is running out on Time magazine itself. It won't be around by the end of the year.
Movies are usually overrated as agents of social or political change–I remember when The Right Stuff was going to launch John Glenn into the presidency
Not Chuck Yeager? (I mean, that's the character I was most impressed with in that movie.)
I didn't know what to do with that part because I haven't seen that movie.
Thanks for the clarification.
I've never asserted that describes me.
I started with 'pensmith' but that didn't quite seem to cut it. Wordsmith is what I was looking for.
When I was blogging back in the day, that's exactly why I had an editor. Of course he thought his job description was to insert links that completely contradicted my opinions. And as long as they were funny Ioved it.
I saw this film purely for the special effects – the plot, character development, etc. were stereotypically sophomoric and weak.
Thankfully, I did not pay to see the film.
Wow, can you hear the slime dripping from this guys lips?
He sounds like Saruman!
'We must join the enemy Gandalf.'
Lord of the Rings is more timely then one more leftist hit piece.
Yeah, calling him a nutjob was a little tame. I was trying to be PG.
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Very big of you. I've heard stress defined as the confusion generated when the mind overrides the body's desire to choke the living shit out of an asshole who desperately deserves it.
Matter of fact, I had a manager who ordered me to take that off my cubical wall. He liked it, but not at IBM.
I guess it would depend upon the way he said it, because basically, its not an insult, the sentence itself. It's the way its spoken and implied.
I could say the same thing about the same movie, which I kind of liked by saying, some people like it, some people don't, I do, if you don't, that's fine, you're entitled to your own opinion.
Why can't people just do that instead of insinuating you're a moron if you don't agree with them?
I would drop him in Waziristan…we'd have videos of him on Youtube begging for his life in a day…I'd let him rot.
I'd also like to recommend Reason magazine.
http://www.reason.com
I love it. After finishing an issue I feel like I've just run a mental triathlon.
And even if you don't subscribe, most of the material (plus lots of other things) are on their web site.
"and rooting against the humans, none of whom had the requisite Eastern European or Arab villain accents."
Excellent point. I'm always hearing pinkos yucking it up about how amerikkika is finished and that China is the next big thing. How come none of the the futuristic villains were featuring slanty eyes, thick glasses and bucked teeth, ala hollywoods take on Tojo back in the day. Now that would have made me laugh!
in other words a typical Jim Cameron piece of work…
Last night, my 14 year old son argued with my 20-year old female co-worker on why "Avatar" was a bunch of liberal tripe.
He pinned down her argument every single time.
Seriously, I didn't get a word in edge-wise because She would say, "No, it's about this" and He would say, "Yes! Didn't you see the blatant Leftist message?!" And then explain it to her.
It. Was. Awesome!
Conservative Avatar haters have lost miserably. You had very slight penetration into 72 hours of the news cycle and now it's over. Avatar is a runaway hit with overwhelming majority critical and popular acclaim, box office records, and it loved all over the world. Game over.
At you've judged it without seeing it, like a rational person
Screw the environment. Who needs to eat, drink, breathe air, or be warm anyway. It's useless.
Says DCrandall from his computer
You could read these or just swallow rat poison. The effect on your brain is about the same.
3d has been around for decades. Nothing new
I take it you've never read Reason then?
It's not conservative, its libertarian. They're what we used to call "liberalism" before the communists and socialists took over.
He meant to say "enviro-fascistic".
Seriously, I'd pay to see this. Go for it!
Way to miss the point, Mark. DC isn't the one who's advocating nature-worship.
I'm not American and i don't live in America. i don't give a damn about the politics involved. I watched the movie to forget about reality for almost 3 hours and it didn't disappoint. The scenery in 3D was awesome and the pretty visual effects used to light up the forest were excellent. Why does everything have to be about US politics you pack of sad-sacks? Just enjoy the damned movie for the visual feast it is.
I´m sure the fanboys who defended Avatar as "just a movie" against us conservative wingnuts will go right over to Joe Klein´s blog and tell him how deluded he is to think that this movie is actually a left-wing, enviro-collectivist fantasy with explicit politics.
Oh, and where are those " requisite Eastern European or Arab villain accents"? Perhaps Klein never watches anything but direct-to-video movies from the 1980s. That would also explain why Avatar impresses him.
The left-winger Joe Klein certainyl thinks it´s about politics, so maybe you want to take it up with him.
"I watched the movie to forget about reality for almost 3 hours."
Methinks you have little to forget about.
Yes, especially since this mineral is a thousand times as valuable as gold. We are not talking about a large bulk of coal or iron ore here. If you look at the computer graphic of the "unobtainium" layers in the movie, they look like they are a couple hundred yeards across, not very deep and fairly densely concentrated.
But we have already thought more about the whole thing than the writer ever did.
"Get some you blue bastalds! We will now destloy holy tlee!"
You mean like E.T.? I remember when that movie changed our lives FOREVER. Yeah, right.
You mean like E.T.? I remember when that movie changed our lives FOREVER. Yeah, right.
Not exactly funny, but you´re right. Besides, for all their faults, his earlier movies were better written. Including Titanic, which I have always defended despite its class warfare.
If he wanted that, he wouldn't have let his Time subscription run out.
From the mouths of babes…
[...] Joe Klein on Avatar: Americans Are the Bad Guys at Big Hollywood [...]
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