Great and timely article, Andrew. I agree wholeheartedly. That's why I am a big proponent in banning people who come in and spew their talking point lines. It is not living in an echo chamber to weed out people who have absolutely nothing to add to a discussion, but seek to derail it by their flame throwing. If someone wants to genuinely discuss and learn, then it's easy enough to tell those from the trollers.

The strategy of the Left is always to ignore the debate and attack their opponent personally. It is an immediate signal that the person is a seminar caller. Most of them also read their talking points and that becomes evident after just a few words. There can be no discussion with these people and cutting them off is the only viable action.

I'm assuming it's Intense Debate that is using robo-moderation, but I don't know that for sure. If it is moderators at Big Hollywood, then my comments apply here rather than at Intense Debate. Some of our gangs' best irony and sarcasm gets lost in Alice in Wonderland moderation.

Agreed. And I have no moral dilema with deleting their posts and kicking them out. They aren't serious about the debate, so why should be treat their garbage seriously.

I would like to see them require everyone to register. I think that would eliminate the drive-by trolling. People who come, post something inflamatory and then leave, never to return. We can pretty much handle the rest.

Lawhawk, I rarely have problems with the filter anymore. I've solved most of the riddle and I just avoid the traps.

What I don't understand is why sometimes the trolls get to use unallowable words. I also don't understand why they can often make these huge posts?

The lower the rating a comment has, the more vital it is that you DO NOT F__KING RESPOND TO IT. I've broken that rule many times and I regret it.

Agreed this site has done an excellent job of keeping trolling to a minimum even before intense debate was instituted.

Also keep in mind that lefties seem to have had exclusive control over cultural media for decades. Little comments written into dialogue of TV shows or movies, comedians establishing that it’s funny to laugh at a conservative point of view, etc. Rush was the first large-scale push back to that. There are more of course, but you get the idea.

My point is that they’ve got the experience. While I believe that conservatives have the superior argument, conservatives don’t seem to know how to put it into action as far as all the little ways in which to influence the culture are concerned.

Most conservatives also don’t seem to be in a position to influence like the dearth of lefties in Hollywood are, so it’s easy for lefties that are so inclined, to become “trolls”. For them, it’s simply a new technique of the same general media blitz.

That’s why I love this site (sorry, not trying to “suck up” here). I see it as the starting point of a big push back (culturally).

The DFTT method works well for the trolls who get off on tweaking people. All they want is a rise out of people, so if you ignore them, they eventually go away. It's about power for them. Unfortunately, we can't get everyone to agree to stop talking to these people. Moreover, some of them, like Stupid, will pose as multiple posters to generate responses to himself in the hopes that others will join in.

The real problem are the ideological trolls. I don't know if they are paid or are just little hitlers, but they will come and come and come, with the idea being that they are serving their cause by disrupting us. If they can mess up the Board enough, they believe that new visitors will turn away or that existing people will fade away. That's why you need to police these folks heavily, because they are actively trying to destroy the site. I don't know the best way to handle these people. I would say, that's what moderation is for.

Of course, you're right. They still haven't taken away the right of an owner to refuse entry to unwanted guests. Or to expel them when they've violated the rules of civil discourse. At least not yet.

I'm glad Andrew has written this article. There needs to be a concerted effort to combat Axelrod's minions. Enough of this easy-going nonsense. This is war and they're playing for keeps. It's bad enough that they infect Politico, the major newspapers, etc., but to allow them on Conservative blogs is flat out silly. They come out with their same ad hominems, same coordinated talking points to the point of nausea.

I think what conservatives need to do is maintain a voluntary "ridicule" squad at these other sites that point out what the coordinated attack of the day theme is. If they attack, we meta-counterattack. Point out the narrative and it loses all power.

"They want to ensure that President Obama is not subject to the same coordinated, facts-be-damned, multimedia takedown they employed over eight long years to destroy the presidency – and the humanity – of George W. Bush."

This is the only part of the otherwise spot-on original article with which I take issue. This sentence suggests, probably un-intentionally, that conservatives and libertarians must use "facts-be-damned" tactics to expose the Dear Leader's lack of clothes. I disagree. There is more than enough in Obama and co.'s on-the-job performance to criticize without resorting to the sleazy ad-hominem/ red herring/straw man attacks used by the left against President Bush.

Andrew, these tactics aren't limited to the internet. I've found that simple civil discourse with "friends" of the left-leaning persuasion has often left me friendless. The great group mind-think that the left accuses conservatives of having is alive and well behind their own noses. They simply can't stand people who disagree with them.

"There is more than enough in Obama and co.'s on-the-job performance to criticize without resorting to the sleazy ad-hominem/ red herring/straw man attacks used by the left against President Bush."

Agreed. Besides, conservatives just seem clumsy and generally not very good at it when they try it.

During the election, at my previous blog, I was constantly hit with "Concern Trolls." They would come in as one of us — Republicans — but "concerned" that we were losing. Pseudo-Republicans designed to undermine morale and enthusiasm. The extent to which they would go was quite sophisticated, including the frequent changing of IP addresses to break through the filter after being banned. Many would change screen names and loop their IP's through some foreign country, mostly Amsterdam.

Their MO was, "Gee, I really want McCain to win but Palin is dragging us down." One claimed to work for the campaign in a swing state and have inside info on discouraging polls.

The CT's really ramped things up in the days when McCain surged after the Palin pick and the convention.

Another thing they do is drop racist comments hoping to discredit the blog.

It's a war of attrition. The idea is to wear us down and exhaust us so we stop gathering, motivating each other, and coming up with ideas.They make weeding them out labor intensive hoping we'll give up on comments altogether — because then we're not communicating and gathering and game planning… We're simply in the dark, demoralized and feeling lost. It's a genius tactic. Dirty as hell, but effective.

It should be said that these scourges are completely different beings from someone truly interested in engaging in honest debate — or someone honestly raising a little hell because they disagree (heaven knows I've done both). There are a few leftists on this blog with high comment ratings, like MovieBob, because we know the difference between honest, passionate disagreement and one of Axelrod's Astroturfers.

We get several of those here. There's one on the other page. Shows up for the first time, is all registered, seems to agree, and then posts three or four racist comments. I don't know if we should respond to those or what? Any guidance would be appreciated!!

