Posted Jul 16th 2009 at 2:28 pm in Video |
18505497 Commentshttp://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bighollywood/2009/07/16/steven-crowder-talks-socialized-obamacare-with-neil-cavuto/Steven+Crowder+Talks+Socialized+Obamacare+With+Neil+Cavuto2009-07-16+21%3A28%3A43Big+Hollywood
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Saw the interview yesterday on the show.. I dunno.. it just felt like Neil didn't really want to go over the video with you Stephen, as though he was rushed into putting the story on the air?
I watched the full video last night and I was, in a word, APPALLED! I think that every scatter-brained celebrity/politician/progressive suck-up who keeps trying to push this crap on our country should be forced to locate to Canada and/or the UK an have some medical condition forced upon them. Let's see how they like it then. Shameful. Thanks for the vid Steven.
Great stuff. Take that, Michael Moore. I developed the family PAD (which used to be called Peripheral Vascular Disease, but you try telling your friends you have PVD). I waited far too long to have a doctor check it out, even though I could have. My family doctor immediately (and I mean within the next twenty minutes) sent me to the cardio-vascular surgeon, who diagnosed, set me up for the full battery of tests, and discovered that my pain was justified–the arteries were so clogged that surgery was necessary. The could barely get the dye through the blockages. They got me all set up, and I chickened out twice. One Friday night the surgeon called me at work, and informed me that I had to be at the hospital at 6 AM the following Monday for the surgery. I just said OK, and didn't have time to consider that I had just been forced into doing something I knew needed to be done. One aorto-bifemoral bypass later, I walk like a young man again, and that surgery was six years ago. That doesn't sound at all like Canadian medicine or Obamacare at all, does it? Steven: Thanks for reminding me of what I missed.
Great stuff. Take that, Michael Moore. I developed the family PAD (which used to be called Peripheral Vascular Disease, but you try telling your friends you have PVD). I waited far too long to have a doctor check it out, even though I could have. My family doctor immediately (and I mean within the next twenty minutes) sent me to the cardio-vascular surgeon, who diagnosed, set me up for the full battery of tests, and discovered that my pain was justified–the arteries were so clogged that surgery was necessary. They could barely get the dye through the blockages. They got me all set up, and I chickened out twice. One Friday night the surgeon called me at work, and informed me that I had to be at the hospital at 6 AM the following Monday for the surgery. I just said OK, and didn't have time to consider that I had just been forced into doing something I knew needed to be done. One aorto-bifemoral bypass later, I walk like a young man again, and that surgery was six years ago. That doesn't sound at all like Canadian medicine or Obamacare at all, does it? Steven: Thanks for reminding me of what I missed.
As an internist I fear for the public. This takeover plan by the government will not make me more efficient nor a better doctor. If our clinic gets busier then quality will suffer as will my current patients. Years ago I worked in an oupatient VA clinic and said at the time that the only way a conscientious doctor could be happy in the VA would be if I had a lobotomy. I couldn't get the ancillary studies I knew were necessary but I caught the brunt of the blame for the inefficiencies. There were beaurocrats that didn;t give a rip except to clock out. I forsee this model if this sham gets put into place but without the insulation from liability. Terrible. I will look at other options depending on the final plan and I don't think I am alone.
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Tobor - July 16th, 2009 at 10:06 pm
I have died three times waiting for Canadian medical care. I have to agree with someone that this change to obamba-care is going to do alot for people like me. You know, Zombies.
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As a healthcare worker, I fear the reaction from the mindless robots who I work with when they realize everything isn't what they were told during the campaign when it came to "national healthcare".
From what I can tell, private insurance is getting trashed with this plan and my company makes a majority of its money from insurance payments from the likes of Aetna, United Healthcare and Anthem. I'm pretty sure that if this comes to fruition, the payments from the public plan will overtake the private ones and then you say good bye to quite a few jobs.
I dated a girl from Vancouver, single mother, who loved coming over the border for her health care. She hated it up there and she's one of those that Obama the Great says would benefit the most from the upcoming, mandated healthcare.
I dated a girl from Vancouver, single mother, who loved coming over the border for her health care. She hated the care (if you loosely want to call it that) up there and she's one of those that Obama the Great says would benefit the most from the upcoming, mandated healthcare. The cattle analogy was spot on.
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Steven, to cool buddy you did well, Cavuto is a fair guy. You never have enough time to get deep into your points with a five minute segment, good for you Steven, Big Hollywood and America. He had Zo on just before the 4th.
Given that the public plan currently makes it illegal for you to change your insurance to any carrier except the federal government, it's pretty much guaranteed that payments from private carriers will shrivel up and disappear and the only insurance available will be the public plan.
Lawhawk do remember Dustin Hoffman’s Indian father in “Little Big Man.” For all us older people that will be our health care, we’ll just find a nice hill and say, “I think it’s a good day to die.”
Too true, Stan. And I already live uncomfortably close to the top a hill. Worse than that, I live just above a section of the city called "Polk Gulch." Help, I don't wanna go.
I wonder when enough is going to be enough. My mother is in her late 70's, and this new "healthcare" is going to do her in if it passes- along with thousands of other seniors. Are we going to sheepishly take it like everything else? Or are we going to scream and yell at our Congressmen to do something now? Or, after the fact? Have Americans become so apathetic…well, we know the answer to that.
We have become way too laid back politically as a society. They tax us more- okay. Regulate us more- no problem! Cap and tax us some more- great! I just wonder when the sleeping giant is going to awaken and do something about all this madness. We are truly being destroyed from within.
I know most everyone here is aware of this- just had to vent some frustration.
I am a diabetic with severe kidney problems. I fear if this bill (or any other UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE), I won't get dialiys if needed. Simply put, I am a dead man under Obama care.
My aunt tells me that I would get the same care as congress. I keep telling her that is a lie and that if I thought that Obama's scheme had a chance of really working I would be for it. It won't work, but she still believes that Obama's ONEcare will cure us all. That my objection is because I don't like it that a black man is president. This is what we have to fight. But I fear UHC is our future.
Have your Aunt go down to the local "Free" clinic. See how long it takes her to get help. That should open her eyes, plus have her sit and watch Steve Crowder's full expose.
Look on the bright side. If lack of care causes the natural life span to drop under 67 we wll have a big windfall on Social Security payments we won't have to make. Barack's accountants have it all figured out.
Lord please do not let this monstrous boondoggle pass,
Hey! I just thought of something. Let's apply the same Barrack magic to Social Security. If I understand the HealthCare plan, we are going to pay for 45 million more people, and all sorts of new jobs to crew all the Committees and Boards and Working Groups. And, due to that good old Barrack magic, we will do so in a super new and efficient way that it won't actually cost any more money!
So for social security, we could add, say, half the people, 22.5 million, hire half as many people to crew the Committees and Boards and Working Groups, then apply that super efficient Barrack magic and, well, we would have to save money, right? Then Social Security would become self-sufficient and we would never have to worry about it again!
I was standing on a chair and I fell and hit my head and when I came to, it all made perfect sense. By the way, does anyone know what it means if one pupil is dialated and the other is constricted?
As a Canadian, I can say that Crowder's findings on Canadian healthcare are much closer to the truth than Michael Moore's. Wait times are immensly long and I avoid going whenever possible as waiting in the emergency room eats up a whole day (and sometimes the night). Of course, I don't know if I like American healthcare better (haven't tried it and can't assess it in comparison), but everything in this video was true (with the exception of the 'family doctor' thing – I've never heard of it taking that long before).
As a Canadian, I can say that Crowder's findings on Canadian healthcare are much closer to the truth than Michael Moore's. Wait times are immensly long and I avoid going whenever possible as waiting in the emergency room eats up a whole day (and sometimes the night). Of course, I don't know if I like American healthcare better (haven't tried it and can't assess it in comparison), but everything in this video was true (with the exception of possibly the 'family doctor' thing – I've never heard of it taking that long before).
