Open Thread Friday

I've been singing the "we need a third party" song for fifteen years. Perot didn't win nearly 20% of the vote because the people are strong Democrats or strong Republicans. He won because he offered real change.
(Ralph Nader has never been a viable third party candidate. He might call himself green but he's a watermelon –red on the inside. He competes for third party votes with communists, socialists and far left Democrats who are in fact communists or socialists). The Libertarians (of which I used to be a card carrying member) have some good ideas, but they're too wacky to win. I left the party on 9-12 when their basic response to 9-11 was "say you're sorry and won't do it again". That's the road to disaster.

We need a third, Independent, middle of the road party that doesn't try to legislate behavior either from the right or from the left (Libertarian philosophy), favors small central government, returns most governing to the states — we need to resurrect the tenth amendment . It's possible. There are plenty of elected politicians dissatisfied with their respective parties. All it would take is for Schwarzenegger, Snowe, Collins, Lieberman, Bayh, Nelson (NE), Graham, McCain and all the other middle of the roaders to kiss their former parties goodbye and form an American Independent Party that is tough on crime, illegal immigration, radical Islam, takes care of the truly needy (but not those able bodied looters who choose not to work – give them the illegals' jobs.) I'm fed up with both parties.

…"All it would take is for Schwarzenegger, Snowe, Collins, Lieberman, Bayh, Nelson (NE), Graham, McCain and all the other middle of the roaders to kiss their former parties goodbye and form an American Independent Party"
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So then that is the answer…a "middle of the road party"? That's what we "need"….a third party which takes its cues from the other two.

A third party may work some day, but not until/unless it's built from the ground up, through local elections over many years. How passionate by the way would voters become over a Party that simply takes the 'middle path'? WHAT is the 'middle path'? Some still think Obama is a 'moderate' just like some think McCain is conservative. What is Schwarzenegger? He might be closer to being a 'middle-of-the-roader' but only to the extent he detects the political winds, which constantly shift, like Schwarzenegger himself. That is the real 'middle of the road'.

There's no 3rd Party utopia. When has the U.S. Not been in political struggle? ain't no such animal.

WOW! Andrew Breitbart's new BigJournalism, aimed at the Democrat/Media Complex coming to a PC near you in Jan. 2010!
http://www.mediaite.com/online/andrew-breitbart-l...

The article speculates that he is gunning to be the next Huffington site. Baloney. The growing Breitbart sites have no real competitors in genuinely-rich content or even balance. Even as a growed man, I say I Love it.

My hero is George.

In my opinion:
If I were a republican I would be worried being a third party to party that doesn‘t exist. I would get me some voter registration cards and start passing them out.. But a democrat isn’t going throw in with a republican for the obvious reasons.. They can always register Independent/unaffiliated.. that should make them more likely to vote for a republican…People historically vote how they are registered except unaffiliated …Now you can sit there and let BO steal the next election when he gives amnesty or you can fight back.. You choice…. freedom or a democratic dream…

My hero is George..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Washington%27...

http://www.forbes.com/global/2006/0508/014.html

Once a nation followed George to freedom.. It is time to follow him to freedom again.. Walk away from your party.. For it is a thief, a king that weakens your heart and blocks your way to freedom..

That lost feeling in your heart is George Washington calling you to action. Read his farewell address and his warning about political parties.

Put country before party and register unaffiliated

Grow…It is the destruction of the party system the fear most..A third party would become corrupt and plays into the hands of the two government parties.. What scares them most and will get our country back is register unaffiliated and demand they change the election process that ensures their re-election.

Ther already is a "Third Party" though this is a term used by the welfare and warfare parties to undermine us. The Constitution party is actually the third largest party in the nation.

It is the PERFECT time for an alternate party to step forward and kick all of the n on-servants of the public out. At least kick out the ones we could not jail for violation of federal law.

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 79 > § 1621
§ 1621. Perjury generally

You can’t predict the weather but you sure can stop the fall.

Imagine what the platform of the CONSTITUTION party is?
Imagine the patriot act being used only to investigate political corruption.

That IS Utopia.