Andrew is the only one who "Gets it" on the right.

Part 1:

What angers me is that this is another way that the left has bastardized the constitution for their own nefarious ends. The original basis of the 1st Amendment protections of Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Assembly were to protect people who voiced unpopular opinions from the tyranny of the government they were critizing. Instead they have used these freedoms to create straw men and spike teams to blur and change arguements.

Unfortunately, there is no easy answer because the system is not setup to provide an easy answer. Every step that could be taken to combat the trolls carries the same unattended consequence of stifing debate and taking away the anomnity of those who my need it.

Andrew,
I’m so glad you’ve addressed this issue at BH. Right after the election I couldn’t bring myself to comment on another site because of the total and complete infiltration of those filthy green skinned, wet footed, foul creatures that live under the bridge.

I dropped out of sight until about a month ago, swearing never ever to “click” a message on a keyboard again.

But, things are “changing” in a way I’d never thought I’d “hope” for.

Occasional or infrequent resignation is useless, as I’ve seem at my other favorite sight at HotAir. The astroturffers and bridge dwellers are thriving over there and they has open registration every couple of months.

Here at BH it's getting pretty bad at all hours of the day or night, and just takes away from the converstion.
It's like some stanger walking up to your table that you are sitting at with friends at a restaurant and helping themselves to your beer and calling your mother or sister a dirty name, then walking away. And, as conservatives we are suppose to be Civil and take the high ground mind you?

Sorry, not any more, the stakes are way too high.

I didn’t get my ass blown up in Nam to take their sh!t laying down. I didn’t then and I’m not going to start now.

That’s why I sigh off all of my comments with Not Over. As in, the FIGHTS Not Over.

So,
Not Over.

I dunno. But if they are, I guarantee the wise-cracking, funny, musically-inspired and incredulous crows will be gone.

I guess I see things differently. I've never seen the Right so fired up as I do now. Levin's book is #1, and Atlas Shrugged is now at #37. Rush's ratings are skyrocketing. Friends of mine who were lured by Obama's moderate claims are now yelling in fury how they hate his guts. The Tea Parties are just gonna get bigger and bigger. I'm actually starting to see anti-Obama bumperstickers in Hollywood and protestors in Studio City. I agree with Newt who said this guy is dictatorial and Pelosi has overreached; he predicts a Republican takeover of the House in 2010. I don't care what these little Internet brownshirts do, America is finally waking up.

They have no ideas. Just talking-points. I realized I should have added "guests who overstay their welcome to my list.

That's one of the reasons why I like coming here is that a majority of us are on the same page, and we do motivate and respond to one another. I don't like the idea of this site being deserted because of trolls. I'll fight them if I must but I would rather they just go away.

I enjoy feeding the trolls because they're easy targets. It's one of my daily indulgences.

I have a hard time resisting as well. They make it so darn easy!!

I always encourage reasonable debate. Here in Austin, it's a regular sport between me and my liberal friends.

The determining factor here is whether or not someone is bringing actual content or supporting evidence to the table. It doesn't hurt to have some knowledge or taste in film.

They'd have negative point counts next to their names if only they weren't too cowardly to register with IntenseDebate.

I'm calling our trolls out — why don't you register so you can comment like civilized beings, instead of this hit-and-run crap? I respect some of our more outspoken critics like MovieBob, because a guy like him actually has the b@/!s to put his reputation where his mouth is.

So, using proper punctuation like quotes gets you eaten by the mod demon? How disappointing.

The efforts of the left to silence the rest of us have not gone unnoticed. What hurts us most is that major media has not made it a point to highlight this disparity. When media disparity and injustice are mentioned by anyone on the right the major media outlets go out on a limb to characterize such comments as whining and never fail to mention Fox News, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh as though they were the great equalizers that they benevolently tolerate. We know all too well that the left would silence all dissension if they were given the choice. In the meantime, while they wage their war to silence the loudest of us through more permanent means their minions are hard at work efforting to squelch every voice that is not in harmony with their worldview.

It should also be noted that this war of words is also being fought in Christian venues where many conservatives retreat to fellowship and to reaffirm their moral convictions. In those places where there is little to no moderation, such as myspace, most Christian forums are besieged by those whose wills and beliefs are malevolent and maligned .

Trolls as their name implies are at best a distraction and serve only to create chaos and disharmony. They are but an echo of others whose designs are more sinister and destructive. As Andrew indicated they are the ones we should be wary of. They are the wolves in sheep's clothing. Fearful of the truth they stick to the shadows always taunting and mocking but never willing to stand face to face. As others have said it's a form of terrorism. Like so many "Freedom Fighters" they hide behind the innocent darting from one refuge to the next until our backs are turned. Not long after they are busy spinning tales of their bravery in hopes they might inspire others to follow by their example. And many do.

Needless to say there are many of us who value truth and honor above all else and we will not be silenced or discouraged. Sean Hannity sets a wonderful example in this regard. He welcomes such attacks and offers to debate anyone on substance and facts just as any of us here would. As I have said in other posts, there is a difference in winning an argument and a debate. In an argument you need only have the last word our shout down your opponent but in a debate one of you will undoubtedly be proven wrong or less informed.

Brisco,

That's funny, I just reported some on that thread, too. The first time I've reported any at all. I am just getting tired of the schtick, amd the way they end up hijacking threads for their amusement. Look, we all know we aren't racists or religious fanantics, so don't bother even trying to defend yourself against these idiots. I haven't ever heard them called "concern trolls" though. That's funny. I see a lot of those on blogs, attempting to suck the wind out of everyone's sails. I can't believe how many of them are out there, do they still get paid for their work, or are they just doing it as a freebie for points, later on?

One of my other blogs of choice is a place called Right Wing News, and we saw our share of those sorts. It helps that our comment community is small and fairly familiar with each other. Several of those guys can spot a sock puppet or a fake miles away. And after a while on the 'net, you get adept at reading people through their posts too. It doesn't take too long before you spot someone trying too hard.

So what do we do? Trolls don't have much stamina, so if we pound them with a logical argument, they will tire and go away. We have a few that keep coming back- Tehstupid and wr1,- but they are masochists so we give them to torture they want (and so richly deserve). The worst they can do is call us names and I'm not afraid of being called a name.