I am very glad to see that Steven's piece is getting the attention that it deserves and hope that the word gets out there more. For the life of me, I don't understand why good common sense is not prevailing with many of my fellow Americans. It is simple supply & demand. If something is "free" there will be more demand. People will flood the doctors' offices just because they can. I have an aunt who is a hypocondriac (sp?). When she was on a particular insurance plan (with a $10 co-pay per doctor's visit), she LIVED at the doctor's office. She was there so often that she was on the doctor's Christmas card list. When her company changed plans (and her co-payment went up), she learned to take care of the hangnail at home. Keep up the good work, Steven!
Dylan, all I can tell you is right now, I can drive one mile down the road from my house and walk in the clinic and see a doctor, usually w/o waiting any longer than the time it takes me to fill out the basic fill in paper. I have waited there 15 min. before, but there had been an accident and two little girls were getting treatment. I also see a specialist in Atlanta every month and I have a max wait time of 30 min there. Sure, I have ins to pay for this, but I just go and I'm in and out. Even when the ER is packed, I have waited no longer than 3 hrs. I will take our care, thanks.
1) Add a dash of royalty-free music and about nine minutes worth of "Contact Your Representative and Say 'No' to this Un-American $1 Trillion Healthcare Bill" title cards to Steven Crowder's 21 minute video exposé
2) Sell the new 30 minute long video as a late-night/early-morning infomercial on local cable TV providers in the top five markets + 10 of the Tier 2 markets
3) Watch as the Ghost of Billy Mays becomes the Obi-Wan to Crowder's Luke Skywalker
YouTube and PJTV are great, but they just don't have the reach (yet) of a strategically-purchased infomercial spot in local cable TV markets.
Yeah, I'm not saying that the American one is worse than the Canadian one, just that I would want to try both before making a decision over which one is better. I don't want to be like the people advocating free healthcare in the U.S when they have never experienced it and don't know anything about the pitfalls. Same situation here. I'm not making a statement about which is better, just saying that as a Canadian I can confirm that Steven Crowder's experience is very typical.
I have an uncle like that, you can't get him to think past FDR was a GOD, anymore than to stop blamin each and every single problem from cancer to a rainy day on those G–dammed republicans. It's like he was born normal, then at some point had his frontal lobes removed mid sentence, total bigot. He worked for the CCC, the Army Air Corp, and then a state job, union, driving a truck for paving crews., Dropped asphalt, not exactly a high brain power job, but listen to him complain when his pension checks are a day late.
One day and you'd think he was the premiere brain surgeon that was disrespected by the unwashed.
Pointed out once, that um, postal workers are government union employees too,…
he did not like that being pointed out at all. For many of the spoiled by the government, it's always them, and NOBODY else matters.
BKH - July 17th, 2009 at 6:04 am
Obamacare means Duty to Die. Plain and simple. As a stage IV cancer patient who is thriving and surviving on innovative medication targeted to my specific cancer (which people in the UK and other countries can't get) I am terrified that once this all takes shape, I will be opted out of the system, because my diagnosis is too hopeless and my life isn't worth the expense. Single Payer (i.e. the Govt Plan) will eventually dissolve all private insurance. The underlying, inherent philosophy in a single payer health care system called "Duty to Die" – and Americans are expected to become more willing to accept “hopeless diagnoses” and “forgo experimental treatments,” (as Europeans have learned in their single payer systems), because those are the people who "suck" all of the money out of the system that should be spread around to the younger and more apt to be "productive" in society. Ever wonder why Euros talk about "the un-evolved American 'fear of death'?" – well, that's where it comes from – the brainwashing they have endured after decades in "Duty to Die" health schemes. The overriding philosophy of this administration is that Americans have become addicted to expecting too much from the health-care system.
I have alot of experience with workers comp, and now medicaid. Spine fractured twice, 91 and 04, the second time in thoracic and lumbar. Degenerative disc disease, 8 corrupted discs, one surgery to reconstruct my cervical spine after bone spurs from osteoarthritis started pinching the spinal cord, stenosis in four points, myopathy. I know a widdle bit about pain, and long waits.
The same clowns running health care that ran workers comp, or medicaid?
I went three months without the morphine prescribed because it wasn't affordable out of pocket. and night after night after night with pain, having the sensation of burning up and being freezing cold all at once. Sharp stabbing pain, like an icepick rammed in hard. pain bouncing between 8 and 9 for weeks..
more of that?
The thought makes me want to throw up. I'm not a delicate flower, but please, God please, nothing like that again. No private company ever abused me like they did, I'd rather be flogged.
Workers comp literally fouled up my case, so to cover it up they just dumped me, one lawyer later, reinstated, but they still fight me on everything, still deny deny deny till finally I get an ok, and then, they do it again. The system is hardwired to screw people, I had one of them actually accuse me of making up a false claim, when the company admited it happened on the job, even had the accident on security tape. These gubmint retards couldn't get a heart attack right if God reached out and yanked their out personally.
sorry bout all the typo's, but I'm just a tad upset here. Typing too fast,.
sorry, too much, and no ones fault here, .
sorry.
It's, I've always been a proud man, and they made me react to my condition like a kicked dog, and they shouldn't have that kind of power over many of us.
I just love Steven Crowder ~ he's a great example of a young conservative that gets his message across so well to his peers. Now my college-student daughter has become a fan, and if she's as stubborn at school as she is at home, she and Steven will be converting quite a few young people to conservatism!
As for the health care, I am beside myself with people who argue it's not fair that poor people don't get the same treatment rich people get, that losing your job can take you from great insurance to no insurance, terrified of being sick. Well, we just started our own business, we're living on air and bits of savings, but we darn sure have health insurance.
Imagine the quality of doctor you get when physicians are paid the same as Target cashiers. There will be no incentive to study medicine, so we may end up like the Soviet Union, when they decided for you what you would be when you "grew up."
I was in a car accident yesterday (I'm okay). The EMTs suggested my mom, who was a bit shaken up, go to the ER just to get checked out. Since I was there, and I felt some discomfort, I decided to go ahead and get checked out, too. The accident was at about 5, and I was out of the ER by around 9 – and this was after waiting around at the scene to get the registration info back from the police, after my dad went to have our license plate refastened to the bumper, and after chilling with my mom/having dinner in the ER. I wasn't in a bad way, so I was clearly not a priorty, and I expected to wait around while the doctors tended to more serious cases. I heard PAs and nurses talking about how it had been crazy in the ER all day, but I was in and out in a few hours. My mom was falling asleep, and I said, "Hey, at least we're not in Canada." I think we'd still be there.
sywyn… I"ll say that if I read the bill right… You're one of the "high risk/low reward" people that are going to be getting screwed if this bill gets past the Senate.
Ask your aunt then, why the Congress-critters refused to add the amendment that said that Congress would be under the same bill as the rest of us.. they're not subject to the laws they pass on the rest of us.
I get that feeling all the time on Fox. They get excellent guests, then don't give them but a minute or two. Not being in television, I don't know if this has to do with the boredom quality — the leave them hungry for more mentality — but most of the time when they cut away, they cut away to a commercial. I'd be interested to know if that's the case, that they've sold so much commercial air time that they give short shrift to viewing time.
"The scatterbrained celebrities/politicians/progressives will not have to be in the same system as the rest of us."
There was ONE celebrity who did get into the Canadian system accidentally: Natasha Richardson. Ms. Richardson presented to a hospital in Canada with neurological symptoms having had a fall on the ski slope earlier (ergo a reason to check neurological status). Apparently she walked into the hospital under her own power. Two hours later she went out in an ambulance comatose. Two hours after that, she arrived in Montreal and was pronounced neurologically dead a few hours later. Freak accident? Or Canadian Health system? Can anyone imagine this happening in America?
Nationalized health systems do a pretty good job of taking care of the healthy and well — they can dispense vaccinations and well checks (once a year usually) with no problem. (Obama keeps harping on when he says "preventative". Unfortunately, as DOCTOR Krauthammer has pointed out repeatedly, well-checks do little to "prevent" illness. I suspect what Obama means is catching it early. But catching it early requires the SAME treatment as catching it later).
