Natalie Portman: From Vegetarian to Vegan Activist
by Big HollywoodNatalie Portman in The Huffington Post:
“Jonathan Safran Foer’s book Eating Animals changed me from a twenty-year vegetarian to a vegan activist. I’ve always been shy about being critical of others’ choices because I hate when people do that to me. I’m often interrogated about being vegetarian (e.g., “What if you find out that carrots feel pain, too? Then what’ll you eat?”).
“I’ve also been afraid to feel as if I know better than someone else — a historically dangerous stance (I’m often reminded that “Hitler was a vegetarian, too, you know”). But this book reminded me that some things are just wrong. Perhaps others disagree with me that animals have personalities, but the highly documented torture of animals is unacceptable, and the human cost Foer describes in his book, of which I was previously unaware, is universally compelling.
“The human cost of factory farming — both the compromised welfare of slaughterhouse workers and, even more, the environmental effects of the mass production of animals — is staggering. Foer details the copious amounts of pig shit sprayed into the air that result in great spikes in human respiratory ailments, the development of new bacterial strains due to overuse of antibiotics on farmed animals, and the origins of the swine flu epidemic, whose story has gripped the nation, in factory farms.
“I read the chapter on animal shit aloud to two friends — one is from Iowa and has asthma and the other is a North Carolinian who couldn’t eat fish from her local river because animal waste had been dumped in it as described in the book. They had never truly thought about the connection between their environmental conditions and their food. The story of the mass farming of animals had more impact on them when they realized it had ruined their own backyards.
“But what Foer most bravely details is how eating animal pollutes not only our backyards, but also our beliefs.”
Read the full article here.
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310 Comments
Bacon is awesome, bacon is neat
Bacon's the universal anytime treat
If you don't like it why that's just fine
Just shut your veggie hole while I enjoy mine
Huffington Posts?
That's why I come here, to avoid that drivel.
More Daily Gut!
She makes Jar-Jar Binks sound like Richard Feynman.
When did people start caring about the political and moral opinions of actors? In the first century of the Republic being an actor was roughly the equivalent of being a stripper. It was something you lied about to your family. The only actor of that era who made his political opinions known was John Wilkes Booth, and I think we can all agree they weren't profound or useful.
I can understand why a nice-looking borderline-retarded young lady whose career really hasn't recovered from George Lucas might want to get some attention. I can even understand her desire to blather on about something important-sounding. What I can't understand is why anyone cares enough to print it or broadcast it.
Is this maybe some beef industry psyop? Because reading Miss Portman's idiocy makes me want to go out and strangle a calf with my bare hands before gorging myself on its delicious pale flesh.
George Carlin described a "picky or fussy eater" as simply "A big pain in the ass".
SEMPER BACON !!!!!
So Harvard-educated Natalie has to use the "s" word instead of a thousand other terms that aren't vulgar, such as "waste matter" or "feces." But I went to a state university, so what do I know?
This little twit lost any moral authority she thinks she has when she signed on to the Roman Polanski Fan Club. Perhaps if Mr. Polanski had butt-raped a steer instead of a 13-year-old girl, Hershlag would be calling for a life sentence behind bars instead of calling for his release.
To think in 10 years she went from being a reasonable kid to an insufferable self-righteous scold.
What I absolutely love about these rich vegans is how they go off on rants about the 'human cost of factory farming', but never consider the human cost of NOT factory farming.
Recall that before we had factory farming, food additives, and genetically altered crops, everyone was predicting that population explosion would be the end of the world. Using only naturally arable land and natural methods will feed roughly 1 billion people. The world has 6 billion people. Which 5 billion should just curl up and die?
It's great if you have the money and the concern to go out of your way to buy a 'natural' apple when you're hungry. But study after study has proven that there is no actual benefit to doing so, other than the placebo effect.
Never met a Vegan who didn't look like they could do with a big steak for dinner. And why is it that being a Vegan/vegetarian makes you so b.o.r.i.n.g.? However, the really tedious thing about them is their sanctimonious holier-than-thou attitude nx their condescending attitude towards us healthy meat eaters.I realized years ago that hell is not fire and brimstone, it;s a vegetarian restaurant filled with the people who nibble of carrots. Imagine that for all eternity.
that just fine babe, that's just more filet minon for the rest of us…LOL….but dont YOU tell ME that its WRONG!!