Well Chas, I can see your point, but I also see their's, too. It gets old when people are continually bellyaching, and it sounds like you got swept up into a group that they felt was being too negative. Right or wrong, though, it is her blog. I agree it can be hard when you dissent on someting, but unfortunately that is the way it is. I used to like to read Little Green Footballs, but now they it is a continually bashing on creationism and Christianity. I don't even hold super strong views on most of what they say, but the negativity of it, is offputting. I really like to read the Conservative Cave, Sweetness and Light, and Newsbusters. Usually good stuff, and for the most part, the posters are like the ones here.

I think that Andrew's idea of invading Kos, DU, HuffPo and places like that might not be possible unless we truly do stoop to their level. Unless they've changed policies for example, DU tends to use a heavy ban stick for anyone who doesn't stay in the echo chamber. There is an urban legend at RWN about one commenter who registered there and was banned for a one-word post: Why?

A better tactic might be to seek out the places like my husband frequents where they say they are seeking open, unbiased debate and wade in bashing heads. Or engage in vlog shenanigans via YouTube where I've been following a fun exchange between Devil's Advocate (conservative) and The Amazing Atheist (speaks for itself I think). DA is winning quite handily I might add.

I agree with both of you, and doubleplus agree with the notion of mandatory registration.

It's the Chicago Way. Which is sort of appropriate right now isn't it?

A dirty secret about the left is that there are just as many –if not more– racists on their side as on the right. A lot of liberals are hateful and elitist in general, so racism isn't a stretch.

DFTT is the best policy! However with some really pesky little troll, you mustn’t start a debate. They use pretzel logic and, “but, if, yes, no,” you into exhaustion. Like a petulant child give them the back of your hand (metaphorically of coarse) and send them to their rooms. I’m new to blogging (thank you Big Hollywood) but I’m not new to ‘60s radicals or their spawn. Reasoned debate will not work.

Also some names and ethnicities will knock you out, the speaker, J_ws, etc.

That one catches me too.

Not only is it the default dogma of the politically and economically uniformed, which it is, but they have a hive mind mentality which is reinforced through the educational system in many places at all levels. College tending to be the worst, I'd love to go back and chat with some of my old professors, just to watch the dawning horror on their face when they realized that the indoctrination didn't stick.

I did have my own quasi-liberal phase for about a year or so in college too, I say "quasi" because I never believed it, never talked about politics but just didn't speak out against their lunacy, in my defense it was all for the girls. Luckily I figured out really fast that the girls that actually believed what I did were way less annoying to deal with so gave up pretending and went out looking for like minded souls.

So that's why it was so slow the other day!

There are some others who get it. But not enough for my liking. I'd have to say that Andrew Breitbart is one of the better 21st century thinkers that I have been reading/hearing in the last few years. He understands principals, values AND the popular culture. And communicates his thoughts on all very well.

Keep up the great work, Mr. Breitbart! We need more like you and the great cast that you have assembled here!!

Yes Lawhawk you can make fun of Dumbo, ha…

And I absolutely agree with you — they're trying to intimidate. They run in wolf packs. The recent post on atheism was only the most recent example. The militant atheists did a huge drive-by and ridiculed everyone and then took off, not bothering to read replies to their hate-filled attacks. They're cowards and bullies and really not much different than the Taliban. The righteous man is beset on all sides by iniquities of the selfish and the tyranny of evil men. I've been on political blogs for many years and welcome their attacks. As soon as they open their mouths, they prove they're their own worst enemy.

At the risk of being lectured a bit;
I've read everyone's comments to this point, and I can see where you all are coming from, BUT…

I am mad as hell, people. I mean, really, really angry. These people, perpetrators, whatever, are messing up my COUNTRY, fer (blank)sakes! My poor children and I are going to have to clean up this disgusting mess, and they'll be left with the rest of the pile long after I'm gone. That is hurtful to me as their father. This isn't embarrassing, its shameful. I am not taking it anymore.

So, I'm going to wrestle the pig, kick whatever its presenting me, and make it into yummy good bacon. I am going to ignore the high road, and hit, kick, bite, pass gas, or whatever else I need to do to insult and belittle these critters. I am going to personalize everything with them. I am making them the target. I am going to introduce them to the same tactics, axis of fire, enfilade, flanking, sticks and rocks, spitting contests, etc. that they use against us.

The gloves are OFF. These people are going to get the message whether the phone rings or not. I am not leaving all options on the table, I am going to take the options and gleefully insert them into their eye. This is a bar fight, and I am going to walk out of it alive.

I am Patrick Henry. Liberty or Death for me.

If this be treason, make the most of it!

Zactly, Stan

I'm perfectly happy to entertain myself pointing out their hypocrisy — in love and kindness and with all due graciousness — then seeing how long they can stand their cognitive dissonance before their heads explode and they simply vanish from the debate.

I used to "troll" Media Matters before they booted me. They HATE when you bring facts to the debate.

Oh yeah, and before I close this out, keeping in mind this is a Hollywood site, let's all try to remember the wonderful scenes of heads exploding from the movie Scanners, the greatest sci-fi flick of all time.

We had a bunch of concern trolls and mobys at Ace's during the election, and they still pop up every once in a while. But it's mostly gone back to average trolls. We either ignored them or just mocked them so relentlessly that the ones who bothered to stick around for more than a hit-and-run eventually gave up and ran out of their basements to cry into their mother's skirts.

Like many of you, I have battled in this blog war. I used to enjoy going into HP and lobbing factual grenades into their head nodding midst and then 10 guys leap on you at once. Most don't actually debate, rather if you make a few good points, they get you banned. It's a war of attrition and most people just don't have the time for this. I have an idea. Why don't we get Andrew, Rush, Sean and ourselves and everyone we can think of, to pressure the state Republican party people to change the bylaws on how we nominate the Republican per state. My whole family and everyone I knew locally was just flabbergasted at this idiotic Republican nominating process. Maybe we should yield the blogging field and let them argue with themselves and we push into directed changes at state levels. If we don't stop the Democrats and maybe the Independents from voting in the Republican primaries; we're just going to keep getting the same losers as the nominee. No offense to McCain who most of us voted for. We also need to embrace the independent republicans like Lou Dobbs and Ron Paul instead of dismissing them as idiots which Sean Hannity does on a routine basis. We can all blog till the crows come home but unless we change the state nominating rules, WE WILL LOSE AGAIN in 2012.