It's when patients get sick that nationalized systems can't deliver as per Crowder's video and all the horror stories we hear.
What most Americans naively believe is that America will get the same health care they get now only it'll be free AND everyone will be included. This is the same mentality of American Leftists who think the reason socialism and communism has failed everywhere it's been tried is because we Americans with our "can do it" ideology haven't tried it. It's inconceivable to most that Americans are just like everyone else and when they stop being recompensed for their labor, they'll stop labor and innovation.
Doctors already are changing their behavior. Many no longer take Medicare patients because it is not cost effective. Through most of the last half of the 20th century, the best and the brightest went to medical school. They knew they'd never become super rich, but they did expect to work hard and earn a good living. As medicine becomes just one more "gumment job" it's unlikely people will be willing to spend four years in college, four years in medical school, one year in internship and x number of years in specialty training to be a GS-22 or whatever that is. Those who do will have the bureaucratic mentality of eight hours a day on the clock (just like they do in the VA system now) and then go home to enjoy their families and leisure time. This results in a back-logs, waiting lists and queues — just like Crowder showed in his video.
From what I understand, and this from a lecture by a Canadian doctor, the government budgets x number of dollars for medical care/treatment in the fiscal year. When the money runs out, other than frank emergencies — and what you had would not have been considered a frank emergency — the doctors and office staff "go on vacation", i.e. close their offices because there is no money to pay them; hospitals go to emergency only basis, furloughing some of the staff, and those, like LawHawkSF above, who have non life threatening (though certainly limb threatening) situations, wait until the next fiscal year starts. Thus the system starts with a backlog.
Has anyone else read the bill? From what I understand on Page 16 (I think it's 16) has language that suggests private insurance companies will not be allowed to enroll NEW members. Thus, Obama is right in that you will not lose your private insurance, but if you don't already have it, you won't be able to get it. LawHawkSF, perhaps you can enlighten us on this.
And don't forget the medical support staff (nurses, techs, etc.) are going to work 9-5, take their allotted breaks and if some patient needs to go to the OR after hours, too bad. The OR techs and scrub nurses have gone home.
True story: England. Patient appears with a ruptured abdominal aneurysm. Registrar (American doctor) claims it's an emergency. "We'll do him directly after lunch" was the physician in charge's response. This friends is national health care.
As I posted above. NHServices deliver well checks and vaccinations just great and they're free. But if you get sick, you are s.o.l.
Growltiger: I have been reading the summaries, so I'm guessing you have a lot more in-depth knowledge of it than I do. But what you are suggesting appears to be the case in regard to the current version inhibiting enrollment of new members. It does not specifically say so, as far as I understand, but makes the process somewhat difficult, and contains disincentives for private individuals even to bother attempting to get a private policy. Equally importantly, the plan as it currently stands relies on its mere words of assurance of the ongoing right to insure privately, but ignores market realities. The plan would seriously reduce employer incentives, create new tax consequences for employment-provided and private insureds, and create a non-competitive environment vis-a-visgovernment plan versus private plans. The market is a force that liberals and socialists simply dismiss with a wave of the hand. In other words, the plan declares it will not eliminate private medical plans, but economic realities and the market will determine otherwise.
Andrew Price is doing an in-depth series on the future of medical care at our Commentarama blog. If you get a chance, please take a look, and since he's doing the heavy lifting on those issues, you can address questions to him which he will be much better prepared to answer than I. We may end up learning from you. You can click on his or my avatar to go to the site.
Growltiger, Investors Business Daily is making this claim about the House bill.
And yes, the bill uses that language, but I think their interpretation may be wrong. I am still reading the bill to make sure, but it looks like what they are proposing is that existing plans can continue to exist, but can't enroll new people. But, new plans can be issued under the terms required by the bill.
So "yes" current plans will not be allowed to enroll new people, but "no" private insurance will not be eliminated.
Yet another clueless fool on the radio this morning. As I was driving into work, the morning team (talk show station) were interviewing a fellow from another station who was espousing the dire need for Obamacare. He was talking up the usual lies, about how the rest of the world has figured out how to do socialized health care and it was about time we did it too. And of course he brings up medicare/medicade and the VA hospital system. The morning hosts, and rightly so, pointed out that said examples are exactly the greatest ones to use, so this joker brings up how the active duty military system of health care is a socialized system that works very well and the quality of healthcare is second to none. I only wished this was a call in show as the hosts, obviously never in the military let that one slide.
Thing is, the health care in the military is top notch, but it is NOT a socialized system. The doctors, nurses, tech staff and the rest are ALL members of the military themselves. Doctors and nurses all had their training done (most on their own) in the same medical schools/progams that their civilian counterparts went through and joined up afterwards. Said military medical facilities are not going bankrupt providing said care because their military staff are getting the same pay as everyone else in the military. This is not something that can work in the civilian world. Also, said medical staff are as equally committed and loyal to their military patients as every other man and woman in the armed forces are to each other, hence the top notch care.
I only bring this up here cause I can see this becoming another contrived talking point among those who are defending BO's lunacy.
Pretty inventive. If current plans cannot enroll new people, then they will by necessity go out of business.
Do the math. A plan has x number of clients, and cannot enroll new clients. As those 1,000 clients turn 65 and go on Medicare OR leave the plan (whereupon other plans cannot enroll them, thereby forcing them to "join" the government plan), sooner or later, by attrition, the plan cannot support the claims and has to cease to be in business, dumping their enrollees into the government plan since they cannot join another plan in existence. Where I become confused is if new plans can be issued, then why the prohibition against the existing plans? Doesn't make sense. Correct me where I'm wrong.
Just got pinched by the moderating Nazi. Have no clue why. My post may or may not appear later. Let's see if I can say what I said without saying what I said.
So existing plans can continue to exist but cannot enroll new people, but "new plans can be issued".
How does this make any sense?
If existing plans cannot enroll new people, then by attrition, they will cease to exist. People go off insurance plans all the time, by changing plans (not allowed under the bill) or turning 65 (Medicare) or dying. If new enrollees cannot be enrolled, then the plan cannot possibly afford to pay claims.
Very inventive of the Democrats. Most people will be too stupid to see it for what it is.
Right. The way this seems to work is that you have to be either on (1) the government plan, (2) some other government plan (like Medicare), (3) in a "qualifying" private plan, or (4) in a "grandfathered" plan.
The plan you're on now (probably) will be considered a qualifying plan. They can keep offering it, but they can't add new people (and they have limits on the rate changes the plan can make). That will kill off the plan, but that's the goal. They want to pretend to let you keep your current plan, but to really kill these off so that everyone is under the government plan or a qualifying plan.
The qualifying plans are subject to a lot more regulation — the grandfather plans aren't.
Interestingly, none of this keeps a private insurer from offering a non-qualifying plan, but you will get taxed as if you don't have a plan if that is your plan.
Paul_D - July 17th, 2009 at 6:40 pm
I agree! Lets disband all government run serivces! How about disbanding the armed forces, the police or firefighters?
I'm thinking "Brazil" here (doctors — instead of repairmen — sneaking around treating people the government has fingered for termination and/or is too inept to provide care for). If it weren't so scary, it would be hysterically funny. What's even more amusing is the useful idiots who are buying this stuff.
They think they're going to get the same kind of care we get today only FREE. What a hoot!
Just wait until Joe Sixpack's kid gets a malignant brain tumor that is considered terminal and he's told to take the kid home to die. (Before you think I'm exaggerating, this is exactly what happened in Britain a few years back. A young boy was dx'd with a brain tumor of a tissue type that has a high risk of mortality. The NHS declared the tumor inoperable. For some reason, the child's plight came to the attention of Ben Carson (neurosurgeon at Hopkins) who offered to operate for nothing. A bunch of people collected money, flew the kid to America, Hopkins wrote off his bill and Carson operated gratis. The child recovered and went back to Britain. Whether the tumor recurred and the Brits were right or not, I don't know. Haven't read any more about it.