I knew the middle of the road comment would draw fire from both conservatives and liberals, but by the very nature of "conservative" versus "liberal" (as they've come to be understand) leaves those of us in the middle without a party. Obama was elected because moderates and independents went for him and now all of us are stuck with him. Whether fair or not, the propaganda media has demonized the conservatives in the GOP. Witness how they savaged and continue to savage Sarah Palin. The attacks on her by Snake-eye Couric, Long-nose Gibson, Letterman (I think he's got the hots for her and can't shut up about her), Feckless Fey et al destroyed Palin and with her, McCain for choosing her. It was an act of desperation on the Left's part. She posed a threat.

Conservatives are paternalist-statist with a repressionist bent; Liberals are paternalist-statis with a socialistic bent. Both want to dictate the behavior of others whether it be social behavior or financial behavior. It's all about power and control. It is my opinion that a new, third party, would take a few years to get up and running into using the power of the state to dictate to the citizenry and maybe during that time, we could dismantle the more egregious intrusion into our freedom.

I consider myself moderate. I don't care who sleeps with whom or whether they dance or gamble; I just don't want to foot the bill. I am strong on national defense, but was and am against Irag for three reasons: It was obvious the Dems would turn it into another Vietnam (which they did), Iraq took Iran off the table so far as intervention, and thirdly, it is up to the people under dictators to liberate themselves. I'm tired of carrying water for the whole world.

Most of us who want a third party are not Republican. We're the Independents both parties court, though I can honestly say the Democrats haven't had much luck courting me. I almost always vote Republican because to me they represent the less serious assault on my freedom. But if I were gay or a female who feared an unwanted pregnancy, I might vote Democrat. I call it the "Samson Effect". Pull the temple down on all our heads.

The problem in our country is many faceted: 1-The "mainstream" media is nothing more than a propaganda factor for the Left.

2-Hollywood and other entertainment use their "forum" to disparage Republicans and Conservativism.

3 – The Republicans we did give a chance to fix the country – Bush, the Rep. House and Senate –
royally screwed up. While I don't think Republicans are necessarily stupid, they certainly do dumb things — like going to Iraq when they had to know the propaganda media would turn it into another Vietnam. Like going into a defensive crouch whenever the propaganda media starts hammering them instead of fighting back. (Think George Allen after his macaca comment. He should have come out swinging and used his forum to point out the bias in the media.)

I worked out a rule to distinguish Republicans from Democrats: Republicans put their own career first, the country second and to hell with the party. Democrats put the party first, their own career second and to hell with the country. There are exceptions. Nixon put country first twice, once when he refused to contest the 1960 election and when he resigned when the Dem's witch hunt got him.
Clinton is the exception to the Dem rule. He put his own career first and was willing to take the party down to save his own ass.

I'm from Maine. Snowe and Collins are NOT what you would want for what people around here call an Independent Party. These gals are moderates which means left of Republican. They do not represent an independent, at least as far as Mainers are concerned. Maine is a very liberal state run into the ground by Democratic rule of the past 4 decades. The Dems have implemented universal healthcare that has added to the financial woes of the state and is a fiasco. These girls do so well in Maine because of their "left of right" beliefs. Believe me, the Maine Republican Party is not happy with them. They are "independent" in their own eyes. To us Republicans, their independence means siding with the dems on many social and fiscal issues.

I swear this current apocryphal world political/religious/spiritual situation was all presciently foreseen in the Scary and Brilliant new Thriller book BLACK ROAD 2012, which has something in it to offend or rally everybody. I mean it—it's almost really a Nostradamus paranormal event! http://tinyurl.com/Paranormal-Detective-Thriller

I never knew they did that. Interesting

And this process of disorganization and reorganization would take some time, possibly giving the Democrats more elbow room in Washington. So the question is, should we risk trying to destroy the GOP in hopes of making a more attentive, principled, and responsible third party, an effort which would (temporarily, at least) cause turmoil in the ranks of opposition to the Democrats and their agenda? Or should we try to work within the existing party organization and achieve a quieter transformation? I don't have an answer to this; I would personally prefer the latter option, but success isn't guaranteed there either. Any thoughts?

LOL

Agreed, that's why I consider both republicans and democrats (and liberals and the majority of conservatives) to be leftists.

In my opinion the only difference between the KKK and the Black Panthers is why they claim they do what they do. They both want the state to force people to live according to their own ideology.

We need supremacy of the individual over the state, not supremacy of the state over the individual.

Well, it's all our fault. We don't understand science. Its way too complicated for ignoramuses like us unwashed masses.