A thought just came though my mind. This became a thread on wet footed creatures that live under the bridge right? Uh…so where are the little narcissus now haunting this thread I wonder…Hmmmm? You all know they’re reading this.

Wipe the droll off your bills and come out and play with us you chickens! We're ready for you.

*Cluck…cluck…cluck…BA GACK!*

Not Over.

The Palin haters drive me crazy too. I never hear a criticism about her politics. Ever! Without fail it's about her family or her personally. We even have a troll around here that goes by "Wasilla Hillbilly." Cute huh? Palin has more experience than Obama all day long and more common sense. I guess that's why the Left had to attack her so hard. They recognized her as a threat and moved to eliminate her by any means possible. But I don't know many Conservatives who are comfortable following that formula– which begs the question, how do combat the looniness of the Left without stooping to their level?

Pretty much. You can usually tell it's one when they claim to be a Christian or a lifelong Republican and start expressing opinions that look like they came from MoveOn.org.

It's as if they think the people who are Christian or Republican or vaguely on that side are so stupid they'll believe that sort of thing.

To conclude; you don't need a comment section. Use your email for that and put a filter on it. Post your articles, links, opinion, and analysis and let them stand on their own merits.

What, you don't like what he said? Are you offended? Does my commentary offend you? Perhaps your feeding back here isn't needed, right? You don't need to comment, like you said, right, just state your position, right?

So take your commentary and follow your own advice, microencephlalitic. Put your flapping lips together and Blow.

Exactly! I get dinged with the "you've used too many characters" thing all the time, yet see some people respond with 18 paragraphs of gibberish. Some how, I'm sure Bush is to blame.

you are correct, sir. I may be wrong but, reasoned discourse will eventually overcome the vitrol from the left. They will die of their own hand,………….evetually…..

Awww come on Dave..I love chewing on trolls and spitting them out, it's always fun. I love BH, so many like minded individuals here. *sigh* I'm in troll stomping heaven.

The sad fact of the matter is that no matter WHAT conservatives say about obama and his administration it would ALL be true.

lol..Right, seems like an oxymoron to me.

Marion!……………I was through there tonight ( on the way back from drinking establishment of choice). Cultured accents…….you got it, bro…….

plus I was just a mud draggin', dirt eatin', jarhead…………and I frickin' loved it! That's why I went back home.

Hey now, usually only 16 out of my 18 paragraphs are authentic frontier gibberish, the rest are cunning subliminal messages. I personally blame Pelosi, every time I see her my brain starts acting like the protagonist's from an H. P. Lovecraft story.

No question. It's a Psy-Op. Some are good. The majority are so ridiculous, though…..

Luckily, the great majority of us are well read. We see the herrings quickly. …..Imagine that…………..common sense.

I third that.

Andrew (Breitbart), I love you man and I love this site. But I have to point out the incongruity between your article (which I agree with) and this website allowing anonymous comments.

The commenter-reputation can be a valuable tool. That big, red "-50" makes it very easy to ignore the trolls. But, that doesn't work if you don't force people to register.

The only caveat to that would be that I sometimes see posts given a "thumbs down" not for trolling or being rude, but simply for posting an opposing point of view. That to me is something that we as a community should frown on.

Not much of a secret. Actually all their accusations against conservatives are projection, pure and simple. The leftie view of conservatives comes from Archie Bunker and from Frank Burns and that hard-up security goon on MASH – parodies played by flaming liberals. As has been commented on other articles the past day or two, it is the Dem party that has always held down African Americans, taught them that they couldn't succeed, tried its best to prevent them from succeeding, and declared itself their protector. It is dems also who hold down women (Condoleeza, Sarah), sneer at the disabled and judge everyone by the size of their bankrolls.

I don't seem to have any problems with my posts, and I am about as Religious, Conservative, gun-toting, knuckle-dragging, Flag loving as you can get…….
Dang it….. I guess I need to try harder.

phbbbtt
civilized discourse. What's the fun in that?
I'm with you, problem is many people don't know how to engage in it. They suddenly launch in to the name calling.
Self-deprication is lost on them as well.
I use the term "Masters of the single entendre"

I love this site, and a few smelly trolls aren't going to scare me away. If they really start to populate this site, I think there are enough creative thinkers here to figure out ways to marginalize them. Their tiny robot brains can't out maneuver the minds I see at work here.

Hey, we could form some kind of Adopt-A-Troll program. Disarm, isolate, educate and reform them one troll at a time. Kind of like the Borg.

Way to work in a "Blazing Saddles" reference!

I have noticed one thing about the dems that got taken in by the new messiah. They've been awfully quiet lately. It seems they've come to realize there is a difference between giving teleprompter- guided speeches and actually governing.

One problem I see with trolling left-wing sites is this: How do you discredit people with no shame, or limits on what they will do in power? Basically, I believe it is the basic soundness of the right's philosophies that makes it easy for the left to distort them.

Suppose one tries the equivalent of posting racist garbage here under the guise of being a conservative or libertarian in order to discredit the right as a whole. That is, if I were to go over to the Daily Kos and post hopes that Obama's "Civilian Defense Force" will get its brown shirts soon and start rounding up capitalists, clergy, and people who listen to talk radio and sending them to Bill Ayers' liquidation centers in the southwest, would any of the real lefties have a problem with that sentiment? Would any lefty object if I posted a call for censorship of the Internet or the collectivization of private property?

The Block of Text approach. You can try to wade through it and address everything about it. Or you can pretty much ignore it and type tl;dr (too long; didn't read). I make it a practice to post either hyperlinks to my supporting material or only quote the relevant material. If you're already following a practice, it gets easier to demand that they do the same, or flat-out dismiss them.

Ace is entertaining.