Why do Brits accept this? I don't know, but I do know those who can afford to buy private insurance DO. (Same with the Austrians. A friend's brother in Australia paid out of pocket for his coronary artery bypass because he was afraid he'd die while waiting in the queue — three months long).
A few years back, a well-known news person's wife suffered a stroke while traveling in Britain. She was taken to a Brit hospital — free medical care for all, you know — but British hospitals can't afford fibrinolytic agents like Urokinase (too expensive for the NHS) and she didn't get it. This drug has to be given early in the event. Had she stroked in a US hospital she would have gotten this drug immediately. I don't know what her long term deficit was, but she did have a neurological deficit upon discharge. I don't know if the anchorman or she understand medicine enough to know that not using the fibrolytic might have reduced or eliminated her deficit.
I suspect at first our medical marvels will be available but as they become more and more cost prohibitive, they will be phased out. A mid size American city has more MRI scanners than in all of Canada. Canadians' dogs can get MRIs and CT scans easier and quicker than their human owners.
I'm getting picked up by the filter Nazi — perhaps the use of medical terminology is triggering the Nazi. Don't know, but it's getting really old really fast. What about your blog? Do you allow commentary?
I think the filter Nazi picks up on people who post a lot on this blog. If you have more than 5 in fifteen minutes or less. At least that is the way I have experienced it.
I notice this topic is (so far) troll-free. Guess even THEY can't defend PrezBO when it comes to their health care being screwed up. This bill scares me no end. My father is in his 70s, and has cancer and Alzheimer's. I shudder to think how he would be treated under Obamacare. Thankfully, we're still permitted private health insurance for awhile longer.
krista - July 17th, 2009 at 9:24 pm
I live in Ontario, and right now the statistic is that 1 million Ontarians cannot find a GP. I don't know how long the waiting list is, but I ma lucky enough to have one, and I get asked by many friends id she is taking any more patients, because they can't find a doctor.
When it comes to healthcare reform. Canada’s system has been lauded as a model by Michael Moore, President Bill Clinton, President Barack Obama, Senator Bernie Sanders (I-VT) and a whole host of Democrats. It must be great. Right?
W…
Hmm, I don't remember saying anything about disbanding all government services. But come to think of it, that doesn't sound like such a bad idea. Well, except for the ones you mentioned. Thanks for the wonderful idea!
Aw, thanks! I like reading your posts, too! And yeah, I took a day off work. The evil-doer gremlins who leave trash in my store escaped my wrath for a day…
True story also. A fellow was bleeding profusely from the rectum and it was about 4pm. The tech in charge of the GI lab had a quota of 6 studies a day and this was #7 but an emergency. You guesed it. He read his book until 5pm and said Duty Day is over and went home. We had to transfuse the guy all night just because of this. National healthcare at work.
I have always thought that Government Health Care (Nothing the Government does is very Social) would end up being like Government Schools (their is nothing Public about the thinking allowed to be taught). With districts where people would be assigned. In other words where you lived you would be assigned in a hospital district the same way your children are assinged to school districts. Thus wealthier neighborhoods would end up with more materials, doctors, nurses, beds,equipment etc. while poorer ones would suffer because there is no local tax base. My father works for the community college and knows a lot of teachers. He was at a school in Deltona which is where migrant formers live and they had no chalk. The teacher had to buy it out of his salary. It is why he supported a plan in Florida to give every teacher a couple hundred bucks for school supplies by the state.
Does anyone know if this plan states anything with regard to this? I see great problems with this thing?
I love my mommy, please can't she live?
My Father continues to work at 67, was planning to retire in 2010 (deserves it). If this "Bill" goes through, he will work on, in an attempt to keep his employer's Health Care Plan.
Neither parent wants to go on 'Medi-care-less'!
Why is it that the older people in our society are considered leeches for collecting Social Security?
My Father (for example) has paid into SS since he was 16, holding his first job. This was and is mandatory!
Now, when he is qualified to collect, (51 yrs of contributions later) he is to be considered a drain on society.(?)
Due to the fact that my father works, he is still paying into SS at a rate of 7.65% and medicare at 1.45%. Washington has no problem taking that money from him, while planning on using it to pay for someone and something else. Hummm!
Ranba Ral - July 18th, 2009 at 4:02 pm
Ginger, I don't think it's totally viewed as a drain on society on it's own (at least I don't).
The problem becomes when you get people coming in and collecting against it who never paid in, or paid in for only a few years (one of the huge arguments against illegal immigrant amnesty). You also have individual fraud.
Pile onto that that Social Security was originally supposed to be an untouchable fund, but every time it has had a budget surplus, Congress has raided it by borrowing against it for other programs instead of holding it back in store for the American people. This is one of the reasons red flags start going off for me any time someone arguing for a program like it (mandantory, 'untouchable', etc) starts going off about it and how I'm eeeeeeeeeeevil for not supporting it 100% with unquestioning, unblinking loyalty.
As an aside in the late 60's early 70's congress passed a law called ERISA (Earned Retirement Income and Security Act). It seems there were companies that used a "Pay as you Go" model for the retirement plan. They counted on current employees funding the retirement payouts of the latter. When these companies had an economic downturn and layeed o employees there was not enough paid in.
Congress made "Pay as you go" illegal aned set up a whole new disclosure requirements on Financial statements for us CPA's to figure out to prove it. When we discussed the SSN plan of W to give us privatized accounts James Carvell went out and defended "Pay as you go". No one in the media ever asked him to explain the ERISA law. Politicians are theives. They steal from everyone and give to the arrogant.
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagon got rid of them i the 1986 tax code.
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagan got rid of them i the 1986 tax code.
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagan got rid of them in the 1986 tax code.
I can tell you how to find a GP in the United States. Google, or use a phone book and look up General Practioner in the Physician section. With one phone call, possibly two you will now have a GP to visit. If you do your research and read online reviews, it could take up to an hour. All my relatives are Canadian. My mother was born and raised there, naturalized here. What that film showed is exactly what my relatives go through. When I had a knee injury, I got a Orthopedic Surgeon looking at it, an MRI and surgery in a week. I know both systems, I absolutely don't want the Canadian one.
The one thing to remember about American health care is that you can always improve your position by merit. you can earn more or pay enough to get the health care you want. In socialized medicine, you can't. You can't do anything to get better health care. Nothing you do will affect the outcome. You have no control. you get a bad doctor, oh well he is your guy.
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Charles Winecoff
With the holidays fast approaching, I thought it might be a good time to jot down some thoughts on drinking. Or, more specifically, not drinking - booze or Kool Aid.
Recently, I celebrated my eighth year of sobriety. I have 9/11 to thank for that; it was shortly after the...
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Saw the interview yesterday on the show.. I dunno.. it just felt like Neil didn't really want to go over the video with you Stephen, as though he was rushed into putting the story on the air?
I watched the full video last night and I was, in a word, APPALLED! I think that every scatter-brained celebrity/politician/progressive suck-up who keeps trying to push this crap on our country should be forced to locate to Canada and/or the UK an have some medical condition forced upon them. Let's see how they like it then. Shameful. Thanks for the vid Steven.
I saw this yesterday. What Neil should have done is utilize the full video.
Great stuff. Take that, Michael Moore. I developed the family PAD (which used to be called Peripheral Vascular Disease, but you try telling your friends you have PVD). I waited far too long to have a doctor check it out, even though I could have. My family doctor immediately (and I mean within the next twenty minutes) sent me to the cardio-vascular surgeon, who diagnosed, set me up for the full battery of tests, and discovered that my pain was justified–the arteries were so clogged that surgery was necessary. The could barely get the dye through the blockages. They got me all set up, and I chickened out twice. One Friday night the surgeon called me at work, and informed me that I had to be at the hospital at 6 AM the following Monday for the surgery. I just said OK, and didn't have time to consider that I had just been forced into doing something I knew needed to be done. One aorto-bifemoral bypass later, I walk like a young man again, and that surgery was six years ago. That doesn't sound at all like Canadian medicine or Obamacare at all, does it? Steven: Thanks for reminding me of what I missed.