Who knew that my incisors were for only eating green beans, peas and carrots……………What would we do without liberal vegan activists?
I dunno…considering how irritating and militant some vegans can be, it's a pretty mild piece. She was also featured on last night's Top Chef, where the cheftestants were taken to Tom Collichio's craftsteak restaurant in Vegas, where, after giddily prepping all the amazing meat (or proteins as chefs seems to call them these days, at least tv chefs) they were introduced to Portman and told the challenge was, *SURPRISE!* vegetarian meals, which they did to varying degrees of success. It was a good episode, and perhaps she was aided by editing, but Portman came off as charming, not didactic about her food choices.
What are you, 5?
A pretty starlet talking out of her slightly undersized ass? It's a bit too 'dog bites man' to care about, isn't it.?
What she said: "I’ve always been shy about being critical of others’ choices because I hate when people do that to me."
What she meant: I've always been told by my agent and handlers to keep my mouth shut about issues I until I garnered enough success as an actress that I could try and beat my views into your skull with the subtly of a 20 pound sledge, know that I am better than you, and not be concerned my actions will hurt my career the way it did Alicia Silverstone.
Personally I can't wait for dinner tonight. New York strip with sweet potatoes, sautéed mushrooms, a nice bottle of cabernet, and I was going to say spinach salad, but I think I'll pass on that. I seem to have lost my appitite for green leafy things.
As a 20-year vegetarian, I would like to thank Ms. Portman for making those of us who quietly go about our business not eating meat look like sactimonious asshats to the rest of the world.
I have yet to hear a compelling argument for a meat-centered diet that didn't include "because it tastes good," or "it's what we've always done," of (my favorite) "god says it's ok." The argument for an herbivorous diet is easy to dismiss… very hard to actually argue against, from an environmental, ethical, or human health standpoint. I welcome anyone to try to convince this vegan otherwise. And no, I'm not a paint-thrower, so let's try to have a reasoned discourse, k? Here's your chance to actually debate a REASONABLE vegan.
Mac Danzig, the MMA fighter, is a vegan.
It's all about knowing what to eat and what not to eat. That's what makes someone healthy, whether they're an omnivore, a vegetarian, or a vegan.
How do you live without ice cream?!? I know there are "alternatives," but I just don't like any of them. I've been a vegetarian for years, but I don't think I can give up real cheese and ice cream.
Tofu's amazing, for you and for me
the calcium and protein are all cruelty-free
but enjoy your steaks, bacon, KFC and ribs
and the heart attacks, impotence and strokes that they give……
Bacon rocks!
You don't have to be 5 to love bacon. Or comedy.
“Vegetarians, and their Hezbollah-like splinter-faction, the vegans, are a persistent irritant to any chef worth a damn…life without veal stock, pork fat, sausage, organ meat, demi-glace, or even stinky cheese is a life not worth living. Vegetarians are the enemy of everything good and decent in the human spirit.” (Anthony Bourdain, Kitchen Confidential, 2000)
do not worry, those of us who eat differently from you do not lump those like you with the likes of her.
I find the argument against eating animals based on the intuition that they have "interior lives", feelings, personalities, etc. rather disingenuous. Much of the animal rights and vegan rhetoric relies on regarding human beings as just another species of animal, and that what we regard as personality, emotion, etc. are simply environmentally conditioned responses. I remember a number of years ago reading an article in the Atlantic entitled, "Why your dog doesn't really love you" the basic argument being that all the behaviours that endear animals to us, particularly domesticated dogs, are the result of evolution in relation to human beings. The logical extension of that argument was that humans are basically the same, just more sophisticated: we're all just so much meat and have no right to think ourselves exceptional, our emotional responses, feelings, and what not are simply illusions with respect to individual personality. But if that is the case, then it's dog-eat-dog as far as I'm concerned, and there is no moral argument either for or against eating steak.
The only argument that has any weight is the environmental one. If factory farming pollutes the environment, compromising our health, then we have a nonmoral, but nonetheless cogent argument against that method of raising animals for food. However, that does not amount to an argument against meat-eating per se, just condemnation of a particular method of farming.
The other white meat.
ah, Natalie Portman has found a new cause… Doing all she can to reinforce the "Pretty face, empty head" stereotype.