The trolls don't bother me so much as they're like flies. They're easy to spot, they buzz around and bother people. They usually don't hang around very long. Spout the usual stuff that sounds like they stuff that's printed in their union rags, NOW fliers, Dem talking points, etc. When hit with facts, they take a couple more swipes, with the same, repeated non-sense that's usually very easy to disprove, then poof, they're gone. Remember when Hannity or someone else would go around on the street and ask Obama supporters WHY they were supporting him. The usual answer was that he was going to bring change and hope to the US. When asked what that meant, they got a glazed look on their face and repeated hope and change. They didn't know what they were supporting, but a marketing phrase. This stuff is no different. When I ask someone to expand on what they're talking about they just repeat what they said before. I have no problem arguing with an honest, clear thinking liberal, but I hate trying to talk to somone who repeats talking points. And that's what we've got with these trolls.

Oh yeah, they're ALL over digg. You can smell their idiocy from here.

I will not comply, I will not submit, I will not be silenced, I will not be intimidated…
I will never break. I stand strong with my fellows.
Too many have bled and died for my freedom, and I will not compromise their integrity with weakness…

You're right. This is Not Over.

I was beginning to think it was just me. I had toyed with the idea of asking Mr. Breitbart to banish trolls from the Big Hollywood Universe, but I thought maybe it was just that I am ultra sensitive. Last night I just resolved to stop posting. I have reconsidered.
I never thought I would view the internet as a sort of Liberal (I mean in the classic sense of the word) support group. This is in some ways very frightening to me (the bit about people acting like I need to apologize for having good sense) and it is exhausting. But as I have said many times:

FREEDOM IS NOT FOR SISSIES

You forgot to state "I am not a liberal". Libs need to say that to try and make everyone else believe it. What are YOU afraid of John, a little feedback from a bunch of conservatives? Afraid to hear/read what we have to say about your precious Obamby? Too bad, you're just going to have to live with the fact that you don't control the internet. That's gotta hurt.

Leo, There is one or more of these trolls that hang out on a local politics blog I frequent. They always post as "anonymous." So after suffering their stupidity for a while, I'll post as "anonymous" and apologize for my earlier comments, and for being a liar. It will upset their momentum for while, but they stick to their talking points.

Thanks, I won't. Now, as I've done with a couple of other overexcitable conservatives who apparently were salivating at the opportunity to put their troll-eliminating skills to work, I'll correct your wrong impression. You are firing at your own troops. Go back and look at my comments to BH over the past several weeks and you'll see that I am in fact conservative. This must be quite entertaining for the real liberal trolls, watching the Big Hollywood comment section tear itself apart without their help. It's a metaphor for the Republican party's last presidential campaign. We had better open our eyes and start working together rather than shooting from the hip or the other guys will have the advantage.

Breitbart stated: "The American right is in a heap of trouble in a media age that doesn't shun the goons and liars that have poisoned the political process and won the American presidency by breaking the rules of fair play." His entire premise is that the Republican party and conservatives in general are unschooled with the Web and this, along with a generally better set of moral values, puts us at a disadvantage. I agree with Andrew for the most part but as I stated in my initial response (please read that before firing from the hip), arguing on the Internet is not going to solve anything. It's a diversion. As an issue, it's a red herring but we do seem to be taking the bait, don't we?

Then you understand the concept of divide and conquer. The problem with the Internet is if someone spends a lot of time on it, it becomes the center of, and the arbiter of, that person's reality. But it is a false center and false arbiter; the Web distorts and perverts, it personalizes the most trivial things. The anonymity emboldens the cowardly and hateful. I have to remind myself that when I go out into the real world, of real people, that the real work in this country is not being done by those who surf and comment. It's being done by the hard-working and caring Americans who don't have time for that sort of nonsense. I have to differ with in the notion that a comments section is a place where we can "communicate, gather, and game-plan". It's a place where we can vent, that's all. Real tacticians and strategists work behind closed doors, free of distractions.

I've had to try to remember my debate training from high school. Don't let trolls distract you. Stick to your point and don't let them deflect you. Their talking points are just deflections because the talking point isn't designed to address any specific discussion you have; it's just an attempt to get you chasing some stick they've thrown rather than following up on your topic.

Andrew is not the only one who gets it. I've bookmarked his sites and have commented regularly but he is new to the Internet and to this game. There are plenty of other conservative and libertarian voices who've been out there for a long time; what Andrew is doing differently, though, is taking on the Hollywood liberals in their own back yard and for that, he has earned my support.

Then contribute something worthwhile, rather than trying to ride the bleeding edge of maybe I am conservative, or maybe I'm not. Why should I work with your everything is gray, whishy-washy, can't we all just get along position? Didn't work at all well last time around, did it? I have had enough of RINO politic big tent edge dancing. McCain should have taught us all that by now.
I am in no mood to read about someone acting like an agent provocateur. Declare your intent!

"Obama is a pretentious, pompous, self-righteous, pseudo-intellectual know-it-all."

And those are his "good" qualities…; – )

I'd give anything to hear some of the discussions that took place between him and his Rev. Wright, and Bill ("blow 'em up") Ayers….

Leo & Andrew, first ley me address this to Andrew: I read the entire article and you sound a bit defeatist my friend. Stop it. Right now. Second, I have urged friends and BH-er's to do something that I feel wil have an impact if we get behind it. We conservatives are not going to influence the mods/indies if all we do is have these great discussions here at BH. As terrific as that is. We've got to go to sites like HuffPo & Moveon, etc., register and get in the conversation at those sites. Now we're not going to change the minds of the trolls we debate with over there, but the people who are there just to read the discussion (who we can't see) will be the ones influenced. If, and this is important, our posts remain free of invective, have real facts behind them (posting links to a "fact" is always good), and are based on sound priciples and reasoning. But we have to do it frequently and in numbers. more…

We don't need to pose as something we're not. In fact I think that kind of subterfuge would hurt us. But we need to get to these sites and post our views. The opposition will either (a) attack us like the trolls they are with lies and ad hominem outbursts, in which case the mod/indies will see them for who they are, so we win, or (b) try to defend their positions with their reasoning, which for the majority of the time can't stand up against conservative priciples so we win again. One thing I like to do is to cut a paragraph or two from a particularly good article or Corner post, and put it up on Facebook for all my "friends" to see. I live in NY, lots of lib friends. So I'm trying to get the word out. And we conservatives should be doing this type of thing by the truckload. more…

Don't blame you. And nobody on this blog thinks I'm stupid enough to mess with a Marine. My favorite uncle passed away a couple of years ago. Got his field commission at Iwo, and retired as a chicken colonel. OK, I know, you worked for a living. Semper fi.