Great stuff. Take that, Michael Moore. I developed the family PAD (which used to be called Peripheral Vascular Disease, but you try telling your friends you have PVD). I waited far too long to have a doctor check it out, even though I could have. My family doctor immediately (and I mean within the next twenty minutes) sent me to the cardio-vascular surgeon, who diagnosed, set me up for the full battery of tests, and discovered that my pain was justified–the arteries were so clogged that surgery was necessary. They could barely get the dye through the blockages. They got me all set up, and I chickened out twice. One Friday night the surgeon called me at work, and informed me that I had to be at the hospital at 6 AM the following Monday for the surgery. I just said OK, and didn't have time to consider that I had just been forced into doing something I knew needed to be done. One aorto-bifemoral bypass later, I walk like a young man again, and that surgery was six years ago. That doesn't sound at all like Canadian medicine or Obamacare at all, does it? Steven: Thanks for reminding me of what I missed.
As an internist I fear for the public. This takeover plan by the government will not make me more efficient nor a better doctor. If our clinic gets busier then quality will suffer as will my current patients. Years ago I worked in an oupatient VA clinic and said at the time that the only way a conscientious doctor could be happy in the VA would be if I had a lobotomy. I couldn't get the ancillary studies I knew were necessary but I caught the brunt of the blame for the inefficiencies. There were beaurocrats that didn;t give a rip except to clock out. I forsee this model if this sham gets put into place but without the insulation from liability. Terrible. I will look at other options depending on the final plan and I don't think I am alone.
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I have died three times waiting for Canadian medical care. I have to agree with someone that this change to obamba-care is going to do alot for people like me. You know, Zombies.
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As a healthcare worker, I fear the reaction from the mindless robots who I work with when they realize everything isn't what they were told during the campaign when it came to "national healthcare".
From what I can tell, private insurance is getting trashed with this plan and my company makes a majority of its money from insurance payments from the likes of Aetna, United Healthcare and Anthem. I'm pretty sure that if this comes to fruition, the payments from the public plan will overtake the private ones and then you say good bye to quite a few jobs.
I dated a girl from Vancouver, single mother, who loved coming over the border for her health care. She hated it up there and she's one of those that Obama the Great says would benefit the most from the upcoming, mandated healthcare.
I dated a girl from Vancouver, single mother, who loved coming over the border for her health care. She hated the care (if you loosely want to call it that) up there and she's one of those that Obama the Great says would benefit the most from the upcoming, mandated healthcare. The cattle analogy was spot on.
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Yes, and their replacements will be poorly paid and less enthusiastic to help the "public".
Steven, to cool buddy you did well, Cavuto is a fair guy. You never have enough time to get deep into your points with a five minute segment, good for you Steven, Big Hollywood and America. He had Zo on just before the 4th.
Given that the public plan currently makes it illegal for you to change your insurance to any carrier except the federal government, it's pretty much guaranteed that payments from private carriers will shrivel up and disappear and the only insurance available will be the public plan.
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=...
Lawhawk do remember Dustin Hoffman’s Indian father in “Little Big Man.” For all us older people that will be our health care, we’ll just find a nice hill and say, “I think it’s a good day to die.”
Too true, Stan. And I already live uncomfortably close to the top a hill. Worse than that, I live just above a section of the city called "Polk Gulch." Help, I don't wanna go.
I wonder when enough is going to be enough. My mother is in her late 70's, and this new "healthcare" is going to do her in if it passes- along with thousands of other seniors. Are we going to sheepishly take it like everything else? Or are we going to scream and yell at our Congressmen to do something now? Or, after the fact? Have Americans become so apathetic…well, we know the answer to that.
We have become way too laid back politically as a society. They tax us more- okay. Regulate us more- no problem! Cap and tax us some more- great! I just wonder when the sleeping giant is going to awaken and do something about all this madness. We are truly being destroyed from within.
I know most everyone here is aware of this- just had to vent some frustration.
I am a diabetic with severe kidney problems. I fear if this bill (or any other UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE), I won't get dialiys if needed. Simply put, I am a dead man under Obama care.
My aunt tells me that I would get the same care as congress. I keep telling her that is a lie and that if I thought that Obama's scheme had a chance of really working I would be for it. It won't work, but she still believes that Obama's ONEcare will cure us all. That my objection is because I don't like it that a black man is president. This is what we have to fight. But I fear UHC is our future.
then it's SYVYN11 RIP.
Have your Aunt go down to the local "Free" clinic. See how long it takes her to get help. That should open her eyes, plus have her sit and watch Steve Crowder's full expose.
Hey Everyone,
Look on the bright side. If lack of care causes the natural life span to drop under 67 we wll have a big windfall on Social Security payments we won't have to make. Barack's accountants have it all figured out.
Lord please do not let this monstrous boondoggle pass,
She is a professional 'victim'. Everything is someone elses fault. It's really hard to talk to her. She is a dream voter for Obama.
Hey! I just thought of something. Let's apply the same Barrack magic to Social Security. If I understand the HealthCare plan, we are going to pay for 45 million more people, and all sorts of new jobs to crew all the Committees and Boards and Working Groups. And, due to that good old Barrack magic, we will do so in a super new and efficient way that it won't actually cost any more money!
So for social security, we could add, say, half the people, 22.5 million, hire half as many people to crew the Committees and Boards and Working Groups, then apply that super efficient Barrack magic and, well, we would have to save money, right? Then Social Security would become self-sufficient and we would never have to worry about it again!
I was standing on a chair and I fell and hit my head and when I came to, it all made perfect sense. By the way, does anyone know what it means if one pupil is dialated and the other is constricted?
As a Canadian, I can say that Crowder's findings on Canadian healthcare are much closer to the truth than Michael Moore's. Wait times are immensly long and I avoid going whenever possible as waiting in the emergency room eats up a whole day (and sometimes the night). Of course, I don't know if I like American healthcare better (haven't tried it and can't assess it in comparison), but everything in this video was true (with the exception of the 'family doctor' thing – I've never heard of it taking that long before).
As a Canadian, I can say that Crowder's findings on Canadian healthcare are much closer to the truth than Michael Moore's. Wait times are immensly long and I avoid going whenever possible as waiting in the emergency room eats up a whole day (and sometimes the night). Of course, I don't know if I like American healthcare better (haven't tried it and can't assess it in comparison), but everything in this video was true (with the exception of possibly the 'family doctor' thing – I've never heard of it taking that long before).
I am very glad to see that Steven's piece is getting the attention that it deserves and hope that the word gets out there more. For the life of me, I don't understand why good common sense is not prevailing with many of my fellow Americans. It is simple supply & demand. If something is "free" there will be more demand. People will flood the doctors' offices just because they can. I have an aunt who is a hypocondriac (sp?). When she was on a particular insurance plan (with a $10 co-pay per doctor's visit), she LIVED at the doctor's office. She was there so often that she was on the doctor's Christmas card list. When her company changed plans (and her co-payment went up), she learned to take care of the hangnail at home. Keep up the good work, Steven!
Dylan, all I can tell you is right now, I can drive one mile down the road from my house and walk in the clinic and see a doctor, usually w/o waiting any longer than the time it takes me to fill out the basic fill in paper. I have waited there 15 min. before, but there had been an accident and two little girls were getting treatment. I also see a specialist in Atlanta every month and I have a max wait time of 30 min there. Sure, I have ins to pay for this, but I just go and I'm in and out. Even when the ER is packed, I have waited no longer than 3 hrs. I will take our care, thanks.