Soy Delicious makes a brand called Purely Decadent which is AMAZING. A lot like Ben and Jerry's. Give it a go. As far as vegan cheese goes, they used to be awful, but have gotten much better. Vegan Gourmet makes a good one for melting, and there's one called Sheese from Scotland that is absolutely 100 percent like dairy cheese. It's a little pricey, but no more so than your average organic cheese.
"You don't win friends with salad" -HJS
But it does taste good (so do veggies), and we have always eaten it (same with fruit and nuts), and God does say it's OK (and in the New Testament, he says it's all OK, even food that was once forbidden). Oh, oh! It's also extremely nutritious, filling, and satisfying.
Here's a question. If meat is so wrong, why do so many vegetarian dishes try and emulate the flavor: veggie dogs, veggie burgers, etc. Is this like the patch for smokers?
And go ahead and throw paint. It's colorful!
personally, I have no problem about what others, be they vegetarian, vegan, omnivores or carnivores, eat or how they choose to live THEIR OWN lives.
My problem is when they want to tell me how to live mine.
Natalie Portman is NOT like other actors. She's intelligent and thoughtful, and for the most part doesn't go around spouting activist nonsense. Barbara Streisand can't even spell Iraq, but felt compelled to issue angry directives by fax to her pal Pelosi. Susan Sarandon, Alec Baldwin, Rosie O'Donnell, Jeanne Garafolo they are constantly marching around giving us the benefit of their stupidity and vitriol. Portman is taking on omnivores like myself without bullying or name-calling, so I'm all for engaging her in the same spirit.
She's entitled to her opinions. I don't AGREE with this particular opinion. I do wonder if she's pro-life. I suspect not, but just about everything in her article applies there, too.
So I'm all for encouraging this vein of principled, intelligent liberalism. It's very rare these days, and if the opposition had more people like her, things for everyone would be far better. Honestly, I'd rather debate Natalie Portman than Barney Frank any day of the week.
Exactly, I have a craving for Cherry Garcia, it has fruit so isn't it an essential food group?
[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Sally and Big Hollywood, Michael Chavez. Michael Chavez said: Natalie Portman: From Vegetarian to Vegan Activist http://bit.ly/3EMUIa [...]
Who is arguing for a meat-centered diet? That would be just as ridiculous as a strictly vegetarian diet. Humans are omnivores. Our teeth, our digestive systems, etc. are designed for the consumption of both MEAT and VEGETATION. If you want to remove meat from your diet, that's your business. Personally, I think nothing goes better with a juicy steak than a baked potato.
Who is arguing for a meat-centered diet? That would be just as ridiculous as a strictly vegetarian diet. Humans are omnivores. Our teeth, our digestive systems, etc. are designed for the consumption of both MEAT and VEGETATION. If you want to remove meat from your diet, that's your business. Personally, I think nothing goes better with a juicy steak than a baked potato.
Who is arguing for a meat-centered diet? That would be just as ridiculous as a strictly vegetarian diet. Humans are omnivores. Our teeth, our digestive systems, etc. are designed for the consumption of both MEAT and VEGETATION. If you want to remove meat from your diet, that's your business. Personally, I think nothing goes better with a juicy steak than a baked potato.
With a condescending attitude like that, you'd make a great celebrity or member of congress.
This may come as a shock to you, but nobody particularly cares about what you eat, so don't waste your energy trying to tell us a) why we shouldn't eat [insert food here], or b) about how great you feel to be a vegan.
You eat lots of vegetables? Good for you. You eat poultry or beef a few times a week? That's fine, too.
I appreciate your reasonable tone and your ethical position. I am one of those who falls into the camp of "God says it's okay", which I understand you may write off as ridiculous, but then I'm not going to try to convince you that you should eat meat based on that premise.
While I have no desire to give up meat in my diet, I will admit that I do have concerns about sanitation, workers' conditions and animal cruelty (though I accept that someone coming from an ethical position of veganism might consider the act of eating an animal cruel in itself). God does call humanity to be stewards of this world, after all.
Natalie Portman is entitled to her beliefs, and I'm not going to begrudge her the right to espouse them toward others (if she believes it to be true, then it seems to me it would be hypocritical to remain silent about it), but I am significantly off-put by her previous statements (for example, praising the fact that people are losing their jobs as "an exciting time", even as she buys herself a castle in Los Angeles) to the degree that I tend to disregard anything she says. Likewise, the inanity of some PETA behaviors generally dissuades me from lending them a sympathetic ear.