Smallywood Scapegoat of the Day: It's the Trolls' faults.

Memo to conservatives whining about liberal "trolls" – did conservative trolls derail liberal blogs and prevent them from winning elections? Not at all.

You're making excuses for your complete inability to win an argument. You lazily relied on manipulation, coercion, intimidation and most especially your RNC Talking Points and now you have no clue how to be persuasive. But I'm sure this troll's comment will be met not with an actual response, but with the standard Small Hollywood namecalling, masculinity attacks and talking points – which are of course Approved Discussion Enhancers as far as you're concerned I'm sure.

Let me put this to you using your own failed comment section rhetoric: if you can't defeat a bunch of liberal trolls, how are you going to defeat Al Qaeda?LOL.

Don't ever call ME pathetic. At least I have pride.

Master of the single entendre — what a superb phrase!
Sorry, but I just had to interrupt the conversation here to note this wonderful play on words! Great one, Buckwheat Picard!

Ideas? Like firing the head of an American auto company? Too late.

'Go back and look at my comments to BH over the past several weeks'

You want us to weed through all the articles to find your comments? This would be much easier if you were registered with Intense Debate. Since you're not, we're not wasting our time. The points we can take away from your comments here are: we are not computer savvy and are child-like, there are just a few unorganized trolls sitting in their basements taunting us – nothing to worry about, and our opinions aren't worth squat and should be done away with entirely. That's team spirit.

also
'Conservatives seem to be new to the Web and as such you are letting the phenomenon of spamming bother you too much.'

This earlier statement contradicts what you state about being a conservative yourself (you didn't say other conservatives or fellow conservatives…).

What are we supposed to conclude from all this.

Yes, he is. Along the same vein; Rush.

Among the things Andrew is doing I think, is trying to light a fire under conservatives who may have some influence in countering the constant drumbeat of little liberal / leftie comments that seem to always come out as comedy or as “a given” of some kind (i.e. some “evil-doer” in a movie has a picture of Ronald Reagan on the wall or his desk). Like I’ve written earlier, they have been at this for decades. If this is a “war of ideas”, what’s our counter-attack going to be?

I nearly fell over when the female character in the TV show “Dollhouse” picked up a gun, and when her superior asked; “you know how to use that?” she replied while cocking it; “I have 4 brothers…none of them Democrats.” Why did I nearly fall over? Because those kinds of little “push backs” in a cultural setting are so few and far-between.

Look what Obama is doing; he’s out there every day trying to counter any opposition that his crew finds in the media. Putting comments about his abilities or philosophies aside, that tactic needs to be countered by US more strongly and consistently.

I’m no political “wonk”, but Michael Steele needs to be an orchestra conductor and get all the different “instruments” (congress, talk radio, blogs and others) playing the same tune like Newt did with the “Contract with America”. Of COURSE I don’t mean we’re robotically saying the same exact thing, it just seems so unorganized and random to me right now.

Rush was the first conservative who put liberal ideas up for ridicule and humor as part of his show. Other talkers have done so here and there, but not as consistently as he has.

The point is, their decades-old tactic seems to be to simply laugh conservatism off in movies, TV, radio, “Meet The Press”, whatever. It just irritates me that they’ve gone unchallenged for so long…and I don’t mean unchallenged on the “exchange of ideas” front, I mean the cultural front. I hope this site and all of you are signs of change.

Rant concluded.

My point exactly…ignore them.

I remember last week someone coined the code word 'Robo' (trying single quotes) to refer to said group of chosen people. At least I think it was Robo. I'm sure we could vote on a different code if Robo is no good.

Potato chips meet Charibdys. For every troll that gets digested, two more pop up to take his place. The best bet is still to starve them out. I know it's hard, and I've fallen into their traps numerous times. Only engage in debate if they have a brain. If they don't, there's no point. You won't change anyone's mind if they lack a mind to change.

*cough*hack*west virginia senators*blurk*

If a Republican served his local KKK at any capacity, you know the news would be all over it. But ol' Mr Byrd gets a free pass….

… We have to take back the Universities.

Good luck. In my experience, teachers either preached from the left hand side of the classroom, or they stuck to the material and you didn't know where they stood. Some tactful and reasonable people vote lefty, unfortunately. I can't really think of a class where it would be appropriate to confront the conservatism vs liberalism argument head on. I know the best way to get a student to think for themselves is by asking the right questions, (aka Socratic Method) but classes these days just don't seem to encourage that. Unless the class is "unteachable" like in Freedom Writers or To Sir, With Love, you can't really teach anyone anything. You can only assign work to be completed.

I don't want to say "It's useless, so why bother." We need as many conservatives as possible in positions to teach our youth. It's just not going to be an easy win.

"…….eight long years to destroy the presidency – and the humanity – of George W. Bush."

Yes they went straight for his humanity, in some ways worse than destroying the presidency. But Bush is still as human as ever.

Conservatives will have to get more involved with internet content, but of course many Work.

I've lived in in one of the most liberal districts in the country my entire life and I can tell you that they are shallow and uninformed. Let them whine and spit out their cliches — hey are the best argument for conservative going.

Maybe some type of codified verbage is needed. Like the Catholic church did when under seige. Or even Communists with their `fellow traveler' term.
Something malable yet recognizable by those in the know…

Don't ever call ME pathetic. At least I have pride.

Pride. Something to take when it has been earned, yet expensive to have.

If you're not willing to pick up nickels from the street, it's hard to justify chasing down dollars in the wind.

And I stop for pennies. I found a wheat cent a few months back. How lucky is that?!

I think this is more a problem because of "compassionate" conservatism than anything else. Government grew and people didn't really see their lives get better, mostly cause of said expansion in government. The internet is a mostly populist mechanism and because of that it reflects a different grouping of Americans than those that actually make it to the polls. All that being said, now that Obama has had a chance and will continue to have chances to drive this country into the ground, once the results become realized the "proletariat" will turn on him and his tote bag carrying base with great fury. We are already seeing it. All of this has happened before and will happen again and again.

On my blog I just moderate comments, that way I can delete any trolls and they are never published. Simple.