RADICAL THREE STEP IDEA:
1) Add a dash of royalty-free music and about nine minutes worth of "Contact Your Representative and Say 'No' to this Un-American $1 Trillion Healthcare Bill" title cards to Steven Crowder's 21 minute video exposé
2) Sell the new 30 minute long video as a late-night/early-morning infomercial on local cable TV providers in the top five markets + 10 of the Tier 2 markets
3) Watch as the Ghost of Billy Mays becomes the Obi-Wan to Crowder's Luke Skywalker
YouTube and PJTV are great, but they just don't have the reach (yet) of a strategically-purchased infomercial spot in local cable TV markets.
Yeah, I'm not saying that the American one is worse than the Canadian one, just that I would want to try both before making a decision over which one is better. I don't want to be like the people advocating free healthcare in the U.S when they have never experienced it and don't know anything about the pitfalls. Same situation here. I'm not making a statement about which is better, just saying that as a Canadian I can confirm that Steven Crowder's experience is very typical.
I have an uncle like that, you can't get him to think past FDR was a GOD, anymore than to stop blamin each and every single problem from cancer to a rainy day on those G–dammed republicans. It's like he was born normal, then at some point had his frontal lobes removed mid sentence, total bigot. He worked for the CCC, the Army Air Corp, and then a state job, union, driving a truck for paving crews., Dropped asphalt, not exactly a high brain power job, but listen to him complain when his pension checks are a day late.
One day and you'd think he was the premiere brain surgeon that was disrespected by the unwashed.
Pointed out once, that um, postal workers are government union employees too,…
he did not like that being pointed out at all. For many of the spoiled by the government, it's always them, and NOBODY else matters.
Obamacare means Duty to Die. Plain and simple. As a stage IV cancer patient who is thriving and surviving on innovative medication targeted to my specific cancer (which people in the UK and other countries can't get) I am terrified that once this all takes shape, I will be opted out of the system, because my diagnosis is too hopeless and my life isn't worth the expense. Single Payer (i.e. the Govt Plan) will eventually dissolve all private insurance. The underlying, inherent philosophy in a single payer health care system called "Duty to Die" – and Americans are expected to become more willing to accept “hopeless diagnoses” and “forgo experimental treatments,” (as Europeans have learned in their single payer systems), because those are the people who "suck" all of the money out of the system that should be spread around to the younger and more apt to be "productive" in society. Ever wonder why Euros talk about "the un-evolved American 'fear of death'?" – well, that's where it comes from – the brainwashing they have endured after decades in "Duty to Die" health schemes. The overriding philosophy of this administration is that Americans have become addicted to expecting too much from the health-care system.
I have alot of experience with workers comp, and now medicaid. Spine fractured twice, 91 and 04, the second time in thoracic and lumbar. Degenerative disc disease, 8 corrupted discs, one surgery to reconstruct my cervical spine after bone spurs from osteoarthritis started pinching the spinal cord, stenosis in four points, myopathy. I know a widdle bit about pain, and long waits.
The same clowns running health care that ran workers comp, or medicaid?
I went three months without the morphine prescribed because it wasn't affordable out of pocket. and night after night after night with pain, having the sensation of burning up and being freezing cold all at once. Sharp stabbing pain, like an icepick rammed in hard. pain bouncing between 8 and 9 for weeks..
more of that?
The thought makes me want to throw up. I'm not a delicate flower, but please, God please, nothing like that again. No private company ever abused me like they did, I'd rather be flogged.
Workers comp literally fouled up my case, so to cover it up they just dumped me, one lawyer later, reinstated, but they still fight me on everything, still deny deny deny till finally I get an ok, and then, they do it again. The system is hardwired to screw people, I had one of them actually accuse me of making up a false claim, when the company admited it happened on the job, even had the accident on security tape. These gubmint retards couldn't get a heart attack right if God reached out and yanked their out personally.
sorry bout all the typo's, but I'm just a tad upset here. Typing too fast,.
sorry, too much, and no ones fault here, .
sorry.
It's, I've always been a proud man, and they made me react to my condition like a kicked dog, and they shouldn't have that kind of power over many of us.
I just love Steven Crowder ~ he's a great example of a young conservative that gets his message across so well to his peers. Now my college-student daughter has become a fan, and if she's as stubborn at school as she is at home, she and Steven will be converting quite a few young people to conservatism!
As for the health care, I am beside myself with people who argue it's not fair that poor people don't get the same treatment rich people get, that losing your job can take you from great insurance to no insurance, terrified of being sick. Well, we just started our own business, we're living on air and bits of savings, but we darn sure have health insurance.
Imagine the quality of doctor you get when physicians are paid the same as Target cashiers. There will be no incentive to study medicine, so we may end up like the Soviet Union, when they decided for you what you would be when you "grew up."
I was in a car accident yesterday (I'm okay). The EMTs suggested my mom, who was a bit shaken up, go to the ER just to get checked out. Since I was there, and I felt some discomfort, I decided to go ahead and get checked out, too. The accident was at about 5, and I was out of the ER by around 9 – and this was after waiting around at the scene to get the registration info back from the police, after my dad went to have our license plate refastened to the bumper, and after chilling with my mom/having dinner in the ER. I wasn't in a bad way, so I was clearly not a priorty, and I expected to wait around while the doctors tended to more serious cases. I heard PAs and nurses talking about how it had been crazy in the ER all day, but I was in and out in a few hours. My mom was falling asleep, and I said, "Hey, at least we're not in Canada." I think we'd still be there.
BKH, I am sorry to hear about your condition, but glad to hear your are surviving.
Now, if I were Joe Biden, I might say "it's time to do the patriotic thing…"
Good to hear you're okay.
People b!tch about the DMV and the post office and yet they want these people (government workers) to run their medical care and treatment?
sywyn… I"ll say that if I read the bill right… You're one of the "high risk/low reward" people that are going to be getting screwed if this bill gets past the Senate.
Ask your aunt then, why the Congress-critters refused to add the amendment that said that Congress would be under the same bill as the rest of us.. they're not subject to the laws they pass on the rest of us.
Glad your okay…
Didn't we tell you driving on the sidewalks would end badly!?
I get that feeling all the time on Fox. They get excellent guests, then don't give them but a minute or two. Not being in television, I don't know if this has to do with the boredom quality — the leave them hungry for more mentality — but most of the time when they cut away, they cut away to a commercial. I'd be interested to know if that's the case, that they've sold so much commercial air time that they give short shrift to viewing time.
"The scatterbrained celebrities/politicians/progressives will not have to be in the same system as the rest of us."
There was ONE celebrity who did get into the Canadian system accidentally: Natasha Richardson. Ms. Richardson presented to a hospital in Canada with neurological symptoms having had a fall on the ski slope earlier (ergo a reason to check neurological status). Apparently she walked into the hospital under her own power. Two hours later she went out in an ambulance comatose. Two hours after that, she arrived in Montreal and was pronounced neurologically dead a few hours later. Freak accident? Or Canadian Health system? Can anyone imagine this happening in America?
Nationalized health systems do a pretty good job of taking care of the healthy and well — they can dispense vaccinations and well checks (once a year usually) with no problem. (Obama keeps harping on when he says "preventative". Unfortunately, as DOCTOR Krauthammer has pointed out repeatedly, well-checks do little to "prevent" illness. I suspect what Obama means is catching it early. But catching it early requires the SAME treatment as catching it later).
It's when patients get sick that nationalized systems can't deliver as per Crowder's video and all the horror stories we hear.
What most Americans naively believe is that America will get the same health care they get now only it'll be free AND everyone will be included. This is the same mentality of American Leftists who think the reason socialism and communism has failed everywhere it's been tried is because we Americans with our "can do it" ideology haven't tried it. It's inconceivable to most that Americans are just like everyone else and when they stop being recompensed for their labor, they'll stop labor and innovation.
Doctors already are changing their behavior. Many no longer take Medicare patients because it is not cost effective. Through most of the last half of the 20th century, the best and the brightest went to medical school. They knew they'd never become super rich, but they did expect to work hard and earn a good living. As medicine becomes just one more "gumment job" it's unlikely people will be willing to spend four years in college, four years in medical school, one year in internship and x number of years in specialty training to be a GS-22 or whatever that is. Those who do will have the bureaucratic mentality of eight hours a day on the clock (just like they do in the VA system now) and then go home to enjoy their families and leisure time. This results in a back-logs, waiting lists and queues — just like Crowder showed in his video.