But I appreciate that veganism is not merely a position based on emotional outrage, and there are individuals such as yourself who hold such a position after thoughtful consideration.
I appreciate your reasonable tone and your ethical position. I am one of those who falls into the camp of "God says it's okay", which I understand you may write off as ridiculous, but then I'm not going to try to convince you that you should eat meat based on that premise.
While I have no desire to give up meat in my diet, I will admit that I do have concerns about sanitation, workers' conditions and animal cruelty (though I accept that someone coming from an ethical position of veganism might consider the act of eating an animal cruel in itself). God does call humanity to be stewards of this world, after all.
Natalie Portman is entitled to her beliefs, and I'm not going to begrudge her the right to espouse them toward others (if she believes it to be true, then it seems to me it would be hypocritical to remain silent about it), but I am significantly off-put by her previous statements (for example, praising the fact that people are losing their jobs as "an exciting time", even as she buys herself a castle in Los Angeles) to the degree that I tend to disregard anything she says. Likewise, the inanity of some PETA behaviors generally dissuades me from lending them a sympathetic ear.
But I appreciate that veganism is not merely a position based on emotional outrage, and there are individuals such as yourself who hold such a position after thoughtful consideration.
Wait, sorry. "Because it tastes good" is not a compelling argument? It indeed is a good one against whatever diet you espouse if you prefer to eat food that doesn't taste good.
Now I noticed the brilliantly subtle dig against a Creator, so I apologize if assuming that you're an atheist is inaccurate. If that is accurate, what in our wonderfully 'evolved' ecosystem argues against being a carnivore? As a fairly, highly evolved mammal (did I say that right? It's like speaking pig-latin for the first time) doesn't being omnivorous seem to be our naturally developed state?
Ah sorry, I can't keep up the goofy talk and I'm really not trying to be mean, just messing with you. So I seriously would like to know. Apart from arguments like 'it's cruel to kill and eat little animals' (surely as emotional a response as yours about 'god') what reasonable debate do you offer for eschewing the eating of meat?
By the way, I spent about 15 years eating little meat but the occasional chicken (lots of fish though) largely for concerns of staying fit. Some evil person stuck a steak in front of me and that was about it. While it is still a rare treat (especially a treat when it's 'rare') I can't tell you how much I missed it. Yes, it does indeed taste good! What reasoning would move me to give it up now?
Is this what you are citing? I could only find one study from a somewhat reputable source.
http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-233783...
So veggie-heads have an average 5 IQ points higher based on the study (or a study) I believe you are quoting? Wow, not exactly the kind of numbers that gives a vegetarian a greater chance at becoming a rocket scientist over a meat eater, but whatever.
Who sponsored the University of Southampton study? The article does not say, but I'm guessing it is some group that does not take a liking to meat.
No one ever asks these courageous vegans if they even like the taste of meat to begin with. Some people just can't stand meat of any kind…then act like they've made some noble sacrifice because they picked a salad instead of a steak on the menu.
Someone send her a toasted bacon, lettuce and tomato sandwich
She will change her mind
Meat is Murder!
.
.
.
.
Tasty, Tasty Murder.
I like it so much, I bought the shirt!
They can pry my ham and cheese on rye from my cold, dead, hands.
I wonder, does she base her opinions on the one book by Foer? I'm sure she has other reasons for being vegan, but to become an "activist" based on one book seems silly. It's like becoming a global warming activist after watching "An Inconvenient Truth." Bias, bias everywhere.
I'll give her credit for being more literate than most celebs that post on HuffPo (Sean Penn anyone?). I'm not saying she's a great writer, but I can follow her logic, which is new when trying to read anything off of that site. Celebrities really need to realize that it's not good to go off script. But I also felt that her logic is so college age, I-know-everything-because-I-took-a-class. Ms. Portman should pray that she never has to live in the real world. I don't think it would suit her. I'm not saying that as a judgement against vegans. Live and let live– and all that.
Stop Wars!!!!! yea!!! How about wearing a shirt that says: "Stop Bad Things" or "Stop Rape, Rape"
Poor thing, not a thought to found in her pretty little head.
Hey! I went to community college and I know better!
Along with a double Angus cheeseburger and two slices of pepperoni/sausage/Canadian bacon pizza. Stat!!