Suzie, fear not. I am with you, not against you! The point of Breitbart's editorial is precisely what I was saying; conservatives are relatively new to the Web. This is not news. It has trumpeted from every liberal network and media outlet that the voters who pushed Obama over the top are "web-savvy". McCain was made to look like a Luddite and fool who couldn't figure out how to use a computer, while Barack packed a Blackberry. Now, unless and until conservatives figure out how to counter this web-assault that Breitbart has so clearly delineated in his piece, we'll be apparently be relegated to slinging hash at one another. As far as stating intent, no less a personage than Hugh Hewitt has disable comments. My response to Mr. Breitbart's piece can be summed up like this: I think he is a tad naive to the Web and he's placing far too much weight on comments. This culture war he alludes to cannot be won in a war of words on the Internet.

You'd prefer secantial?

I know it is aggravating but we must not let them win. Continue to post your comments and ignore the idiots. I enjoy butting heads so trolls are welcomed in my opinion because it only sharpens my witts. I look forward to making them look like the idiots they are. Don't ever give them that kind of power. Just type with a smile and when you get to a point where they irritate you, reply as they do. Lets make a sport out of irritating trolls.

As they said on Space Quest, "Never give up, never surrender." aack aaack aaaack.

That's why I didn't sign up for IntenseDebate.

You were smart. I thought it looked cool, and it allowed you to track your own comments as well as others. The price for that convenience is too high. I should probably back out, but it has been getting a little better, and I'm learning some of the things to avoid. It's that random moderation that really drives me nuts.

==== I also think that policing message boards (for members of either ideology) can come dangerously close to throwing fingers in ears and humming loudly so as not to hear anything but the party line.====

Doctor, keep one thing in mind, Conservatives cannot escape the liberal view while liberals can completely insulate themselves without ever having to read/hear Conservative views. The fact of the matter is we already know their arguments better than they do and explaining to them why they’re wrong goes in one ear and out the other. All that’s left at that point is mockery.

I'm with you too, and the rest of those posted above you. I have not registered yet because, personally, I don't know much about it. I don't have a desk job, so I'm only online for a short while. If someone could give me some pointers, I'd appreciate it. LawhawkSF was kind enough to share some tips on one of the post subjects, and I thanked him for it. It had to do with Zo's Card Checkin' video.

And yes, definitely NOT OVER. Not by a long shot. Hey Zo, can I borrow your bat if I run out of ammo?

This is useless. Just use Alinsky's rules against the liberals and CINOs.

You see the problem with trying to go to "their sites" and fight back in the same fashion is that most of us have jobs and/or lives and and so don't have the time to dedicate to tactics like this. I mean, I know I can only muster the time to read/post on BH in my few spare moments. I think this is the first thing I've actually had a spare moment to reply to in several weeks.

Exactly right, more conservatives have a job and a life for that matter. Very difficult to combat people who have the time to stand on a sidewalk with a sign that reads "911 was an inside job"

Just got back from there, and apart from the usual knee-jerk stuff, there are some pretty intelligent comments.

Your post just struck me in a very negative way. Very pessimistic. There are some of us out here that have found kindred spirits through a site like Big Hollywood. There are bonds being built, this is one aspect of a whole movement. I would hope that AB wouldn't silence all the voices just because of some bad apples.

Nice that they're just too chicken to come over here and comment. Instead they have to turn Andrews views into a whole other article in order to get comments. Hi five Andrew for giving those morons some food for thought.

And look at this poor example of a sentence structure by robby_g:

"Sadly, its also a great spot to go to get a very sense of how much rampant racism comes out in America today on the internet. Not surprising, but disgusting regardless. Its exciting to see my me and my fellow trolls there have gotten some recognition."

I was just over at HotAir trying to find honest discussion about Norm Coleman's newest defeat and 30% of the commentary there is Liberal–registered –sometimes I think there is more liberals registered to comment on HotAir than conservatives. I think it's why I don't got there often–So registration is a doubled edged sword especially if you never open it more more to register.

…because the last six or seven presidential elections, more than 40% of the voters were not supporting the candidate who won.

I think you will find that it goes further back than that. So what? It is a healthy thing. Only dictators have 99,9% support. I wonder if you were so keen on unity when Bush was president. But it almost doesn´t matter. The president is not the nation – neither is Congress – they are suposed to work for us. So here is my assessment: America now has a radical administration lead by a socialist who wants to break and reshape the nation. I consider that an act of insane hubris. He has no mandate to do that, or to pile up incredibly amounts of debt which will impoverish us and our children. In the face of this assault, we do not need unity. We do not need an exchange of viewpoints. Believe me, I have not encountered a fresh liberal viewpoint in a decade. I have heard it all before.

What we need, my friend, is resistance. And it´s my darn right and duty as a citizen to resist when someone wants a "clean break from our troubled past", including constitutional government.

Goolge. . .

Hegelian Method

Delphi Technique

IOW . . . New Party Astroturfing

Debate is not the intent. Group-think is.

Btw, remember Barry’s break-out groups on health-care and the economy?

Your first three statements are absolutely correct, and far too important to dismiss with "So what?" It is a very healthy thing. Was I keen on national unity when Bush was president? Yes, but from the other end of the telescope. I quietly pointed out, when I could, that he was wrong to assume a vast mandate to remake America in his own image — his margin of victory wasn't that big, and my unscientific poll, driving a bus four ten-hour shifts a week, suggested that he was put over the top by voters who didn't make up their minds until the morning of the election. He was so lucky to be running against John Kerry — not because of Kerry's record, but because he was a darn fool who wouldn't run honestly on his record. Any elected president has to recognize that they have a slight edge to govern a little differently than their opponent would have, but they have to stay within bounds that a good part of the opposition won't be too badly upset about. Obama, to his credit, has openly noted that 47% of the voters went for McCain.

Your evaluation of what we have now is pure hallucination, or perhaps even wishful thinking. You may want resistance, but a healthy majority give the current president their approval, so don't rush to the barricades until that changes. (It may, or it may not.) I'm a fan of Eugene V. Debs, the socialist from that left coast metropolis, Terre Haute, Indiana, who won over a million votes for president. I know the difference between Debs and Obama. America is being led by a pragmatist with little ideology, who will disappoint Nancy Pelosi more than he will you, but there won't be much she can do about it. One more point on resistance: hanging around discussions like this, you may delude yourself that you don't need anyone's viewpoint but a clone of your own thinking. If you step out into the real world, you will find plenty of viewpoints you need to change before you can build effective resistance. Hitler and Lenin both lost the first time. When they won, they had, however temporarily, won considerable forces over to their side. In America, you have to do even better than that, because, as designed by our founders, our governments have power diffused in many ways. You can't just take the center, and you can't just govern from the fringes. You have to win hearts and minds.