From what I understand, and this from a lecture by a Canadian doctor, the government budgets x number of dollars for medical care/treatment in the fiscal year. When the money runs out, other than frank emergencies — and what you had would not have been considered a frank emergency — the doctors and office staff "go on vacation", i.e. close their offices because there is no money to pay them; hospitals go to emergency only basis, furloughing some of the staff, and those, like LawHawkSF above, who have non life threatening (though certainly limb threatening) situations, wait until the next fiscal year starts. Thus the system starts with a backlog.
Has anyone else read the bill? From what I understand on Page 16 (I think it's 16) has language that suggests private insurance companies will not be allowed to enroll NEW members. Thus, Obama is right in that you will not lose your private insurance, but if you don't already have it, you won't be able to get it. LawHawkSF, perhaps you can enlighten us on this.
And don't forget the medical support staff (nurses, techs, etc.) are going to work 9-5, take their allotted breaks and if some patient needs to go to the OR after hours, too bad. The OR techs and scrub nurses have gone home.
True story: England. Patient appears with a ruptured abdominal aneurysm. Registrar (American doctor) claims it's an emergency. "We'll do him directly after lunch" was the physician in charge's response. This friends is national health care.
As I posted above. NHServices deliver well checks and vaccinations just great and they're free. But if you get sick, you are s.o.l.
Growltiger: I have been reading the summaries, so I'm guessing you have a lot more in-depth knowledge of it than I do. But what you are suggesting appears to be the case in regard to the current version inhibiting enrollment of new members. It does not specifically say so, as far as I understand, but makes the process somewhat difficult, and contains disincentives for private individuals even to bother attempting to get a private policy. Equally importantly, the plan as it currently stands relies on its mere words of assurance of the ongoing right to insure privately, but ignores market realities. The plan would seriously reduce employer incentives, create new tax consequences for employment-provided and private insureds, and create a non-competitive environment vis-a-visgovernment plan versus private plans. The market is a force that liberals and socialists simply dismiss with a wave of the hand. In other words, the plan declares it will not eliminate private medical plans, but economic realities and the market will determine otherwise.
Andrew Price is doing an in-depth series on the future of medical care at our Commentarama blog. If you get a chance, please take a look, and since he's doing the heavy lifting on those issues, you can address questions to him which he will be much better prepared to answer than I. We may end up learning from you. You can click on his or my avatar to go to the site.
Growltiger, Investors Business Daily is making this claim about the House bill.
And yes, the bill uses that language, but I think their interpretation may be wrong. I am still reading the bill to make sure, but it looks like what they are proposing is that existing plans can continue to exist, but can't enroll new people. But, new plans can be issued under the terms required by the bill.
So "yes" current plans will not be allowed to enroll new people, but "no" private insurance will not be eliminated.
Very good to hear you an your mom are ok. We kind of like having you around and posting.
Oh, and I think it's time to curtail your bounty hunting activities for a week or two. The driving tactics used can be dangerous.
Yet another clueless fool on the radio this morning. As I was driving into work, the morning team (talk show station) were interviewing a fellow from another station who was espousing the dire need for Obamacare. He was talking up the usual lies, about how the rest of the world has figured out how to do socialized health care and it was about time we did it too. And of course he brings up medicare/medicade and the VA hospital system. The morning hosts, and rightly so, pointed out that said examples are exactly the greatest ones to use, so this joker brings up how the active duty military system of health care is a socialized system that works very well and the quality of healthcare is second to none. I only wished this was a call in show as the hosts, obviously never in the military let that one slide.
(cont. due to length of post)
(continued)
Thing is, the health care in the military is top notch, but it is NOT a socialized system. The doctors, nurses, tech staff and the rest are ALL members of the military themselves. Doctors and nurses all had their training done (most on their own) in the same medical schools/progams that their civilian counterparts went through and joined up afterwards. Said military medical facilities are not going bankrupt providing said care because their military staff are getting the same pay as everyone else in the military. This is not something that can work in the civilian world. Also, said medical staff are as equally committed and loyal to their military patients as every other man and woman in the armed forces are to each other, hence the top notch care.
I only bring this up here cause I can see this becoming another contrived talking point among those who are defending BO's lunacy.
Pretty inventive. If current plans cannot enroll new people, then they will by necessity go out of business.
Do the math. A plan has x number of clients, and cannot enroll new clients. As those 1,000 clients turn 65 and go on Medicare OR leave the plan (whereupon other plans cannot enroll them, thereby forcing them to "join" the government plan), sooner or later, by attrition, the plan cannot support the claims and has to cease to be in business, dumping their enrollees into the government plan since they cannot join another plan in existence. Where I become confused is if new plans can be issued, then why the prohibition against the existing plans? Doesn't make sense. Correct me where I'm wrong.
ARRRRRRGHGHGHGHGHGHGHG
I just got pinched by the "comment must be approved" Nazi. There was NOTHING in my post that should have triggered the filter.
AP
Just got pinched by the moderating Nazi. Have no clue why. My post may or may not appear later. Let's see if I can say what I said without saying what I said.
So existing plans can continue to exist but cannot enroll new people, but "new plans can be issued".
How does this make any sense?
If existing plans cannot enroll new people, then by attrition, they will cease to exist. People go off insurance plans all the time, by changing plans (not allowed under the bill) or turning 65 (Medicare) or dying. If new enrollees cannot be enrolled, then the plan cannot possibly afford to pay claims.
Very inventive of the Democrats. Most people will be too stupid to see it for what it is.
Right. The way this seems to work is that you have to be either on (1) the government plan, (2) some other government plan (like Medicare), (3) in a "qualifying" private plan, or (4) in a "grandfathered" plan.
The plan you're on now (probably) will be considered a qualifying plan. They can keep offering it, but they can't add new people (and they have limits on the rate changes the plan can make). That will kill off the plan, but that's the goal. They want to pretend to let you keep your current plan, but to really kill these off so that everyone is under the government plan or a qualifying plan.
The qualifying plans are subject to a lot more regulation — the grandfather plans aren't.
Interestingly, none of this keeps a private insurer from offering a non-qualifying plan, but you will get taxed as if you don't have a plan if that is your plan.
I agree! Lets disband all government run serivces! How about disbanding the armed forces, the police or firefighters?
I'm thinking "Brazil" here (doctors — instead of repairmen — sneaking around treating people the government has fingered for termination and/or is too inept to provide care for). If it weren't so scary, it would be hysterically funny. What's even more amusing is the useful idiots who are buying this stuff.
They think they're going to get the same kind of care we get today only FREE. What a hoot!
Just wait until Joe Sixpack's kid gets a malignant brain tumor that is considered terminal and he's told to take the kid home to die. (Before you think I'm exaggerating, this is exactly what happened in Britain a few years back. A young boy was dx'd with a brain tumor of a tissue type that has a high risk of mortality. The NHS declared the tumor inoperable. For some reason, the child's plight came to the attention of Ben Carson (neurosurgeon at Hopkins) who offered to operate for nothing. A bunch of people collected money, flew the kid to America, Hopkins wrote off his bill and Carson operated gratis. The child recovered and went back to Britain. Whether the tumor recurred and the Brits were right or not, I don't know. Haven't read any more about it.
Why do Brits accept this? I don't know, but I do know those who can afford to buy private insurance DO. (Same with the Austrians. A friend's brother in Australia paid out of pocket for his coronary artery bypass because he was afraid he'd die while waiting in the queue — three months long).