1) She should watch the episode of Bullshit that was done on vegetarians and "organic" foods.
2) You can just look at her and tell by her complexion she's lacking in red meat
3) As a veterinarian, the "facts" she pretends to learn about in this book/manifesto are outright lies.
4) Anyone that understands the evolutionary background of humans understands their need for meat based proteins.
Vegans…the other white meat.
Well Natalie, on Nov 2, in CT. That is Connecticut for those of you in Rio Linda, I will at first light take to the woods with a 7 x 57, or 275 Rigby for those of you in Rio Linda and I am going to get some recycled vegetables, That would be a White Tail Deer, aka venison. Eating meat my dear is nothing more that eating vegetables that have been cycled thru a cow or a White Tail or an Elk. My problem with you is that its all well and fine, you want to go vegan fine, break a leg, Don't tell me I have to. I would never think to tell you how you should live or not live your life, How about the same for the rest of us that like to eat a steak or shoot some ducks for the table? You really should eat something, you are getting that pasty look. You look and feel better with about 20 more lbs.
Can you expand on that please? Not sure what you're getting at.
BEEP BEEP BEEP
Jesus, that poem is up there with John Lennon's "Imagine" on the Dopey Poem scale.
Much of what "tastes good" is the seasoning we add to our meat. It's a rare culinary event to just serve plain mean, chicken, etc. Also, we have not always eaten the kinds of meat and dairy products we eat now. The levels of saturated fats are much higher, and the introduction of steroids, growth hormones, and antibiotics are things our ancestors didn't ingest with their animal products. It's no surprise that heart disease and cancer is much more prevalent than in past generations… which makes sense as we now consume much more than we used to. Biblically speaking, in Genesis, God gave Adam and Eve all the trees bearing fruit and and seeds bearing plants for food. The Garden of Eden (God's perfect vision) was vegan. It was only after the great flood that God "allowed" the eating of meat.. because all of the vegetation had washed away and as an acquiescence to man's inherently evil nature. He never said it was "good," like he proclaimed the Garden of Eden to be. Additionally, if we are to understand the nature of Jesus, he would never condone the current method of raising animals for food…. deprived of all their God-given instincts, and abused in the cruelest of methods. Remember, the days of the small, family farm are gone. It's now all big agri-business, for whom husbandry of the land and animals is secondary to profits.
To answer your last question, I do enjoy the "meat-like" flavors of veggie burgers, etc… but again, it's the seasoning and texture. I never had a problem with the tastes… it's how it arrived on my plate that caused me to choose differently.
Her use of the s word dissapointed me too. I mean, really? Is that the best you can do Natalie?
Fill Manhattan with 300,000 horses to replace the evil, carbon emitting, fossil fuel world killers and see how fast the rich and beautiful change their tune.
IF you ever get to NY and get a chance, take a drive up though the mid Hudson valley region. There's all kinds of mansions from rich people who couldn't wait to get the hell away from that stuff.
Vanderbilt, Roosevelt, etc.
Without a script she just about exhausted her vocabulary.
Do or Die! I had bacon for lunch on my turkey samich
It's because they do it as a political statement and not just a change in diet.
A normal person would just eat what they want, and if it's vegan, then so be it. But they wouldn't lecture you. If they lecture you, then it's about them. Or their careers. Or lack there of.
Standing ovation!
Cassius Clay was a steak eater I'm not sure how this is applicable to the artIcle. I have to assume when he became a Muslim, Muhammad Ali, remained a meat eater. I don't believe meat included in your diet
is somehow a negative. It was just a week or so ago some British study said lettuce and salads were not good for you. Knowing what to eat and how much is a good thing I agree. Eat what GOD put before you.
The thing is, we understand as a society that certain behaviors are harmful enough that they must be regulated. Rape is illegal. Beating your dog is illegal. We have decided that's it's ok to tell people how to live their lives to the extent that one's life should not intrude on the safety and well-being of another's, and we have made laws to this end. To the degree that we recognize that a meat-centered diet is the most environmentally destructive, we can lay out the facts and make alternatives as readily available and cost-competitive as possible. To the extent that animals suffer tremendously in factory farms and slaughterhouses, we can (and do) pass legislation that maintains basic levels of animal welfare in these institutions. Regarding personal health choices…. well…. it is America.. but with health care debates raging on, I wonder why I as a vegan should have to pay higher premiums to take care of the angioplasties of Big Mac addicts?