I don't know where you picked up that I'm a leftist. I am merely relaying to the blog-plasma @large what little I know about the tactics employed by the left in this past election cycle. Just pickin' up a metaphorical rock so I can watch the marxist vermin scurry in the light of day. I despise the cowardly communists too. People here in the states are not generally familiar w/ this terminology and it is my mission to inform and inspire the basic curiosity required to counter it's insidious aims. The only good Che' was aborted.

It's unethical in it's dishonesty and it diminishes the fabric of open, honest debate in a representative Republic. The Founders were clear in that proper governance requires responsibility. Why do you think perjury is punishable by imprisonment? Look into the Delphi Technique for further background on my general point.

So Obama has openly noted what everyone knows. Bravo. And he is showing his contempt for those 47% every day. But why bring up Hitler and Lenin? Both never won clear majorities, they won by manipulation and by being thugs. If they are your examples for successful politicians, that´s nice for them. The people paid the price. As an informed citizen, I have no need for clever, overbearing politicians. I want honest, humble, patriotic ones. A good salesman can sell you a lemon. When you are voting, you are not hiring a salesman, a new best friend or a savior. Once you get that, you are fit to be a citizen of a Republic.

You live in Europe? I'm sorry, I thought I was talking to a fellow citizen of the USA. Well, yes, I know, maybe you are, citizens of one nation do live in another, but it puts a different perspective on your calls for "resistance." You want those remaining in the USA to "resist" while you feel smug about not being a lefty in Europe?

Economic laws… are there any? Economics is not, and never has been, a science. Most economists are ideologically driven. All economists make use of statistics in the manner Disraeli dissected "lies, damned lies, and statistics." You can prove anything with statistics, such as "see, my theory works" or "See, your theory is wrong." There is nothing natural about an economy. It is artificial. It is man-made, not a natural event, nor ordained by God, except for bans on usury and condemnations of people who accumulate too much weatlh (Amos, Isaiah, Nehemiah) — and none of that is "realistic to economists. Sometimes some economic policies work, sort of. By their fruits shall we know them, until it turns out that something else is needed. Laissez faire does indeed produce wealth, for a time, but it ends up being also a license for robbery, and produced bubbles, which are painful when they burst.

As a student of both what passes for "liberal" and what passes for "conservative" in the degenerate media-driven politics of our era, I guarantee you that leftists would go into apoplectic shock if you started posting notices about Obama's "Civilian Defense Force" getting its brown shirts soon. They really wouldn't get behind rounding up much of anybody either. Of course, this would be one of the easier lies to dispel. Would anyone understand if I described Ronald Reagan as a classic Gladstonian liberal? (He had more in common with Gladstone than Disraeli). For that matter, today's conservatives would be snubbed by the original federalists. And today's liberals would be unrecognizable to Gladstone, an advocate of laissez-faire capitalism. If anyone tried to revive that 19th century newspaper, The Red Republican, would anyone get the joke, considering the colors on the map on election night in 2000? That's what social workers do. Many social workers are liberals, but not all liberals are social workers. In case its not obvious, I believe that when Bill Clinton said we need to end welfare as we know it, he didn't go far enough: the program should be to end social work as we know it. Wouldn't people here be upset if someone posted that Rush Limbaugh's "National Resistance Army" would get its brown shirts soon, and that training officers from a similarly named organization in Uganda were coming to teach the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy how to enslave children and teach them to cut off their parents' arms?

Yeah, them and the conservatives. Anyone who identifies themselves with a well-worn label is either looking for someone to tell them what to think (ditto), or is looking for a chance to lay down the party line to everyone else. Political correctness comes in all colors, and its always a dead end.

What eye bleeding drivel you post.

You obfuscate like a octopus uses an ink cloud.

The Declaration of Independence 'is' codified law in the USA.

I suggest you give it a fine perusal since today's Prograzis choose to continually cheat, slime and smear the electoral & political process in order to implement a provably failed marxist ideology, an ideology shared by both nazis and communists.

I would be remiss not to mention the 1st American Revolution was began by a mere 3% of the population taking an appropriate stand.

Americans will tolerate only so much coerced collectivism.

Btw, you are one wordy mudder-fricker you mouth-breathing statist.

I've said that all along. The New Party Prograzi movement has to resort to lies, guile, duplicitousness, intrigue, crisis. . . You get the point. All we have to do is be mildly amusing in curt, factual statements, then move on. Facts are a funny thing. Brevity is the soul of wit.

Great description in your 1st line. I almost split a gut.

Great call to arms. Inspiring.

First of all, I am in Europe because I have a job. Second, I am not talking about economics as a science. I am talking about empirical knowledge about wealth creation. I´m beginning to suspect you are too young to know what I mean.

My dear sir, you write like a liberal. You spout a fountain of insults when you hear anything that contradicts the politically correct party line, but you offer no facts, no reasoning, nothing that would persuade an undecided citizen to back your position. No wonder Gordo mis-took you for a leftist. You must be a troll, hanging out here to discredit all conservatives with the inane idiocy of your artificial rhetoric.

John,

For the sake of our Republic, please give some attention to the following.

Please look into http://www.PatDollard.com/ | http://www.snooperreport.com/ & their respective blog radio shows for extensive information for beating back the marxist hordes. There is also news made during their shows. These guys are the real deal. Dollard is Vet and Snooper is an ex-Spook.

Make no mistake, the left is organized on par with military standards and the right must be well aware of this fact or we will get our asses handed to us. This struggle has moved far beyond the norms of politics of days gone by. Fire must be fought with fire.

These gentlemen have dissected the tactics of the left and have developed an expensive network along with tactics and strategies to successfully counteract the well-developed schemes of the left. Their verbiage is not for the meek and are wholly unapologetic in their approach.

They are exactly the patriots we are in need of and their knowledge must be extensively disseminated.

Thank You,
D

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