A few years back, a well-known news person's wife suffered a stroke while traveling in Britain. She was taken to a Brit hospital — free medical care for all, you know — but British hospitals can't afford fibrinolytic agents like Urokinase (too expensive for the NHS) and she didn't get it. This drug has to be given early in the event. Had she stroked in a US hospital she would have gotten this drug immediately. I don't know what her long term deficit was, but she did have a neurological deficit upon discharge. I don't know if the anchorman or she understand medicine enough to know that not using the fibrolytic might have reduced or eliminated her deficit.
I suspect at first our medical marvels will be available but as they become more and more cost prohibitive, they will be phased out. A mid size American city has more MRI scanners than in all of Canada. Canadians' dogs can get MRIs and CT scans easier and quicker than their human owners.
I'm getting picked up by the filter Nazi — perhaps the use of medical terminology is triggering the Nazi. Don't know, but it's getting really old really fast. What about your blog? Do you allow commentary?
I think the filter Nazi picks up on people who post a lot on this blog. If you have more than 5 in fifteen minutes or less. At least that is the way I have experienced it.
If I pace myself, no admin hold.
Thanks. I'll remember that.
I'm not sure if this is an earlier or later comment, but the idea is to drive people into new plans that are directly regulated by the new bill.
I've had problems too now and then, and it always seems to be the most benign posts.
In any event, check this out: http://commentarama.blogspot.com/2009/07/obamacar...
That outlines what's going on (technically at least).
Growltiger: The answer to your question is "yes." Commentary is allowed and encouraged.
I have been there and it is GREAT!!!
Thanks Joelim!
And yes, we welcome all questions and comments. . . even dissenting views.
I notice this topic is (so far) troll-free. Guess even THEY can't defend PrezBO when it comes to their health care being screwed up. This bill scares me no end. My father is in his 70s, and has cancer and Alzheimer's. I shudder to think how he would be treated under Obamacare. Thankfully, we're still permitted private health insurance for awhile longer.
I live in Ontario, and right now the statistic is that 1 million Ontarians cannot find a GP. I don't know how long the waiting list is, but I ma lucky enough to have one, and I get asked by many friends id she is taking any more patients, because they can't find a doctor.
And Andrew and I are sometimes the two dissenting views (ignore this comment, Andrew).
Hey Let’s Do What the Canadians Do!!!!!…
When it comes to healthcare reform. Canada’s system has been lauded as a model by Michael Moore, President Bill Clinton, President Barack Obama, Senator Bernie Sanders (I-VT) and a whole host of Democrats. It must be great. Right?
W…
Hmm, I don't remember saying anything about disbanding all government services. But come to think of it, that doesn't sound like such a bad idea. Well, except for the ones you mentioned. Thanks for the wonderful idea!
Thank you!
Thanks! Surprisingly enough, I was in a left hand turn lane. So far so good with the sidewalk driving! ^__^
Aw, thanks! I like reading your posts, too! And yeah, I took a day off work. The evil-doer gremlins who leave trash in my store escaped my wrath for a day…
"He was talking up the usual lies, about how the rest of the world has figured out how to do socialized health care."
NO, OMG. They haven't. WTF??????????? (Also, I have heard complaints about military health care. Remember that whole VA hospital snafu?)
True story also. A fellow was bleeding profusely from the rectum and it was about 4pm. The tech in charge of the GI lab had a quota of 6 studies a day and this was #7 but an emergency. You guesed it. He read his book until 5pm and said Duty Day is over and went home. We had to transfuse the guy all night just because of this. National healthcare at work.
Here is a question.
I have always thought that Government Health Care (Nothing the Government does is very Social) would end up being like Government Schools (their is nothing Public about the thinking allowed to be taught). With districts where people would be assigned. In other words where you lived you would be assigned in a hospital district the same way your children are assinged to school districts. Thus wealthier neighborhoods would end up with more materials, doctors, nurses, beds,equipment etc. while poorer ones would suffer because there is no local tax base. My father works for the community college and knows a lot of teachers. He was at a school in Deltona which is where migrant formers live and they had no chalk. The teacher had to buy it out of his salary. It is why he supported a plan in Florida to give every teacher a couple hundred bucks for school supplies by the state.
Does anyone know if this plan states anything with regard to this? I see great problems with this thing?
Too True…….. "Buck- um-all"
Never a bill should be passed, by any legislative body, that does not include mandatory participation by the signatories.
I love my mommy, please can't she live?
My Father continues to work at 67, was planning to retire in 2010 (deserves it). If this "Bill" goes through, he will work on, in an attempt to keep his employer's Health Care Plan.
Neither parent wants to go on 'Medi-care-less'!
Why is it that the older people in our society are considered leeches for collecting Social Security?
My Father (for example) has paid into SS since he was 16, holding his first job. This was and is mandatory!
Now, when he is qualified to collect, (51 yrs of contributions later) he is to be considered a drain on society.(?)
Due to the fact that my father works, he is still paying into SS at a rate of 7.65% and medicare at 1.45%. Washington has no problem taking that money from him, while planning on using it to pay for someone and something else. Hummm!
Ginger, I don't think it's totally viewed as a drain on society on it's own (at least I don't).
The problem becomes when you get people coming in and collecting against it who never paid in, or paid in for only a few years (one of the huge arguments against illegal immigrant amnesty). You also have individual fraud.
Pile onto that that Social Security was originally supposed to be an untouchable fund, but every time it has had a budget surplus, Congress has raided it by borrowing against it for other programs instead of holding it back in store for the American people. This is one of the reasons red flags start going off for me any time someone arguing for a program like it (mandantory, 'untouchable', etc) starts going off about it and how I'm eeeeeeeeeeevil for not supporting it 100% with unquestioning, unblinking loyalty.
As an aside in the late 60's early 70's congress passed a law called ERISA (Earned Retirement Income and Security Act). It seems there were companies that used a "Pay as you Go" model for the retirement plan. They counted on current employees funding the retirement payouts of the latter. When these companies had an economic downturn and layeed o employees there was not enough paid in.
Congress made "Pay as you go" illegal aned set up a whole new disclosure requirements on Financial statements for us CPA's to figure out to prove it. When we discussed the SSN plan of W to give us privatized accounts James Carvell went out and defended "Pay as you go". No one in the media ever asked him to explain the ERISA law. Politicians are theives. They steal from everyone and give to the arrogant.
So true!
Let everyone save the money they earn and keep Uncle out of it.
Yes they are very patriotic
A great blog
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagon got rid of them i the 1986 tax code.
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagan got rid of them i the 1986 tax code.
What stops me from creating an insurance company in the Bahamas and making arrangements with private doctors in the US who supply medical services on a cash basis to provide the service through the Bajhamian corporation. I know for a fact that the Bahamas are already set up with investment companies to avoid US tax that while technically illegal the IRS cannot do anything about it as long as the monies never leave the Bahamian banks.
Im cannot imagine that anyone with any money whatsoever would agree to this. I still contend that loopholes will be built into this situaltion that only someone with enough wealth can take advantage of. Democrats are notorious for creating such loopholes. Under the 90% tax rates of liberalism of the 70's there were numerous schemes to hide all the money. Reagan got rid of them in the 1986 tax code.
Is that why you fear those right wingers with their shot guns.
After all the only thing that puts a zombie down is the bullet throgh the brain pan.
I can tell you how to find a GP in the United States. Google, or use a phone book and look up General Practioner in the Physician section. With one phone call, possibly two you will now have a GP to visit. If you do your research and read online reviews, it could take up to an hour. All my relatives are Canadian. My mother was born and raised there, naturalized here. What that film showed is exactly what my relatives go through. When I had a knee injury, I got a Orthopedic Surgeon looking at it, an MRI and surgery in a week. I know both systems, I absolutely don't want the Canadian one.
The one thing to remember about American health care is that you can always improve your position by merit. you can earn more or pay enough to get the health care you want. In socialized medicine, you can't. You can't do anything to get better health care. Nothing you do will affect the outcome. You have no control. you get a bad doctor, oh well he is your guy.
Blast those evil gremlins! A pox on their kind!
Indeed I do. Some people will blind themselves to anything before admitting they are wrong.
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