We don't understand that when scientists use words like "apply, trick, hide" and "decline" what they really mean is they want Santa to bring them a Barbie town house for Christmas.

That's how you do it. There's a Catholic organization called The Christophers and there motto is 'rather than curse the darkness, light on candle.'

And that's just what Mr. Breitbart's doing. We should all follow his example, and simply find one positive thing we can do to help Americans through the political swamp.

For example I made contributions to the legal defense funds for the ACORN sting crew. Also during the last political election cycle I got a phone call from a democratic pollster. I kept her on the phone for 40 minutes, and convinced her to listen to Ron Paul's freedom campaign. She was a teacher and she agreed, and said she would make sure she covered Paul and his campaign during the classes on the election process.

Light a candle.

Go for it! Spread the word.

Education is key to beating this hoax. Which is exactly why the left doesn't want to have that debate.

Have it anyway, force them into the open.

Thanks Edski,

you would not believe where the hits i have been getting are coming from. quite a few with a .edu. and about a third from outside the country.

Did you see the storm from a jeep at a gas station in Mexico?

voter affiliation is the power of the parties.

Independent/unaffiliated, Republican, third party, and no parties, we all have one problem… progressives in both democratic and republicans parties.. We all must target disenfranchised democrats, because we must weaken democratic districts… It is the only way to weaken the progressives and return the country back to constitution..

Independents/unaffiliated, third party and no parties. We must register every one we can to unaffiliated it weakens the two government parties.. At this time 40% of people consider themselves unaffiliated.. it time to push it above 50%.. BOTH government parties fight for independents and it is time to dictate terms..

Before a third party can win it must destroy the laws that protect the 2 government parties. The entire electoral process is designed to keep a third party out. A third party must build a base of independents first, before it can declare itself a real party.. To declare first allows the media to label you and then destroy you.

I don't know why I was thinking about this earlier but it made me laugh. Charlton Heston's cameo in Wayne's World 2:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uf7vz_LtFlU

They wear the R..and steele is calling for some 2out 3 ain't bad scheme. thus they are acceptable to the R…

grow..I consider myself frugal not conservative..I want the constitution obeyed not ignored.. I want people to have as much freedom as possible. I want real represenation instead of the games these politicians play..

To change a party you must have money..greater than the chamber of commerce..Too many politicians have been groomed in this time of greed. BO didn't happen over night, and there are million at least who think just like him.. in both parties and they have the power.. lobbyist use what is called priming the pump.. they donate few thousand to a politician the politician funnels governments money to his new friends and next election the lobbyist can use what once was tax payer dollars to donate to their freindly politician..earmarks , tax breaks, tax amnesties, contracts, and on and on. we still are working under a electoral system that is designed to get politicians re-elected.. The only way is take their consumers away which is party affilation.

Washington and Adams were really the last two presidents of the revolutionary era. They were both a different breed. True citizen statesmen. Neither of them ever really ran for the office. The electoral college did elect them, but then they politely asked if they would consider accepting the office.

Back in those days, any one who campaigned for a public office – essentially telling people they were the most qualified – would be considered unworthy of that office, for that reason.

Adams claimed his greatest political achievement was ruining his political career by preventing a war with Britain. Something else I didn't know about Adams and learned from the HBO miniseries, he was the defense attorney for the British soldiers who fired on civilians at the Boston Massacre. And he won.

Once Adams was elected president, and the Washington era was over, that's when the trouble started. Jefferson and Madison secretly created the first political faction (party) and set about trying to destroy Adam's administration.

Jefferson is something of an enigma to me. On the one hand he wrote most of the Declaration of Independence, on the other hand he hired a scoundrel to secretly publish pamphlets spreading lies about Adams and his other political opponents as a "translator" in his state dept., which means he was paid with tax money.

He believed the Native Americans were equals of white people, and could easily assimilate into America, yet he had no qualms about the status of Africans as slaves.

He firmly believed as President he did not have the authority to buy the Louisiana Purchase and tried to pass a Constitutional amendment to allow it (he dropped that an bought it anyway, Napoleon was notorious for changing his mind at the drop of a hat), yet he then assumed dictatorial authority over the land, and let slavery expand through out it.

While reading about Jefferson I learned a lot of unpleasant things about him, but in a strange way, it makes him more of a real person in my eyes. Because no one is perfect.