Are we suppose to care what she eats? She had only one good movie, "The Professional" in 1994 and that was when she was only about 13. At 14 she was a class one has been. Just because she once had a good movie role and then bombed in Star Wars does not give her the right to lecture anyone on what they should eat.
Quote the Homer,"mmmm… bacon".
No one ever asks these courageous vegans if they even like the taste of meat to begin with. Some people just can't stand meat of any kind…then act like they've made some noble sacrifice because they ordered a salad instead of a steak.
Well, that has been a very popular theory put forth, that we are omnivores, but the science would suggest otherwise, at least when looking at the current state of the human species. In our mouths, we have predominantly molars, which are used to grind plant material. Our "canines" are in name only… they are not capable of tearing through the hide of an animal. Our jaws move from side to side… again.. to grind plant material. Our saliva contains enzymes for breaking down plants, and we must chew our food or we'll choke on it. Carnivores swallow whole. Our "claws," like our "canines," are incapable of pulling down prey, as our legs aren't fast enough to even catch them in the first place. Here comes the kicker. We are the only "omniverous" species that has to cook our meat… or it will kill us. Our stomachs contain 1/30th the hydrochloric acid necessary to kill the bacteria that raw meat contains. Finally, carnivores have intestinal lengths that are about 2-3 times their body length… omnivores about 3-5. Humans have intestines that are 10 times the length of our body.. much too long to process meat before it begins to rot. You don't see natural omnivores dying of heart disease and strokes…we do. Biologically speaking, we just aren't up to the task, and thankfully, we don't need it in order to be healthy.
Oh yes, I'm sure Natalie Portman stays awake at night pondering the welfare of slaughterhouse workers. Fine, go buy a slaughterhouse and pay them higher wages and benefits or quit acting and work for OSHA.
Self-Important Harvard Twit…
Yes, all us meat eaters are driving up the insurance rates for all the vegans to subsidize.
Yet we keep living longer. It must be the carrot and celery side dish some eateries serve
with our rack of ribs that go uneaten.
Thank you for your mature and balanced comment! Regarding the religious argument, I would reference you to the comment I made to nolotrippin above.
How was I condescending?
When Ms. Portman can convince a wolf that it is morally wrong to eat a rabbit, I will take vegan philosophy, and its assumption that all species have the same moral standing, seriously. Until then, I'm getting ready for deer season next week and grilling some of last year's venison harvest.
Just reading her nonsense makes me happy I'm currently eating a plate of Carpaccio. She can stick to her Tofurkey, I'll stay with my delicious, fleshy raw meat. Yum!
Wasn't it just recently one of the White House czars suggested we eat dogs? Not sure but hey, why not
it is an Asiatic delicacy in some countries.
"I wonder why I as a vegan should have to pay higher premiums to take care of the angioplasties of Big Mac addicts?"
You don't. Drop your insurance. Problem solved.
People have different metabolic types and require different nutritional needs. Some people do very well on a high carbohydrate diet and others do very well on a high protein diet. Unless one can afford organic foods, the nutritional content varies based upon the soil that it is grown in and whether environmental toxins are also in the soil and water content. Additionally, unless one is consuming whole grains such as quinoa, amaranth, oats, and barley, the nutritional content of refined grains does not contain adequate vitamins and minerals. There is also the cost involved in a vegetraian diet because organic foods costs 2-3 times as much. Canned vegetables contain the aluminum from the cans and monosodium glutamate which combined cause an excess of free radicals in the body, eventually increasing the likelihood of cancer, Parkinson's and Alzheimer's. I am certain that the diet contains products with nutri-sweet and sweet- and – low such as diet sodas as theres products contain aspartame, which is formalydahyde, so one's brain is preserved in its swiss chesse state.
Impotence? Really? …Ok, pass the tofu.
ah, so I am to understand that rape and eating a big mac are now in the same category as things that are bad. Thus I am now a purveyor of Burger-Burger! And whenever I go to Little Ceasers, I am guilty of Pizza-Pizza.
And not all agree to the environmental destructiveness of meat production. I recognize that you can lay out your case for that armed with facts and studies, but so can I, and being a Civil Engineer with experience in Environmental concerns, I have no end of references I can throw your way, but we'd be here all day if we started that one up.
Now, for reasonable humane treatment, I never argued against that. There is room between both sides to come to an agreement on where that should be.
Regarding health concerns, in the end, none of us live forever and not eating meat is not going to change that. You choose to live your way, I choose to live mine but in the end, we arrive at the same destination. As for premiums, if your insurance company isn't discounting your rates for your healthier lifestyle choices, you really should shop around.
What Portman's little brain can't fathom is that without meat, food production would have to increase exponentially because meat his more caloric dense than vegetables and fruit. Now since there is hardly enough food to go around worldwide as it is, her diet would lead to a lot of deaths. Additionally, we'd have to turn to genetically modified vegetables in a big way which Europe rejects out of hand.
As far as the "because it tastes good" comment goes, I was referring to the fact that we are capable of making ethical decisions that override our basal wants and desires… for instance, we're agreed that rape is wrong, so we make it illegal. Similarly, if we can understand that there are ethical problems with the modern animals-for-food industries, than we aren't slaves to our taste buds that we've trained to have a taste for meat. There are plenty of other great tastes out there.
Regarding your second paragraph, I have no problem with animals who are designed to be carnivores following their instincts. We, however, are neither *biological* carnivores or omnivores. I say biological, because we've trained ourselves to be habitual omnivores, but this practice is unhealthy, and unnatural, for the reasons that I've detailed in my above comment to robertb.
Regarding the debate for eschewing the eating of meat:
1) Animal products are unhealthy for us, particularly in their modern form. The saturated fats, steroids, growth hormones, and antibiotics are a time bomb waiting to do us in. You thought mad cow disease was bad? Wait until our immune systems stop reacting to antibiotics because we've been ingesting them at sub-clinical levels for decades through our meat and dairy products. Many would argue that we are already at that point
2) Animal products are an environmental nightmare…. the single most destructive thing we do as humans. the amount of land, water, fuel, and food used to raise animals for food are so inefficient, so wasteful, and so pollution-producing, that it boggles the mind that it's still legal. For the record, I also think that buying organic blackberries from Peru in February from Whole Foods is also an environmental nightmare. Buy local, buy seasonal, and plant a garden… that's my mantra.
3) Cows, chickens, and pigs have the same capacity for feeling pain and fear, and can suffer in the same way that cats and dogs can. Why should we not afford them the same ethical protections that we offer our "pets?" Why is it ok to deprive the aforementioned of all their natural instincts, when we've passed laws to ensure certain other, similar animals, theirs?
4) The animals-for-food industry is an economic nightmare. It has some of the highest worker mortality/injury rates, some of the lowest pay, virtually no benefits, lowest worker safety regulations, and… here's a big one for my conservative friends… they employ the highest percentage of illegal immigrants!!
How'd I do?
I don't like the implications that all our hardworking livestock farmers are cruel and unethical. I think the bad apples are more the exception than the rule. Your diet is your own, but don't tell me I am somehow "evil" or "cruel" to animals by eating animal protien.
And seeing that animal proteins are what helped human brain evolution and is still needed for proper brain function, its not hard to see why a vegan would get confused and not be able to think through ideas to their logical conclusion.
i got a release from the family of the pig i got the bacon from. they told me the pig would give me the skin off his back to make me enjoy my burger. and bacon made my burger wonderful knowing the pig felt good about it, but i'm not sure about the cow?
Got to wonder if this vacuous little Hollywood twit has leather sofas, car seats, purses and shoes on her feet. I bet she does.
Remember when Barbra Streisand admonished from us from her Hollywood villa to line dry our laundry? I bet you that fat ass Streisand never put her extra large nickers and towels out for the paparazzi to feast upon.
Got to love the French Revolution, they had the sense to guillotine these useless elitist parasites
I would LOVE to hear a cogent argument defending the environmental impact of meat production. Please, fire away!
Good to know she is like all the other whacks trying to tell us how to live our lives. Like, MIND YOUR OWN DAMN BUSINESS!!! Sick and tired of these whack jobs who dont have a brain cell in their head telling me and others how live. Go to North Korea, Iran or China. They welcome wierdos like you.
It seems to me the only animals on earth that pass green house gasses are vegetarians. Nobody gripes about lion farts.
Yes, meat needs seasoning. Your point? Most vegetables are bland city without seasoning, or cooking, or some sort of dressing.