Unlike most of his contemporaries he did not free his slaves in his life time, but waited till he died, but he did that so that his children with Sally Hemmings could quietly slide into society as whites, where as if he freed them all at the same time, they would have been marked as Africans, along with all the social stigma that came with it.

I don't know as much about Adams or Jefferson as I'd like to, though I do agree that, to paraphrase Churchill, Jefferson is an enigma wrapped in a riddle shrouded in a mystery. Or something like that.

I don't know if you can really say that Jefferson and Madison were wholly responsible, though, for creating the first political factions. There were already certain alignments occurring during Washington's term, and Adams' Alien and Sedition Acts did nothing to improve matters. Moreover, Madison himself warned in the Federalist Papers about the dangers of factions, and suggested that to have many factions would be better than just a few, so they could cancel each other out, so I don't think he deserves all the blame here.

I don't consider it blaming Jefferson so much, as acknowledging his role in events.

With the way the federal government was set up, it was bound to happen sooner or later. Three separate branches of government all fighting with each other (there by, hopefully restricting their power), and then further separated by two houses of Congress, the only way to get anything done is to convince others to join your cause.

Here's a great book I got for Christmas last year:

http://www.amazon.com/American-Creation-Triumphs-...

The author picks 7 or 8 major issues that helped shape early America. The last chapter is on the rise of political factions.

I still remember how it ended. Washington's second term over, Adams just sworn in for his term, and Jefferson as the new vice president. they strolled down the new streets of Washington DC (don't remember if it was called Washington DC at that time), and they had a polite conversation, reminiscing of old times.

At the end of the walk, they parted ways, and that was the end of American politics sans political parties. Nice symbolization of the end of a truly special era, when politics was truly about what was best for the nation.

There are those who have the opinion that Reagan couldn't have been elected with out Carter.

The current thieves in Washington are better publicity for the GOP than anything they could possibly come up with.

My name used to be Tamika but I had to change it in order to sign up for emails from Stormfront…(I thought it was a weather warning website…wow…was I mistaken but I like my new name better anyway, I get more resume responses).

If she runs, she already has my vote.

And I've only voted republican once for president, Bush's re-election.

Third Party's a LOSER to many freeloaders dependent on the DNC to you really think they would ever vote to cut thier own welfare checks?

Oh I see now that the Lefties have destroyed our CIA they are going back after Blackwater again, How Nice I can't stand these people more everyday.

Non sequiter of the day award

Obama can stand on his head and spit freshly minted silver dollars for all I care. I don't trust him as far as I can throw him. Talk is cheap and Obama is proof. Socialists don't change their red stripes.

The Republicans are by far the lessor of two evils, however, I think the voters are snake bit when it comes to giving them power. They screwed up royally between y2k and 2006 when the voters swung the other way and gave us Pelosi and Reid. Add in the strength and unrelenting negativity the propaganda media (and entertainment) dumps on the public, and its possible the GOP is too damaged to resurrect. Did you see the poll where the Tea Party which isn't a party was preferred by many to both Dems and Repubs. I think this indicates there will be a third party movement in the future. Whether it will be far right or in the middle remains to be seen.

Too many people like me. I might be forced to vote for a republican, but I will never be one.. I still feel that back stab.. There is a reason for the democratic party..even though it has been taken over by a bunch crazies. I once was a republican then came Amnesty..I am now and will always be an independent.

I would eagerly support a Constitution Party.

Maybe I am just simple, but think about this…. Sarah Palin as head of the RNC. Think of how absolutely insane it would make the liberals! Maybe THEN we would have more real conservatives SUPPORTED by the Republican party.

Ed..you have alot to offer and you have spirit to make a difference. The following site is open to the public.. It is a Patroit site.. It is an ID site..
http://912communique.ning.com/page/vent-20..

Dully book marked. I'll check out during the week. At work we have what's called a change freeze, and basically it means I can't do squat till next year. I work in networking, and when quarterly finance numbers are rolled up, the bean counters want no networking issues, so we gladly sit on our hands.

I've started poking around on Big Government, another of Mr. B's endeavors. I don't remember if I saw your posts over there yet, if not, swing on by and have as look. Its more political, where as BH is more industry centered.

I post big..gov.. when they have topic I can post too..

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