Since you bring up the Bible (and I do hope you've read it cover to cover)…
The Bible doesn't stop at the Garden or after the flood, hence I mention the New Testament (Peter's vision in Acts 10):
"Surely not, Lord!" Peter replied. "I have never eaten anything impure or unclean."
The voice spoke to him a second time, "Do not call anything impure that God has made clean."
Frankly, I don't see how one could not equate "clean" with "good."
Also, "God's perfect vision" can only be his son, not a garden, even the Garden of Eden, no matter how terrific.
You mention the flood. After the flood (Genesis 9:1-3): "Then God blessed Noah and his sons, saying to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything." Hardly a Godly vegan manifesto. In the first book of the Bible, both plant and flesh become food. God never calls it bad.
Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael and Azariah did the vegan thing (Daniel 1: 8-16) and were the better for it, so it's not like you're in the wrong. But we omnivores aren't in the wrong either.
Should the animals we slaughter for food be treated well? Yes, I am with you on that, but if you think agri-business doesn't include everything from soup to nuts, your're living in a fantasy world.
rush always points out, everybody who has ever eaten a carrot has, or will die. carrots are dangerous.
I'd eat Portman – she's a vegetable.
This isn't "principled, intelligent liberalism" — she's repeating a raft of boilerplate lies from PETA, which means she's either consciously dishonest or believes whatever she's told.
And, yes, she is indeed entitled to her opinions. But why is she entitled to let everyone else hear them?
i just wonder how humane sharks are that eat other fish, or polar bears who eat those cute cuddly seals? people today think the meat in the store just magically appeared. if we were sea slugs, or earthworms on the bottom its one thing, but being at the top of the food chain is great, we get to eat chickens, ducks, bunnies, bambi, porky, moo cows, fish, lobsters. like mel brook said, it's good to be the king
Andrea2929, you're really trying to hard. You have blinders on about humans and what and how we eat (I assume you're an evolutionist, too).
Most of what we eat, we process. We have done this for centuries! Frankly, we can't leave food or anything else alone. This is why we don't just have milk and cream but 1,000 varieties of cheese (good, non-vegan cheese).
You don't even talk a good game. Who cares how our jaws move? Can I or can I NOT eat vegetables and meat and, if I'm one of those strange magicians, glass, spikes, and bike parts. Try it yourself…sorry, I'll try it for you. I'll take a bite of grilled steak. Then a bite of steamed broccoli. Steak. Broccoli. Steak. Broccoli. All the same teeth. All into the same tummy. All yummy. Now I'll eat some steak tartar and raw broccoli. All good. All delicious.
Who needs claws when you have steak knives? As for cooking, I've yet to meet an animal who doesn't enjoy the same cooked meat we eat.
For years we were told we couldn't eat raw eggs (that's uncooked) because because we'd risk getting salmonella. Not so. The only we eggs can "get" salmonella and then pass it on to us is because of cross contamination (Christopher Booker, Richard North, Scared to Death, 2007).
Now, some people have food allergies: dairy, nuts, even fruits. I actually have a friend that can eat all the shellfish he wants, but is allergic to regular fish. Go figure.
Your defense of your lifestyle is OK, but your challenging us meat eaters with silly and often just wrong (sorry, they are) arguments doesn't stand your group in good stead, I'm afraid.
Which is wrong.
Isn't it interesting that "actresses" without a clear thought in their head get the press. This twit ruined Star Wars with one hand behind her back and now she thinks what she says has bearing in real life. If she was standing in front of me, I'd behead a chicken and throw the blood on her. She did one decent movie when she was 12, and nothing since. Come to my house Nat, I'm sharpening my knives.
You are correct. It's also correct that the vegans will never listen (though I have met a lapsed vegetarian or two). They feel they are morally superior, like liberals, even when their facts are half-baked.
That's in very bad taste. But funny.
Whoa there. I will not have you blaming this beautiful vegan for the demise of Star Wars. That honor goes to one George Lucas in Return of the Jedi.
Mankind was designed ( enter the correct response, for YOU, as to who made mankind, I'm not trying to snub or omit anyone's belief system here……being unusually PC ), to eat flesh and vegetation. We have two very different type teeth. If we were meant to be vegetarians or vegans, our teeth would be very different!
I don't care if the empty head wants to be a vegan, but she should just shut up about it.
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